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Old 09-20-2021, 09:32 AM   #31
kso
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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post
... I do think that font designers do face an existential threat. ...
Hitch
The emphasis should have been on "unwilling to accept that there's an existential threat to font designers and sellers were they to allow font embedding on equal terms for both PDFs and Ebooks". I do not dispute their right to charge for fonts.

What I am unwilling to engage in is the meticulous book-keeping of how I use a font I licensed (see, I do not say "bought"). When I buy (or license) some software, I'm not restricted in what I do with it. I can illustrate a house, poster or a pipe dream. I'm in no way limited for whom I work. With a font I must check if I'm legally entitled to do a book cover or an inside cover, or all of the body copy. I may have to watch the print runs of a book, or the number of ebooks the font is used in. The only "existential threat" here comes from me avoiding the record keeping all together by not using a font with such a license.

Just look at the way fonts for the web are licensed. Most foundries charge by the number of page views per month. Problem: nobody knows how many page views there are for a given web page, not really. A very large proportion of page requests served by a web server are from bots, some totally abandoned and forgotten or running wild (Just look at your raw server logs if you have a web site). Some analytic tools therefore assume a "visit" is a request where embedded javascript is executed incrementing a counter somewhere. Thing is, a proportion of requests is from people having javascript intentionally disabled, to avoid ads, irritation or some tracking. Therefore: no-one can know for sure.

Font licensing is therefore a can of worms best not touched unless the license is one that allows you to use a font without double entry bookkeeping.

When it comes to being ripped off you're not the only one having learned the lesson. Back in the days when we did what could be called consulting work where the client paid a chunk on account by card and the balance after delivery of our conclusions, some people thought we meant them to pay on account followed by a charge-back once they had the goods.

I solved that by requiring a written and signed order confirming the key aspects (already entered on an online form) and the payment method (including card details) sent by fax or post before even looking at a job. Dealing almost exclusively with European clients may have helped. Even installed a dedicated fax line. To me the only significant bits of that confirmation were the payment mechanics. That requirement delayed job completion, but it absolutely eliminated our charge-backs.

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Old 09-20-2021, 10:43 AM   #32
Hitch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kso View Post
The emphasis should have been on "unwilling to accept that there's an existential threat to font designers and sellers were they to allow font embedding on equal terms for both PDFs and Ebooks". I do not dispute their right to charge for fonts.

What I am unwilling to engage in is the meticulous book-keeping of how I use a font I licensed (see, I do not say "bought"). When I buy (or license) some software, I'm not restricted in what I do with it. I can illustrate a house, poster or a pipe dream. I'm in no way limited for whom I work. With a font I must check if I'm legally entitled to do a book cover or an inside cover, or all of the body copy. I may have to watch the print runs of a book, or the number of ebooks the font is used in. The only "existential threat" here comes from me avoiding the record keeping all together by not using a font with such a license.

Just look at the way fonts for the web are licensed. Most foundries charge by the number of page views per month. Problem: nobody knows how many page views there are for a given web page, not really. A very large proportion of page requests served by a web server are from bots, some totally abandoned and forgotten or running wild (Just look at your raw server logs if you have a web site). Some analytic tools therefore assume a "visit" is a request where embedded javascript is executed incrementing a counter somewhere. Thing is, a proportion of requests is from people having javascript intentionally disabled, to avoid ads, irritation or some tracking. Therefore: no-one can know for sure.

Font licensing is therefore a can of worms best not touched unless the license is one that allows you to use a font without double entry bookkeeping.
I don't disagree with you at all on that front. Suffice to say, I spend a silly amount of time making sure we're "copacetic" on embedded fonts (typically for a title page or chapter heads). (sigh).

Quote:
When it comes to being ripped off you're not the only one having learned the lesson. Back in the days when we did what could be called consulting work where the client paid a chunk on account by card and the balance after delivery of our conclusions, some people thought we meant them to pay on account followed by a charge-back once they had the goods.
Oh, yes. I once had a law firm expect me to send them weeks of research--a $15K gig--without being paid. It wasn't the lawfirm that had contracted me--it was their squirmy client. I told them they could send me a check, or they could warrant and guarantee payment, by their lawfirm. Either would do. Suffice to say, they had the customer send me a check. (Timeshare company. I mean, really? They thought I'd turn it over and wait? For how many years?)

Quote:
I solved that by requiring a written and signed order confirming the key aspects (already entered on an online form) and the payment method (including card details) sent by fax or post before even looking at a job. Dealing almost exclusively with European clients may have helped. Even installed a dedicated fax line. To me the only significant bits of that confirmation were the payment mechanics. That requirement delayed job completion, but it absolutely eliminated our charge-backs.

klaus
Yes, we have to do that too--but it means that I spend another silly amount of time invoicing for wee amounts, with 2, 3, 5, 8 revision cycles--each one invoiced and collected at the time--instead of being able to to invoice and collect when done. It significantly increases my overhead per invoice or line-item. It's irritating as s**t.

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Old 09-20-2021, 11:27 AM   #33
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It's very easy to remove the obfuscation from fonts in ePub and KF8. That's why subsetting is best for embedded fonts. That way, the font is useless outside of the eBook. If font designers don't get that, more fool to them.
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Old 09-20-2021, 11:59 AM   #34
Hitch
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Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
It's very easy to remove the obfuscation from fonts in ePub and KF8. That's why subsetting is best for embedded fonts. That way, the font is useless outside of the eBook. If font designers don't get that, more fool to them.
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Isn't today your Bday? If it is, happy birthday, brother!

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Now I'm going to learn that this is one of those sites that lists the Bdays at the bottom and I'll look a right idiot.


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