Re-flowable EPUB "Page Numbers"

[mcrachel]

I'm formatting a book to publish on Amazon through KDP and overall my EPUB file is ready and I like the look of it. The only issue I'm having is when I test in on my e-reader and kindle previewer, there aren't page numbers, instead, it uses location. I know this can be the nature of re-flowable epubs but when I look at other books on kindle they don't have this issue and are still re-flowable, that's what has led to my confusion.

I know pages don't really exist in an EBOOK and the pages numbers listed in kindles UI are probably not "real" but it just looks more professional than it saying "location 764 of 8000"

Maybe it's just something I have to live with or something happens once both the EBOOK and psychical book are published on KDP but is there a way to fix this or is it unavoidable?

[phillipgessert]

This ordinarily fixes itself when published. It isn’t controllable by you in the ebook file prior to publishing. And FWIW, it would surprise me if readers found one or the other more professional. If anything, location is more meaningful.

[Doitsu]

According to Hitch, real page numbers are not supported in KDP books

Originally Posted by Hitch

You can generate an eBook with what's referred to as "real page numbers," but Amazon will NOT use them--even if they are present in the file--unless or until a matching print book is published and EVEN THEN, they will not facilitate it unless, in their sole opinion, there's a good reason for it. So, for a novel, probably never. For a research book, they'll take a hard look at it. But even then, it's not guaranteed.

[jhowell]

Amazon's online Kindle publishing guidelines has a section on Enabling Real Page Numbers that describes the technical aspects of adding page numbers to a Kindle book.

I defer to others as to whether or not that that is allowed for books published through KDP.

[phillipgessert]

Worth noting perhaps that there are a couple interpretations of this question. “Real page numbers” being something meant to ease cross-referencing with a paper edition, vs essentially faked page numbers that a device or app can display as an alternative to locations/% complete/etc.—I sort of suspect OP is referring to the latter.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by phillipgessert

Worth noting perhaps that there are a couple interpretations of this question. “Real page numbers” being something meant to ease cross-referencing with a paper edition, vs essentially faked page numbers that a device or app can display as an alternative to locations/% complete/etc.—I sort of suspect OP is referring to the latter.

My (and my customers') experience in this is that typically, Amazon will enable the RPNs (when I use this phrase, in this context, I mean page indicators, ids, created to match/tie to the print version, not made-up page numbers), IF you also have the matching print version for sale on their site.

I have not yet seen Amazon enable RPNs, off of a pagemap or pagelist, using ids (e.g, p#=35), that are made up, for the sake of having page numbers versus locations.

But I can't swear it never happens.

Hitch

[phillipgessert]

Originally Posted by Hitch

My (and my customers') experience in this is that typically, Amazon will enable the RPNs (when I use this phrase, in this context, I mean page indicators, ids, created to match/tie to the print version, not made-up page numbers), IF you also have the matching print version for sale on their site.

I have not yet seen Amazon enable RPNs, off of a pagemap or pagelist, using ids (e.g, p#=35), that are made up, for the sake of having page numbers versus locations.

But I can't swear it never happens.

Hitch

Ah, thank you, I wasn’t sure about that! I suppose it makes sense as a part of the paperback/ebook “pagecount” linkup.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by phillipgessert

Ah, thank you, I wasn’t sure about that! I suppose it makes sense as a part of the paperback/ebook “pagecount” linkup.

it does, if you think about it. I mean..."pages" is this amorphous thing anyway. I deal with this same sort of nonsensical measurement all day long--we get would-be customers that completely ignore the stuff on the site, saying "we will need to see your file to quote you," and instead, tell me "my file is 208 pages long." Well, what the hell does that mean? Is it typed in manuscript mode? In 12pt TNR or Garamond? Is it in 14pt Calibri? I mean, it's meaningless. Did they use the 250/word/page industry standard, or do they even know about it?

It constantly surprises me that of all people, authors, who presumably have word-count targets, CANNOT tell me the word-count of their file. Really?

So, let's say that Jane does a book, and creates faux page numbers, because she prefers them, over locations. A year later, she does a print version--and now, the faux page numbers no longer have any relevance to the new print version. Does she redo the entire eBook? What about all the people that bought it before she created her paperback?

You can see how Amazon might have actually thought this through (c'mon, there's a first time for everything), and decided, only when there's a matching print version.

Offered solely FWIW, which ain't much.

Hitch

[mcrachel]

Thank you everyone for the feedback and answers! Greatly appreciated, a physical book is being published as well so my EBOOK will have something to link up with.

[Little.Egret]

Here is a book with NO print version which has faux page numbers

https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Home-Worl...dp/B09VQYC4PJ/

Product details has
Print length ‏ : ‎ 213 pages

Same author, with print version
https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Directora...dp/B07LC6Q97M/

Print length ‏ : ‎ 666 pages
Page numbers source ISBN ‏ : ‎ 1939746299

Both in KU

The author is formatting a print version for another book so we will see what happens to the page numbers.

[Hitch]

Originally Posted by Little.Egret

Here is a book with NO print version which has faux page numbers

https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Home-Worl...dp/B09VQYC4PJ/

Product details has
Print length ‏ : ‎ 213 pages

Same author, with print version
https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Directora...dp/B07LC6Q97M/

Print length ‏ : ‎ 666 pages
Page numbers source ISBN ‏ : ‎ 1939746299

Both in KU

The author is formatting a print version for another book so we will see what happens to the page numbers.

Those are the faux page numbers that KPF format creates. It's not the same thing as RPNs.

You can see those inside Kindle Previewer 3. Drop any ePUB on it and you'll see those "page numbers' inside KP3.

Hitch