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Old 02-20-2017, 08:19 AM   #46
fbrzvnrnd
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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post
Oh, well. Sorry, but if there are arguments in the world designed to change my view, telling me that some academic is "studying" it is the very last way. Academia spends its entire existence in love with itself and blithely ignoring anything in the workaday world. Been there, done that.
I don't want to change your view, internet is not the right place to change own view. I only want to show that your view is "your".


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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post

No. It's still a book. Even if a book is simply dialogue, from one end to the other, it's a book.
Well, it is not a book. Waiting Godot has never been a book. It is a play. You can /also/ build a book with the script, as you can record a video or make a audio-ebook. The point is: a book is paper, non literature. It is a tool to share contents. The contents are the literature, not the paper.

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When I listen to some guy talking, or, I see an interpretation of a book, on a screen, with live people playing the roles of characters in the written book, I call that a movie. Or, if someone reads a book to me, on some sort of recorded medium, it's an audiobook.
Yes, but we are not printing book in digital publishing.

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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post
Fine. I'm sure that there will always be folks who want to play with this stuff.

Well, to each their own. As I said upthread, if someone wants to pay us to do this sort of thing, great. I've listened to this discussion before, how XXX was going to change entertainment, or the client I had that was going to change audiobooks forever with radio-play style recordings, yabbita. Right up to the point he went Tango Uniform.
Well, to each their own. I also have listened this discussion before, in '80, when someone build interactive fiction like Zork. And it worked. When, in paper, someone begin to print Choose Your Own Adventure, and it worked. There are a lot of things in non-linear reading and interactive fiction that have changed us. Until now they (often) lived outside the book. I see the ebook like a playground where traditional writings and interactive ones could find a common language.

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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post

Or, for example, if you're me, you'll get a stream of ePUB3 books to "fix," because people push a button on something like Vellum or INDD, and then the damned things don't work. I have three books inhouse like that right now. (And, of course, folks who want to pay $10 to have them fixed.)

You're enjoying what you can do with ePUB3. That's great. Commercially, at the moment, if you look at the major devices, it's still barely supported (or, I should say, most of the more-advanced ePUB3 capabilities are not supported). Perhaps in 5-10 years, we'll be onto ePUB4 or 5 or 10. And you'll be able to make multi-media (in the literal sense) offerings that combine everything into what you'll call an eBook.
Actually I do not love EPUB3, I wrote this in the first line. But I'm moving my foots following the single space I found in the support of EPUB3 or ePub2. I build an ePub2 that get news update from server, using some ePub readers; or interactive fiction in ePub2 with 6000 xhtml file linked with 15000 links. Every time I can find a space to create electronic literature, I try, if I can. I don't want to wait 10 years for EPUB5, I want to use the contemporary tools in digital publishing. EPUB3 is a tool.

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Old 02-20-2017, 08:30 AM   #47
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Side Note: Now, I haven't looked specifically at any of fbrzvnrnd's EPUB3 examples yet, but I fear for accessibility in a lot of these Javascript-heavy environments. For example, a growing trend I see is stuff like news websites that use Javascript to load the entire articles with zero fallback, or hiding things behind a "See More" which requires Javascript to load the rest of the article... Makes me want to absolutely pull my hair out.
One of the things make me say that "I do not love EPUB3" is this. I'd like to have a semantic way to build interactive and digital books. EPUB3 is not this: it has poor semantic and often web oriented. If something is missing (like: "everything"), you have to use javascript. But javascript is, in EPUB3 guidelines, something cosmetic, non structural. So: a fallback in a interactive ebook is actually a static ebook. So, it is not a real fallback, it is another thing.


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