ePub: alternate renditions

michaelhughes · 02-14-2010, 06:38 PM

I'm new to ePub and just found this forum, looks like a great source of information!

I am curious to know if any readers or ePub software support the "alternate renditions" described in Sec. 2.3.2 of the OEBPS Container Format 1.0 document? (http://www.idpf.org/ocf/ocf1.0/download/ocf10.htm)

I created an ePub with a reference in container.xml, but none of the software I use to read ePubs (Stanza, Caliber, Sony Reader or Adobe DE) seem to let me do anything with it. I do not have access to a reading device at this time.

Is this something that anyone has experience with or is it simply "untapped" potential for the container format?

Thanks!

desertgrandma · 02-14-2010, 06:39 PM

Welcome to MobileRead,MichaelHughes.

KNotTed · 02-15-2010, 12:13 PM

I suspect your assumption about the alternate renditions being untapped potential to be the case. Storing a pdf in an epub file, at this time, will most likely only make the file bigger, and otherwise be useless from a reader's standpoint.

DaleDe · 02-15-2010, 12:57 PM

There have been some cases of people storing their source format, particularly if it is an html browser format in the file. Docbook could also be an alternate format which different readers using different formats. But a single reader is unlikely to support alternates.

Dale

michaelhughes · 02-15-2010, 04:28 PM

Thanks for the input.

My thought was, "Can I deliver multiple formats of a title in a single file using the OCF?"

I know I could always deliver a tar or zip of an ePub and PDF together, but I thought if a reader device or reader software would support multiple rootfiles in the ePub, it would be less complicated for the user.

Or at least less complicated for me.

Jellby · 02-16-2010, 03:49 AM

It would be great if the reader would let the user select which version to show, but note that the spec does not provide any way to identify the different versions, other than by media-type. If you wanted, for instance to provide two alternative PDF versions, one with large font, one with smaller font, there is no way the user can know in advance which is which, even if the reader lets him/her choose between PDF 1 and PDF 2.

michaelhughes · 02-17-2010, 11:16 AM

Yeah, I had this vision of a device or reader software that would detect the additional rootfile entry for the PDF and give someone the option of "extracting" it from the container, either to the device or their hard drive. Then, the owner of the file would have the option to view the ePub or a more formatted version in PDF.

Sounds like a weekend project, doesn't it.

crych · 02-20-2010, 12:16 AM

I was asking myself this question after reading Colin Hazlehurst's post on the topic at Inside epub. Hazlehurst suggests using an additional rootfile linking to a PDF to provide a version of the pub formatted for printing. I tested a file with two rootfiles, one pointing to a PDF, in desktop versions of number of readers (ADE, B&N, Stanza, etc.) but none revealed the presence of the PDF file.

I've been toying with the notion of including a link or script in one of the content files that would call the PDF but haven't yet figured out if that is possible. Any suggestions welcome.

Jellby · 02-20-2010, 03:54 AM

Well, you could include instructions on unzipping the .epub file and copying the PDF, that's about the most portable solution currently available, I guess.

michaelhughes · 02-20-2010, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crych

I was asking myself this question after reading Colin Hazlehurst's post on the topic at Inside epub. Hazlehurst suggests using an additional rootfile linking to a PDF to provide a version of the pub formatted for printing. I tested a file with two rootfiles, one pointing to a PDF, in desktop versions of number of readers (ADE, B&N, Stanza, etc.) but none revealed the presence of the PDF file.

I've been toying with the notion of including a link or script in one of the content files that would call the PDF but haven't yet figured out if that is possible. Any suggestions welcome.

When I first considered the idea I saw that posting too, but unfortunately that was about as far as anyone seems to have taken the idea so far.

I did create an ePub with the requisite structure that contained a PDF file, but I couldn't get it to come up in Sony Reader, ADE or Stanza, either.

Not being one who is easily discouraged...since the OEBPS CF 1.0 spec said the extra rootfile and separate folder was the "recommended" approach, I decided to adjust the location of the PDF in the ePub (dropping it into the same folder with all my xhtml files) and was able to get ADE and Sony Reader (software) to open the PDF when I linked to it from the TOC.

While this wasn't my original goal, I did get some satisfaction out of it!

crych · 02-26-2010, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelhughes

Not being one who is easily discouraged...since the OEBPS CF 1.0 spec said the extra rootfile and separate folder was the "recommended" approach, I decided to adjust the location of the PDF in the ePub (dropping it into the same folder with all my xhtml files) and was able to get ADE and Sony Reader (software) to open the PDF when I linked to it from the TOC.

Aha! Thanks. I'm going to try that. With a suitable description in the TOC it just might do the trick. Be nice to have the other method working though.

02-14-2010, 06:38 PM	#1
michaelhughes Member Posts: 13 Karma: 44 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Indianapolis Device: Sony PRS-600	ePub: alternate renditions I'm new to ePub and just found this forum, looks like a great source of information! I am curious to know if any readers or ePub software support the "alternate renditions" described in Sec. 2.3.2 of the OEBPS Container Format 1.0 document? (http://www.idpf.org/ocf/ocf1.0/download/ocf10.htm) I created an ePub with a reference in container.xml, but none of the software I use to read ePubs (Stanza, Caliber, Sony Reader or Adobe DE) seem to let me do anything with it. I do not have access to a reading device at this time. Is this something that anyone has experience with or is it simply "untapped" potential for the container format? Thanks!

02-20-2010, 12:16 AM	#8
crych Junior Member Posts: 3 Karma: 10 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Device: iPad	I was asking myself this question after reading Colin Hazlehurst's post on the topic at Inside epub. Hazlehurst suggests using an additional rootfile linking to a PDF to provide a version of the pub formatted for printing. I tested a file with two rootfiles, one pointing to a PDF, in desktop versions of number of readers (ADE, B&N, Stanza, etc.) but none revealed the presence of the PDF file. I've been toying with the notion of including a link or script in one of the content files that would call the PDF but haven't yet figured out if that is possible. Any suggestions welcome. Last edited by crych; 02-20-2010 at 12:23 AM. Reason: incomplete

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02-14-2010, 06:39 PM	#2
desertgrandma Enjoying the show.... Posts: 14,270 Karma: 10462841 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Arizona Device: A K1, Kindle Paperwhite, an Ipod, IPad2, Iphone, an Ipad Mini & macAir	Welcome to MobileRead,MichaelHughes.

02-15-2010, 12:13 PM	#3
KNotTed Member Posts: 19 Karma: 62 Join Date: Feb 2010 Device: PRS-505, PRS-600	I suspect your assumption about the alternate renditions being untapped potential to be the case. Storing a pdf in an epub file, at this time, will most likely only make the file bigger, and otherwise be useless from a reader's standpoint.

02-15-2010, 12:57 PM	#4
DaleDe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,470 Karma: 13095790 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Grass Valley, CA Device: EB 1150, EZ Reader, Literati, iPad 2 & Air 2, iPhone 7	There have been some cases of people storing their source format, particularly if it is an html browser format in the file. Docbook could also be an alternate format which different readers using different formats. But a single reader is unlikely to support alternates. Dale

02-15-2010, 04:28 PM	#5
michaelhughes Member Posts: 13 Karma: 44 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Indianapolis Device: Sony PRS-600	Thanks for the input. My thought was, "Can I deliver multiple formats of a title in a single file using the OCF?" I know I could always deliver a tar or zip of an ePub and PDF together, but I thought if a reader device or reader software would support multiple rootfiles in the ePub, it would be less complicated for the user. Or at least less complicated for me.

02-16-2010, 03:49 AM	#6
Jellby frumious Bandersnatch Posts: 7,515 Karma: 18512745 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Spaniard in Sweden Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura	It would be great if the reader would let the user select which version to show, but note that the spec does not provide any way to identify the different versions, other than by media-type. If you wanted, for instance to provide two alternative PDF versions, one with large font, one with smaller font, there is no way the user can know in advance which is which, even if the reader lets him/her choose between PDF 1 and PDF 2.

02-17-2010, 11:16 AM	#7
michaelhughes Member Posts: 13 Karma: 44 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Indianapolis Device: Sony PRS-600	Yeah, I had this vision of a device or reader software that would detect the additional rootfile entry for the PDF and give someone the option of "extracting" it from the container, either to the device or their hard drive. Then, the owner of the file would have the option to view the ePub or a more formatted version in PDF. Sounds like a weekend project, doesn't it.

02-20-2010, 03:54 AM	#9
Jellby frumious Bandersnatch Posts: 7,515 Karma: 18512745 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Spaniard in Sweden Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura	Well, you could include instructions on unzipping the .epub file and copying the PDF, that's about the most portable solution currently available, I guess.

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