Thinner is not always better

[John F]

Originally Posted by HarryT

My phone is an iPhone 6 which is a few months short of 5 years old, and its battery life is absolutely fine. When I go to bed it typically has a battery charge of around 60% and I recharge it overnight. I use it all day for email, web browsing, etc.

When you say "all day", how long is that in actual usage? What does your Screen Time say (Settings->Screen Time)?

In general, I've been pretty happy with my iPhone battery. I probably use it (SE) about 40min a day (Screen time number), and it is usually above 70% in the evening. It is just over three years old. Although I went for a bike ride yesterday for 1.5 hours, and the battery went down ~70% (battery ended up at 38%), which has me a little worried.

I was very happy with my last 4s, I think I had it for more than 4 years and didn't notice a degradation in the battery.

[leebase]

There is now a battery health section in settings where you can see your battery's degradation. My iPhoneX, about a year and a half old, is at 90% of maximum capacity. It’s still 100% capable of peak performance.

At 80% I’ll probably get a new battery if I still have the phone. Once a day, night time charge most of the time. If I’m in an area with spotty cell coverage, or shooting a lot of photos and editing them, or shooting video...I’ll need to charge before the day is over.

On those days, I take an external battery with me. Just like Imhave a case on it such that my iPhone isn’t particularly thin either. I’d love to enjoy my iPhones actual thinness...but I don’t want to pay for repairs.

If my iPhone was as thick as it is with my case in it, I’d make it thicker still by putting a case on it. It’s the screen that’s fragile

[John F]

Originally Posted by leebase

There is now a battery health section in settings where you can see your battery's degradation. My iPhoneX, about a year and a half old, is at 90% of maximum capacity. It’s still 100% capable of peak performance.

...

My 3 year old iPhone says 94%. Makes wonder about the reports if lion batteries 3 year life.

[gamba66]

Originally Posted by John F

My 3 year old iPhone says 94%. Makes wonder about the reports if lion batteries 3 year life.

These lithium-ion batteries do not degrade in a fixed timely manner but rather just lose 70% in a matter of a couple of days after some years have passed, no matter if used heavily or not. They are composed of chemicald which degrade over time. With larger laptops batteries for example the effect is more dramatic.

Comparable to the liver which doesn't degrade sequentially with excessive drinking but shows signs of cirrhosis rather abruptly after years of drinking abuse.

Also the argument that you couldnt change the battery yourself I can't agree with because I was talking about repairabality in general, no matter if you do it yourself or let a repair shop do it, which I reckon most people go to.

Yes most lithium-ion batteries are fixed and not user replacable but thanks to aliexpress, ebay and taobao you can find almost any of them and replace them or let someone replace them.

There is no good argument to sacrifice a case that can be disassembled with screws with one that is glued or uses tabs in sacrifice for thinness both in terms of durability and longevitity.

[lumpynose]

Originally Posted by barryem

The problem is ereaders are tied to book stores so there's no competition among device manufacturers; just among book stores.

Barry

Have a look at PocketBook; no store tie-in according to a video on goodereader.com; they saw that as a negative for people who want the ease and simplicity of having the storefront built into the e-reader. So you're forced to side load all of your books. It also has an expansion slot for sdcard flash memory. They also have an android app named PocketBook which stands out because it displays an e-book properly, unlike almost all of the other ones. It's a Swiss company so maybe we could assume it's well made like a Swiss watch?

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by John F

When you say "all day", how long is that in actual usage? What does your Screen Time say (Settings->Screen Time)?

Typically it’s between 4 and 6h. “Battery Health” shows 95%. I bought my iPhone 6 on its release day, which I see was 19th September 2014, so it’s three months short of being 5 years old now.

[John F]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Typically it’s between 4 and 6h. “Battery Health” shows 95%. I bought my iPhone 6 on its release day, which I see was 19th September 2014, so it’s three months short of being 5 years old now.

I would be very happy with that battery usage.

I'm happy with mine because in general, I don't use it very heavily. But I'd guess when I go to the city, and start using GPS, I could probably go through the battery in ~4hrs (going from the experience of my last trip to the city). My last experience of it going down 70% in 1.5 hours was disconcerting.

I do have everything on all the time (wifi, GPS, BT, ...). Turning off wifi didn't seem to be too significant. I am happy with it for music playback: I'd guess it only goes down 5%/hr when using BT.

[HarryT]

GPS is very power-hungry. It’ll very quickly drain your battery.

[gamba66]

To underline my point that thinner can be alot worse, the best example for this is the Sony DPT-RP1 and DPT-CP1 13.3" and 10.3" ebook readers. They are glued together and are not meant to be taken apart at all incase any repair will become necessary. Rather they will be returned incase of any damage and exchanged for a new one (if sony customer service even responds).

Here a quote from Reddit where someone experienced a defect:

These stuffs are made by adhesive technology the whole unit and battery all glued together to ensure cheap and fast assembly and that consumers will buy a new one, and cannot be repaired. Therefore Sony doesn't have their own repair service even that is outsourced and even if they take it they will send it back to the factory and shift it to a refurb. Besides important to mention not only Sony does it. If you live in Europe, I read that the Union is going to submit a new bill that in the EU adhesive technology -- Edit: and built in timer -- will be banned and all products must be serviceable on low cost. I still need to verify this news, though.

They are build to be very light and thin but have alot of durability issues due to the thin cases. Screens seems to break easily and show lines or non-responsive areas where the pen cant be used probably due to flex-damage.

The sony DPT-S1 was still made with a metal case and manufactured in japan while the newer DPT-RP1 and CP1 are made in china completely with thin and light plastic cases.

Some pictures from amazon customer reviews underline this problem I would advise to read some of the customer experiences there since so many people seem to have durability issues: Some brand new out of the box and others with longtime experiences.:

[rem736]

thin, by itself, is not bad at all. it reduces weight. but you have to look at it in conjunction with ergonomics, battery life, and durability. because of this, i think the kindle oasis incorporates all these elements better than any other device. it has a metal back, so it's more durable. if it was plastic, that would be another thing altogether. then there is the thicker side to accommodate for more battery life and ergonomics. but the reading area itself is as thin as possible, making the whole device lighter. i wish other manufacturers put as much thought into product design as amazon did for the kindle oasis.

[lumpynose]

Originally Posted by rem736

thin, by itself, is not bad at all. it reduces weight. but you have to look at it in conjunction with ergonomics, battery life, and durability. because of this, i think the kindle oasis incorporates all these elements better than any other device. it has a metal back, so it's more durable. if it was plastic, that would be another thing altogether. then there is the thicker side to accommodate for more battery life and ergonomics. but the reading area itself is as thin as possible, making the whole device lighter. i wish other manufacturers put as much thought into product design as amazon did for the kindle oasis.

I agree except that I think the Kobo Forma has done it even better. The thick part where the battery and buttons are is slightly angled up and definitely easier to hold than the Kindle. And, as I've ranted about elsewhere, the GUI on the Kobo is much better and has more features than the Kindle.

[tomsem]

Ergonomics is very personal - there is no ‘one size fits all’. Likewise with user interfaces: some people want all conceivable options and features, others just need basics.

[cgsmom]

Originally Posted by tomsem

Ergonomics is very personal - there is no ‘one size fits all’. Likewise with user interfaces: some people want all conceivable options and features, others just need basics.

I agree. I loved my Voyage. When it died I bought a Paperwhite 4. I hated it. It was so thin and slippery that I felt like I was going to drop it all the time. I added a cover and that helped a little but the bezels were so small that I kept turning pages inadvertently. I decided to try the new Nook 7.8". I like it fine. It is easier to hold. I like the plastic back. I LOVE the buttons. The Nook software is not great but once I am in the book and reading, I don't notice. Choice is good.

[NickyWithNook]

As far as size and ease of holding in a hand go, I use a Pop Socket on the back of mine. I do hold mine though - I have Progressive eyeglass lenses and I need it at a particular distance and angle - and I do like it to be pretty light.

[azayn]

For me thinness matters so far as it relates to reducing the overall weight of the device. When you’re reading for long stretches of time, your hand can get fatigued by the weight of the device. My 7 year old Kobo Mini at 135g is far more comfortable to hold than my new Kindle Oasis 3 at 188g. That extra 50g feels a lot heavier than you would think after holding it for an hour.

A thinner ereader would be great if it’s also feather light.