Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book Readers > Amazon Kindle > Kindle Developer's Corner

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-29-2010, 07:15 PM   #46
c861556
Enthusiast
c861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enough
 
Posts: 34
Karma: 586
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle
Why issue a rebuttal when you didn't really address any of my previous points? Where do you draw the line? What is the level of invasion of privacy by a giant multinational conglomerate that feels acceptable enough?

P.S. I don't see anything in the Terms of Use that mentions pinpointing your exact geographic location or your book access times.
c861556 is offline  
Old 09-30-2010, 11:01 PM   #47
mubertmumphrey
Member
mubertmumphrey began at the beginning.
 
Posts: 21
Karma: 44
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle 3
Those of us disturbed by the extent of Amazon's privacy intrusions have a legitimate and completely obvious grievance. I think it's reasonable to expect that Amazon needn't keep tabs on our every location, when, where, and what we read, the exact text of any notes we write, etc. Are they legally in the clear? Do wireless carriers violate privacy too? Who gives a ****. It doesn't excuse what they are doing. And you can bet that 99.99999% of Kindle owners have no idea of it.

Last edited by mubertmumphrey; 09-30-2010 at 11:18 PM.
mubertmumphrey is offline  
Advert
Old 10-01-2010, 08:15 AM   #48
DiapDealer
Grand Sorcerer
DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
DiapDealer's Avatar
 
Posts: 27,463
Karma: 192992430
Join Date: Jan 2010
Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD
Quote:
It doesn't excuse what they are doing. And you can bet that 99.99999% of Kindle owners have no idea of it.
Tally me up in the column that has always known they were collecting lots of data... and just didn't (and still don't) give a damn. I expect that 99.999blahblah% number is a lot lower than you think. Not all Kindle owners are dumb enough to buy a product without reading the License Agreement/Terms of Use.

Use it, hack it, break it, sell it... just don't bitch about it.
DiapDealer is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:25 AM   #49
suecsi
Rock Chick
suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.suecsi is fluent in JavaScript as well as Klingon.
 
suecsi's Avatar
 
Posts: 429
Karma: 4965
Join Date: May 2009
Location: near Heathrow
Device: Kindle 2i, Kindle DX, Kindle 3G
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
Tally me up in the column that has always known they were collecting lots of data... and just didn't (and still don't) give a damn. I expect that 99.999blahblah% number is a lot lower than you think. Not all Kindle owners are dumb enough to buy a product without reading the License Agreement/Terms of Use.

Use it, hack it, break it, sell it... just don't bitch about it.
suecsi is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 10:46 AM   #50
c861556
Enthusiast
c861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enough
 
Posts: 34
Karma: 586
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle
Failed Expectations

Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
I expect that 99.999blahblah% number is a lot lower than you think. Not all Kindle owners are dumb enough to buy a product without reading the License Agreement/Terms of Use.
Aside from the fact that the EULA doesn't explicitly mention such 'insignificant' things like location tracking:

A 2001 Privacy Leadership Initiative survey showed that only 3% of customers read privacy policies carefully and 64% only glance or never read such policies.

In 2002, the New York Times reported that only 0.3% of users read Yahoo’s privacy policy in a one month period back in 2001.

A 2006 survey of Facebook users showed that 89% of them admitted that they had never read the privacy policy and 91% were not familiar with the terms of service.

A 2008 survey by the ICO found that 71% did not read or understand privacy policies, that 62% wanted a clearer explanation of how personal information will actually be used, and that 42% believed that the material only existed to justify the selling on of personal details.

In April, 2010, a computer game retailer revealed that it legally owns the souls of thousands of online shoppers, thanks to a clause in the terms and conditions agreed to by online shoppers ("By placing an order via this Web site . . . you agree to grant Us a non transferable option to claim, for now and for ever more, your immortal soul.") Almost 90% of customers agreed to the terms and conditions without reading. Those who refused the terms, by the way, were given a £5 gift voucher.

Do I need to go on?

Last edited by c861556; 10-01-2010 at 10:52 AM.
c861556 is offline  
Advert
Old 10-01-2010, 11:14 AM   #51
DiapDealer
Grand Sorcerer
DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
DiapDealer's Avatar
 
Posts: 27,463
Karma: 192992430
Join Date: Jan 2010
Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD
Quote:
Do I need to go on?
Apparently... because I'm not getting your point.
Are you trying to say that people have an excuse for not reading ToS's because people tend to not read ToS's??

I know that most people ignore them. Mainly because most people prefer to be ignorant up front... and then complain later.
DiapDealer is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 11:56 AM   #52
c861556
Enthusiast
c861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enough
 
Posts: 34
Karma: 586
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle
Quote:
Are you trying to say that people have an excuse for not reading ToS's because people tend to not read ToS's??
I'm saying that just because some of these offensively intrusive methods of spying are vaguely mentioned somewhere in the ToS, it doesn't give a company carte blanche to actively exploit a well-known human weakness. Or to put it another way, just because some people are naive, it doesn't give con artists a valid excuse to defraud them.
c861556 is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 01:46 PM   #53
WT Sharpe
Bah, humbug!
WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
WT Sharpe's Avatar
 
Posts: 39,073
Karma: 157049943
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPad Pro, & a Samsung Galaxy S9.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mubertmumphrey View Post
Those of us disturbed by the extent of Amazon's privacy intrusions have a legitimate and completely obvious grievance. I think it's reasonable to expect that Amazon needn't keep tabs on our every location, when, where, and what we read, the exact text of any notes we write, etc. Are they legally in the clear? Do wireless carriers violate privacy too? Who gives a ****. It doesn't excuse what they are doing. And you can bet that 99.99999% of Kindle owners have no idea of it.
Feels nice to be among the 0.00001% who know you can turn off those features.
WT Sharpe is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 02:25 PM   #54
DiapDealer
Grand Sorcerer
DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
DiapDealer's Avatar
 
Posts: 27,463
Karma: 192992430
Join Date: Jan 2010
Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD
Quote:
Feels nice to be among the 0.00001% who know you can turn off those features.
Wait a minute! Surely you're not saying you arrived at this "solution" without feeling all indignant and violated?!
DiapDealer is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 03:20 PM   #55
c861556
Enthusiast
c861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enoughc861556 will become famous soon enough
 
Posts: 34
Karma: 586
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
Wait a minute! Surely you're not saying you arrived at this "solution" without feeling all indignant and violated?!
Those who sacrifice privacy for convenience deserve neither. —Benjamin Franklin*

*People will accept your idea much more readily if you tell them Benjamin Franklin said it first. —David H. Comins
c861556 is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:26 PM   #56
mubertmumphrey
Member
mubertmumphrey began at the beginning.
 
Posts: 21
Karma: 44
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle 3
I'm sorry; I chose the 99.99999% number arbitrarily. I think I might have overstated it. Maybe take away a few 9's and you'll have a generous guess of the number of people who understand the extent to which Amazon is gathering personal information. There is no doubt that it is a tiny fraction of owners, and the people who visit this board are among the few. What you read, where you go, at what time, the notes you write, all of this information is cataloged and property of Amazon, and this only became known by hacking the software. It's ridiculous to dispute that very few users are aware of this.

Amazon could be open about it, but they have chosen to hide the fact.

The whole "you can't complain because it's in the the ToS" crap - it's tiring. Whether Amazon covered their ass legally was never a point of the discussion. Most people don't read the terms of service because it isn't worth their time, nor can they necessarily parse dense and confusing legal text. This doesn't make you superior to them. Diap, as you have so smugly made clear, you believe that people should silence their criticism of Amazon if they technically haven't violated the law. This is, in my humble view, 1) irresponsibly dismissive of (ever-increasing) corporate encroachment on personal privacy 2) retarded. That something is legal does not mean it is right or acceptable.
mubertmumphrey is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:45 PM   #57
DiapDealer
Grand Sorcerer
DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.DiapDealer ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
DiapDealer's Avatar
 
Posts: 27,463
Karma: 192992430
Join Date: Jan 2010
Device: Nexus 7, Kindle Fire HD
I stand by my "retarded" opinion.
Feel free to continue your humble rant without any further interruption from me.
DiapDealer is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:53 PM   #58
mubertmumphrey
Member
mubertmumphrey began at the beginning.
 
Posts: 21
Karma: 44
Join Date: Sep 2010
Device: Kindle 3
You may stand by your opinion, but you can't defend it one iota.
mubertmumphrey is offline  
Old 10-01-2010, 10:52 PM   #59
carld
Wizard
carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.carld ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 2,698
Karma: 4748723
Join Date: Dec 2007
Device: Kindle Paperwhite
I don't care one bit about the data Amazon collects, doesn't bother me at all.
carld is offline  
Old 10-02-2010, 07:59 AM   #60
WT Sharpe
Bah, humbug!
WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.WT Sharpe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
WT Sharpe's Avatar
 
Posts: 39,073
Karma: 157049943
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA
Device: Kindle Oasis, iPad Pro, & a Samsung Galaxy S9.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
Wait a minute! Surely you're not saying you arrived at this "solution" without feeling all indignant and violated?!
Even without losing any sleep!
WT Sharpe is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Hacks Kindle DX - Any way to disable screensaver? schulzmc Amazon Kindle 165 01-23-2014 02:37 AM
How do I disable iPhoto from opening up? thadiyan Amazon Kindle 3 09-12-2010 07:12 PM
How to disable the accelerometer ? askyn PocketBook 4 05-23-2010 12:38 PM
Disable Synchronization help please charlesp Sony Reader 2 01-10-2009 01:18 PM
I don't understand the screensaver (+ how do I disable it?). GatorDeb Amazon Kindle 8 10-02-2008 07:05 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:33 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.