Processor Speeds of PW3 & the New PW4 ???

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by FrustratedReader

The limit to performance on a mainly text with static images eReader is really the eInk type display. Not the CPU.

CPU speed impacts such things as the speed at which books are indexed. The Oasis 2 (which has a much faster CPU than the PW) indexes books significantly more rapidly as a consequence.

[NiLuJe]

Well, technically, it has a dual core CPU, but each core is pretty much the same as those ones[*] . Meaning indexing is probably the one thing where it'll have a significant impact, but it's going to be much more subtle in day to day operation (hence the lack of marketing fanfare around that fact).

That said, it's definitely non-zero, the Kindle firmware is designed in a way that lends itself fairly well to parallelism, as far as these things go.

EDIT:[*] Scratch that, the i.MX7D is two A7, while the i.MX6SL(L) is one A9. So, not exactly the same CPU . The A7 should be more power-efficient, at the expense of performance. Think low-power Intel notebook chips. Mainly a newer, finer process.

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by NiLuJe

Well, technically, it has a dual core CPU, but each core is pretty much the same as those ones . Meaning indexing is probably the one thing where it'll have a significant impact, but it's going to be much more subtle in day to day operation (hence the lack of marketing fanfare around that fact).

That said, it's definitely non-zero, the Kindle firmware is designed in a way that lends itself fairly well to parallelism, as far as these things go.

EDIT: Scratch that, the i.MX7D is two A7, while the i.MX6SL(L) is one A9. So, not exactly the same CPU . The A7 should be more power-efficient, at the expense of performance.

That may all be true, but the KOA2 can turn pages much faster than the Voyage even though it has a lot more text on screen.

[tomsem]

Originally Posted by NiLuJe

@tomsem: Freescale is no more, NXP bought 'em. That's the meaning behind that extra L between parentheses in my message (i.MX6SL (SoloLite) vs. i.MX6SLL).

The CPU is essentially the same, it's just a slightly different hardware revision, post-merger.

I'm not even actually sure they really moved to SLL boards (c.f., this post).

Compare that to the PW2, first device to move to an i.MX6:

Processor       : ARMv7 Processor rev 10 (v7l)
BogoMIPS        : 787.55
Features        : swp half thumb fastmult vfp edsp neon vfpv3 
CPU implementer : 0x41
CPU architecture: 7
CPU variant     : 0x2
CPU part        : 0xc09
CPU revision    : 10

Hardware        : Freescale i.MX 6SoloLite based Wario Board
Revision        : 60000

Thanks!

[NiLuJe]

@j.p.s: I've yet to see a Kindle that's actually sluggish at its main use case: reading . On the other hand, look at a Kobo trying to struggle through an ePub, that's fun (not).

(Yeah, yeah, apple, oranges: the format itself is freakishly terrible to optimize for, especially when you're beholden to Adobe's basically unmaintained rendering engine. Things are generally okay-ish when you drop the Adobe bit of the equation by switching to kePubs. Note that, yes, it did get a wee bit better over the years. I still highly recommend not trying to use a Kobo right next to a Kindle ).

Speaking of Kobo, they *did* move to i.MX6SLL boards (from NTX, as usual for Kobo), a few months ago (basically since the Clara). They did not go with an i.MX7D for their foray intay Oasis-territory, the Forma.

TL;DR: Nothing's ever perfect. You just have to choose what you're willing to compromise on.

[Barbara1955]

You would think that it was fast enough Not to lockup during normal reading. Last one I had that lockup was still locked up when the tech got it at Amazon!! They refunded my money. I gave up switched to Kobo Aura its been over 2 years no problems. Recently I got a Kobo Clara HD... so far so good. I now have over 5,000 ebooks & running out of space on it... 1000 from Amazon account. Which is why I was asking about the PW4. At $120 I can get the PW4 with 32 gigs storage & play my audibles too! But all I can for see is the aggravation of Freezing problems! UGH

[j.p.s]

Originally Posted by NiLuJe

@j.p.s: I've yet to see a Kindle that's actually sluggish at its main use case: reading . On the other hand, look at a Kobo trying to struggle through an ePub, that's fun (not).

I'm not saying anything is wrong or deficient about Voyage page turn speed, just that nevertheless the Oasis 2 does it much faster.

But what does that have to do with Kobo?

Originally Posted by NiLuJe

(Yeah, yeah, apple, oranges: the format itself is freakishly terrible to optimize for, especially when you're beholden to Adobe's basically unmaintained rendering engine. Things are generally okay-ish when you drop the Adobe bit of the equation by switching to kePubs. Note that, yes, it did get a wee bit better over the years. I still highly recommend not trying to use a Kobo right next to a Kindle ).

Speaking of Kobo, they *did* move to i.MX6SLL boards (from NTX, as usual for Kobo), a few months ago (basically since the Clara). They did not go with an i.MX7D for their foray intay Oasis-territory, the Forma.

TL;DR: Nothing's ever perfect. You just have to choose what you're willing to compromise on.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by Barbara1955

Recently I got a Kobo Clara HD... so far so good. I now have over 5,000 ebooks & running out of space on it... 1000 from Amazon account. Which is why I was asking about the PW4. At $120 I can get the PW4 with 32 gigs storage & play my audibles too! But all I can for see is the aggravation of Freezing problems! UGH

With current deals on flash-based storage, you can upgrade the Clara to 128GB for $20 or so.

[Barbara1955]

Originally Posted by ilovejedd

With current deals on flash-based storage, you can upgrade the Clara to 128GB for $20 or so.

Easy IF you know how ... I don't.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by Barbara1955

Easy IF you know how ... I don't.

I didn't know how either but there are very easy to follow guides on the Kobo subforum and YouTube. Surprisingly easy to do. I did an upgrade to 64GB on a Glo HD but from reports, the Clara is much the same.

Granted, I use my Kindle more. I like its ergonomics and reading software better.

[NiLuJe]

@j.p.s: That was mainly a 5 AM brain-xref because of the earlier CPU discussion ;D.

IIRC, that's a ~1.5MPix to ~2.1MPix jump (take that with a grain of salt, I'm terrible at maths ;D) from the Voyage to the KOA2.
Hard to tell where the difference might be: sheer pixel moving might? eInk speedups? More efficient text layout/rendering?

The only thing I can say if that the eInk controller saw a major hardware revision on the KOA2. But the different processor adds another variable to the mix .

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

I'm not saying anything is wrong or deficient about Voyage page turn speed, just that nevertheless the Oasis 2 does it much faster.

But what does that have to do with Kobo?

I am not sure how exactly the Voyage used to do it (and I no longer have a functioning to test), but the Oasis 2 prerenders the next page(s) ahead of time. The way it looks like about a whole chapter. If you flip through as fast as you can, then the Oasis stutters a relatively long time at a chapter mark where a full refresh is triggered. Fine, so it is the flash, you might think? No it is not. Go to the end of a chapter and wait a little bit for Oasis to catch up (maybe 2 or 3 seconds) and then turn the page, it is near instant again. There is no delay from pushing button to do the refresh. In the normal use case when you actually read the words before turning the page you never have to wait.

So the bottleneck is the cpu and rendering the page on the Oasis 2, and not the eink itself. The speed improvements over a Voyage can be safely attributed to a faster eink controller if the Voyage also prerenders. And here the comparison with Kobo becomes relevant. If all Kindles are snappier in comparison, it is very possible that they always been prerendering at least the next page. Apparently a Kobo does not prerender pages, but does them on the fly for standard epubs and maybe even kepubs.

[NiLuJe]

Nearly everybody should already be pre-rendering at the very least the prev/next page.

[Barbara1955]

Originally Posted by j.p.s

I'm not saying anything is wrong or deficient about Voyage page turn speed, just that nevertheless the Oasis 2 does it much faster.

But what does that have to do with Kobo?

Nothing .... did you even bother to read my post?

The Question is about the PW3 speed compared to the new PW4

[DuckieTigger]

Originally Posted by NiLuJe

Nearly everybody should already be pre-rendering at the very least the prev/next page.

Should. And everybody should then turn pages at about the same speed - as fast as the specific eink allows. Please don't tell me it is technically hard and slow to push a ready made framebuffer into the graphics controller.