Defeating Amazon's defeating of back matter

[Notjohn]

I mostly read and mostly write non-fiction, and I am one of those obsessives who want to read the endnotes. (The best academics often put funny stuff in the notes that they wouldn't dream of including in the text.) But as soon as I reach the endnotes or bibliography or postscript, Amazon tries to distract me with adverts for similar books.

So: I like to end a book with an advert of my own, for a related book of mine. I am afraid that Jeff Bezos over-rides this section. Do we have any notion of how he is able to interrupt the flow of the book? Is it done through keywords like Notes, Sources, Bibliography, Epilogue, so that if we avoid those triggers the book will continue with breaking for a word from the sponsor?

Thanks for any illumination!

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Notjohn

I mostly read and mostly write non-fiction, and I am one of those obsessives who want to read the endnotes. (The best academics often put funny stuff in the notes that they wouldn't dream of including in the text.) But as soon as I reach the endnotes or bibliography or postscript, Amazon tries to distract me with adverts for similar books.

So: I like to end a book with an advert of my own, for a related book of mine. I am afraid that Jeff Bezos over-rides this section. Do we have any notion of how he is able to interrupt the flow of the book? Is it done through keywords like Notes, Sources, Bibliography, Epilogue, so that if we avoid those triggers the book will continue with breaking for a word from the sponsor?

Thanks for any illumination!

Got NCX?

Hitch

[HarryT]

Please don't do this. The very last thing I want to see in a book (and I don't mean "right at the end of the book" when I say that...) is a "message from a sponsor". If I saw an advert in a book it would be the last book I'd buy from that author.

[Notjohn]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Please don't do this. The very last thing I want to see in a book (and I don't mean "right at the end of the book" when I say that...) is a "message from a sponsor". If I saw an advert in a book it would be the last book I'd buy from that author.

You don't buy any Kindle books, then? Most of those I have downloaded end with an advert for related books, and it often comes before I have finished with the book.

@Hitch: yes, I have an NCX file, but I don't see what that has to do with Jeff Bezos's ability to interrupt my reading of a book with his Other Books Like This advert.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Notjohn

You don't buy any Kindle books, then? Most of those I have downloaded end with an advert for related books, and it often comes before I have finished with the book.

Those aren't what I'd regard as "sponsorship" messages, which are what the OP appears to be talking about. Naturally I'd expect any book to list the author's other works. When I see the word "sponsorship" it means (to me) an advert from some external company who's helped pay for the production of the item. "This book was brought to you by Joe's Barber's Shop".

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Notjohn

You don't buy any Kindle books, then? Most of those I have downloaded end with an advert for related books, and it often comes before I have finished with the book.

@Hitch: yes, I have an NCX file, but I don't see what that has to do with Jeff Bezos's ability to interrupt my reading of a book with his Other Books Like This advert.

NJ: If I were a betting woman, I'd say that the NCX holds the key. It's not hard to program some sort of simple algo to look for filenames, esp. in professionally made or published books, e.g., "author.html/xhtml" or such. OR, hell, look for the first file that is6isn't named Chapter after chapter 1 or chap1 or.... Crap, the programmer dudes here can tell you 100 ways to do that.

Htch

[Sella174]

Originally Posted by Hitch

NJ: If I were a betting woman, I'd say that the NCX holds the key. It's not hard to program some sort of simple algo to look for filenames, esp. in professionally made or published books, e.g., "author.html/xhtml" or such. OR, hell, look for the first file that is6isn't named Chapter after chapter 1 or chap1 or.... Crap, the programmer dudes here can tell you 100 ways to do that.

Yeah, let's open that NCX file with a text editor and code it the way Amazon wants it, instead of how IDPF says we should do an ePub.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Sella174

Yeah, let's open that NCX file with a text editor and code it the way Amazon wants it, instead of how IDPF says we should do an ePub.

I'm sorry, Sella, but...why do you think those two things are ANY different? You keep saying all these things, about how MOBI and ePUB are so different, etc., when those of us who do this all the time know that they aren't. And why on earth you think a MOBI NCX is dramatically or even a teeny bit different than an ePUB NCX...I don't know. Even the Guide items are, for all intents and purposes, the same. Only the meta is, MAYBE, different. (The OPF meta is different, vis: the cover.)

The NCX in our MOBI files is exactly the same as the NCX in our ePUBs. No damn difference.

Hitch

[Sella174]

I'm not saying they (ePub and mobi) are different at the source level. I just find it interesting that it is expected that a 100% the-way-I-want-it ePub must also convert to a 100% the-way-I-want-it mobi. I've been reading a few threads and there are lots of complaints about the conversion from ePub to mobi not going too smoothly. Must be a reason for it, huh? Subtle differences in the files and tags is my guess.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Sella174

I'm not saying they (ePub and mobi) are different at the source level. I just find it interesting that it is expected that a 100% the-way-I-want-it ePub must also convert to a 100% the-way-I-want-it mobi. I've been reading a few threads and there are lots of complaints about the conversion from ePub to mobi not going too smoothly. Must be a reason for it, huh? Subtle differences in the files and tags is my guess.

OR, maybe, it's people who use automated tools like Calibre, or other quick-n-dirty methods, that don't know the code, at all, expecting them to "just work?" That tends to be what I see, mostly.

Fundamentally, there aren't any differences. If you get to the point that you want to use CERTAIN tags, for example, a keep-together, let's say, to keep a caption with an image, sure--that won't do jack on a MOBI. Honestly, it won't do jack on 99% of all dedicated eReaders. Will it work on an iPad tablet's dedicated eReading software, iBooks? Apparently--but that's mostly it.

For a basic ebook--fiction, anthologies, even non-fiction that doesn't have advanced layout--there's no difference in the files and tags. You may want to go over those posts/threads again, and take a harder look at the questioner/complainer. We get people in the Sigil forum complaining that it's HORRIBLE!, because it's not a GUI ePUB maker. Does that make Sigil horrible--or does it just mean that they have no idea what software they're using? Same sort of thing, IME.

Hitch

[Sella174]

Originally Posted by Hitch

OR, maybe, it's people who use automated tools like Calibre, or other quick-n-dirty methods, that don't know the code, at all, expecting them to "just work?" That tends to be what I see, mostly.

Yeah, as I recently said in another thread, nearly all the HOWTO’s on the interwebs regarding the creation of mobi’s entail the Sigil-created-ePub-converted-by-Calibre method. I suppose that is the easiest for the general public … It’s just funny how that thread exploded into 3 pages of pushing the same philosophy - albeit not by you, Hitch.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Sella174

Yeah, as I recently said in another thread, nearly all the HOWTO’s on the interwebs regarding the creation of mobi’s entail the Sigil-created-ePub-converted-by-Calibre method. I suppose that is the easiest for the general public … It’s just funny how that thread exploded into 3 pages of pushing the same philosophy - albeit not by you, Hitch.

It's a grave responsibility being the old cranky one.

Hitch

[Notjohn]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Those aren't what I'd regard as "sponsorship" messages, which are what the OP appears to be talking about. Naturally I'd expect any book to list the author's other works. When I see the word "sponsorship" it means (to me) an advert from some external company who's helped pay for the production of the item. "This book was brought to you by Joe's Barber's Shop".

But I am the OP, and I said nothing about sponsorship.

Indeed, sponsored ads are precisely what I would like to defeat by subduing Mr Berzos's recommendations.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Notjohn

But I am the OP, and I said nothing about sponsorship.

Er, yes you did:

Is it done through keywords like Notes, Sources, Bibliography, Epilogue, so that if we avoid those triggers the book will continue with breaking for a word from the sponsor?

Emphasis mine.

[ekbell]

I see the problem! The OP wrote 'with' when they meant 'without'!