Hisense A5C, A5 Pro CC, color e-ink phones

[SleepWithMachine]

Full review from good e reader is online

looks very promising,
unfortunately they don't say anything about screen protection, guess that's not gorilla glass but just plastic

[Yoko22]

"Full review", his full review is so minimal that I would call that an unboxing or a preview. At least we saw a bit of the device but how much did he said in that review, and much did he keep for himself because otherwise some might not buy on his website afterward.
I wonder if the reading of text on that device is as good as the monochrome one.

[SleepWithMachine]

Originally Posted by Yoko22

At least we saw a bit of the device but how much did he said in that review, and much did he keep for himself because otherwise some might not buy on his website afterward.

I don't think that was his intention

In the end, it's just another Android phone. Regarding the color e-ink screen, that cannot be demonstrated properly in a video anyway.

[Yoko22]

Even if he can't demonstrate in the video, he can still say it, like: "I have compared the A5 with the A5C and it seems the reading on the A5 felt smoother and easier"

Also there is something I don't understand, why the A5 pro CC is the same price as the normal model, isn't the pro version supposed to better equipped?
https://www.cect-shop.com/en/smartph...ufacturer=1430
There is a $70 difference between the A5 and A5 pro but not for the color version.

[Tar]

A5 Pro Color is not for sale yet.

The price is likely a placeholder one.

I would expect it to change when the A5 Pro color is actually released.

[Yoko22]

It's quite a big rise in price compared to the JD website though, I thought they had like a 20-30$ difference but it seems price can difference can go up by 80$. It seems preferable to buy directly from them with that big price difference.

[mdp]

I am confused by some posts at the beginning of the thread.
It is apparent that the device does not contain Google Play nor the Google Play Services. Ok.
Some seem to say that applications cannot be installed to the Hisense A5C. This sounds extremely strange: was that literal or does that include strong assumptions?
I install applications on my devices with
`adb install myapplication.apk`
and no other method really. And many of my devices have never seen the light of the Internet - which is no hindrance to software installation.
This is supposed to work right? The Hisense products have a developer mode, and the ability to install software, like all the rest of Android devices [I ever tried], right?

And that software normally can be installed on Hisense devices is what I read from Question Mark:

Originally Posted by Question Mark

As for Google Play, I have learned to live quite happily without it on my A5. Sideloading the apps I need has proved quite easy.

[Question Mark]

Originally Posted by mdp

I install applications on my devices with
`adb install myapplication.apk`
and no other method really. And many of my devices have never seen the light of the Internet - which is no hindrance to software installation.
This is supposed to work right? The Hisense products have a developer mode, and the ability to install software, like all the rest of Android devices [I ever tried], right?

Although I haven't used that method to install third party apps, it should work. There is very definitely a Developer Mode and the device works much like any other Android tablet or phone which I have ever used.

I've simply used places like F-Droid to install the apps I need. Very easy to do, but perhaps not quite as safe as your method. However, my A5 is very seldom ever connected to the internet, nor used much as a phone. I got it mainly as an ultra portable ereader and now use it much more than my Onyx devices unless I am reading a PDF.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by Question Mark

Although I haven't used that method to install third party apps, it should work. There is very definitely a Developer Mode and the device works much like any other Android tablet or phone which I have ever used. // I've simply used places like F-Droid to install the apps I need.

That is good to know. So there should be no such thing as "you cannot install applications" on it (I cannot at the moment search for the exact quotes).

Originally Posted by Question Mark

Very easy to do, but perhaps not quite as safe as your method

My method is safe in the regard, that you can build your own repository of applications, and the right versions, so you can fulfill the basic hope of "having them", and of being able to install even if you happened to have no Internet (which is not granted infrastructure), and you can install the version that you deem more appropriate (and there could be loads of examples: this one introduced effects that would make Timothy Leary scream, that one introduced a decupleton of adware, thot one removed all the features and only left a button with a small 'MINIMALISM' label at the bottom...)

Originally Posted by Question Mark

However, my A5 is very seldom ever connected to the internet, nor used much as a phone. I got it mainly as an ultra portable ereader and now use it much more than my Onyx devices unless I am reading a PDF.

I hope you tried the emotion of installing Orux Maps on it, load some map in offline-mode (as per the note just above), turn the GPS on and take some good walk in some well chosen area... ; )

(EDIT: Which would be one of the reasons why the colour e-ink phone kind of makes me wonder if... But - I am trying to understand how colour is managed - if the resolution is purposely downgraded, 300dpi to 100dpi, in the wrong parts of the rendering, an ugly mess could result. It should be seen, high definition pictures would be needed)

[mdp]

Originally Posted by Yoko22

I wonder if the reading of text on that device is as good as the monochrome one.

Probably yes and no and no.

The displays, I assume, are the same, but for the superimposed colour filter.

Greyscale Update would have anything rendered on the 1440x720x4bit matrix. BUT, the colour filter is there, and it must disturb a bit the image... That is like having a thin colour-thick curtain over your standard e-reader.

AND, the rendering may not be the usual - it depends on how it is engineered, and this matter is not perfectly clear. If the system thinks it has to display greyscale, it will go filling the 1440x720x4bit as usual. But it may think that it has to render colour, and for that it will use an unbelievable amount of dots, given the microscopic details of its Kaleido as I have seen it. In fact, normally I would guess 4 dots per coloured pixel, but this filter uses more tinted bars per EPD dot! According to goodereader.com, it uses a whopping 9, and that is weird to say the least.
So it depends on what the following from Michael Kozlowski means in practice (because what is key here is: when/where does the device decide to render taking colour into account, and when/where does it render as usual):

Let’s talk about use case scenarios on the Hisense A5c. Say you are reading a standard ebook, the cover art on the first page will be in color and the display resolution will be at 100 PPI. When you turn to a page that only has black text on a white background it will display all of the content at 300 PPI, so text will be razor sharp. PDF rendering engines will display PDF files as an image, because that is basically what they are. These files will basically just display 4,096 colors at 100 PPI. If the PDF if a scanlation or was just made into B&W with no colors, it will display as normal. App icons will be at 100 PPI, and ditto with the color UI of the apps.

[mdp]

This is from a video I saw (see attach).

Oddly, Kaleido uses three dots big filter stripes.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

A page refresh of 136ms means that page turns should be only just noticeable

A2 mode means, in theory, 125ms. But that is only theory, as on e.g. the display modules of the hi-res Onyx Max I counted less than 8fps (6½? I cannot remember).

But of course we are talking about A2, which you visit from time to time but do nor marry. Beware of modes which are not Greyscale Update and promise much but do not tell (or show) you the drawbacks.

[mdp]

Originally Posted by orebmur

Do i really own a device if i can't install or remove stuff as i please?

<ot>
Is it satisfactory to have a device on which you cannot really `dd` / install NATURALLY whatever OS you may want to run on it, with particular regard to more vetted ones.

(No.)

<bad feelings>I am currently because of an accident using a backup device that uses Android +n , instead of my usual Android 0. Oh, the very. many. things. they have broken. And I cannot dd my well working system, nor I can configure the new one.</bad feelings>
</ot>

OT, but very important.

[Yoko22]

Originally Posted by mdp

That is good to know. So there should be no such thing as "you cannot install applications" on it (I cannot at the moment search for the exact quotes).




My method is safe in the regard, that you can build your own repository of applications, and the right versions, so you can fulfill the basic hope of "having them", and of being able to install even if you happened to have no Internet (which is not granted infrastructure), and you can install the version that you deem more appropriate (and there could be loads of examples: this one introduced effects that would make Timothy Leary scream, that one introduced a decupleton of adware, thot one removed all the features and only left a button with a small 'MINIMALISM' label at the bottom...)




I hope you tried the emotion of installing Orux Maps on it, load some map in offline-mode (as per the note just above), turn the GPS on and take some good walk in some well chosen area... ; )

(EDIT: Which would be one of the reasons why the colour e-ink phone kind of makes me wonder if... But - I am trying to understand how colour is managed - if the resolution is purposely downgraded, 300dpi to 100dpi, in the wrong parts of the rendering, an ugly mess could result. It should be seen, high definition pictures would be needed)

I'm no expert with resolution but if the resolution would be a problem due to the colors wouldn't we see it in the different video online?
You guys speak of 300dpi restrained to 100dpi, that's 3 times less, wouldn't we see a big difference while watching those video compared to an A5 ?
I'm haven't compared directly but it seems the same, what do you guys think , especially those who already have a A5?

[mdp]

Originally Posted by Yoko22

You guys speak of 300dpi restrained to 100dpi, that's 3 times less, wouldn't we see a big difference while watching those video compared to an A5 ?

I would say that's actually 9 times as few, or 8 times less. (It's one third linearly, but the display's a surface.)

To get visual proofs, you should find frames of a rendering of a string in colour (instead of black), and that of pdf renderings. It depends on where the two renderers, 300dpi colour-agnostic and 100dpi colour conscious, trigger. Frames should be found showing the two.

Considering the picture I have taken, it seems clear that Kaleido cannot show a black string, then a red string, then a(ny random) #rgb string, at the same resolution. The black one can always be 300dpi, above the mélange background. To build one in colour it has to take pieces from a 3x3 matrix.

(In fact, I do not understand why Kaleido has not used an RG/BW scheme, picking from a 2x2.)

Basically: if it renders any raster at 100dpi and any vector at 300dpi, then it's fine. If it actually does that. If the software applications or libraries used (e.g. Librera, android.webkit.WebView etc.) allow it or play along with it. And it seems to me pretty much certain that, for example, it will not be able to display high resolution strings in colour.