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Old 04-28-2019, 02:37 PM   #61
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I wouldn't say only, but that is the set up I use. I do understand that there are other programs that remove Fairplay, but I have not experience with those.
Ok. If you can PM any tool suggestions you've heard of, would be really appreciated. I have a Macbook at work but for personal use, only have Windows PC's, along with the new Ipad. I've seen books I wouldn't mind buying in the Books store, but avoided since it wasn't clear what tooling options there were for Windows. I even looked into trying to run a Mac OS clone on a VM just to run Tuneskit, but that looks like more hassle than I want to deal with.
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Old 04-28-2019, 03:44 PM   #62
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Right now, Apple seems focused on their walled garden, just like Amazon is focused on their walled garden. (you want to read Kindle books on something other than a Kindle or using the Kindle app? Need to remove the DRM first, no different than Apple).
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So, no I'm not saying you can install the Books app on your Android phone. It's only supported on iOS and MacOS devices, iPad, iPhone and MacBook Pro for example.
So a much more restrictive "walled garden" than Amazon's, since Kindle apps can be installed on just about any device, including Apple devices.
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Old 04-28-2019, 04:13 PM   #63
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I know of no eInk device that directly supports Apple eBooks and fairplay. You can remove the DRM from them, that's what I do when I buy Apple eBooks. Right now, Books is supported on all the Apple devices, i.e. iOS and Mac.

Right now, Apple seems focused on their walled garden, just like Amazon is focused on their walled garden. (you want to read Kindle books on something other than a Kindle or using the Kindle app? Need to remove the DRM first, no different than Apple).
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"Right now, Books is supported on all the Apple devices, i.e. iOS and Mac. "

So, no I'm not saying you can install the Books app on your Android phone. It's only supported on iOS and MacOS devices, iPad, iPhone and MacBook Pro for example.
Whether you intended it or not, many people will get the impression from the first quote that there are apple book apps for non apple devices. The key is "Apple seems focused on their walled garden, just like Amazon is focused on their walled garden".

"just like" is pretty strong.
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Old 04-28-2019, 06:15 PM   #64
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So a much more restrictive "walled garden" than Amazon's, since Kindle apps can be installed on just about any device, including Apple devices.
I would put it more along the lines that Apple allows other ebook apps on their platform. Have you seen a Books, Kobo or B&N app on the Kindle Fire? Apple is a hardware company that includes services to help sell their hardware.
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Old 04-28-2019, 06:16 PM   #65
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Whether you intended it or not, many people will get the impression from the first quote that there are apple book apps for non apple devices. The key is "Apple seems focused on their walled garden, just like Amazon is focused on their walled garden".

"just like" is pretty strong.
Once again, how many ebook stores can you access from the Kindle or Kindle Fire?
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Old 04-28-2019, 06:58 PM   #66
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Once again, how many ebook stores can you access from the Kindle or Kindle Fire?
No one is disputing that amazon has a walled garden, but you keep deliberately ignoring that amazon has apps for a wide variety of non-amazon devices and apple does not. Hence not just the same.
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Old 04-28-2019, 08:08 PM   #67
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No one is disputing that amazon has a walled garden, but you keep deliberately ignoring that amazon has apps for a wide variety of non-amazon devices and apple does not. Hence not just the same.
And that's because Apple allows other apps and Amazon doesn't. Apple does have iTunes on windows machines. I'm not ignoring anything, I'm stating that each company has something they are selling and are protecting that product.

Once again, Apple is a hardware company that is pushing people to develop for their hardware. Amazon is basically a content company. Both have walled gardens. Amazon wants to keep it's customers in the Amazon walled garden, thus they write apps from other platforms and don't allow other content providers on their platform. Apple wants to keep customers in the Apple walled garden, thus they permit pretty much anyone who wants to develop apps for the Apple platform to do so.

It's not exactly a difficult thing to understand. Both companies have the same goal, but sell different things, i.e. devices verses content. Right now, the only cross platform product that Apple has with a significant presence is the iTune store and that is about allowing customers who purchase iPods, iPhones and iPads to provision them on Windows pc's.

Last edited by pwalker8; 04-28-2019 at 08:12 PM.
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Old 04-28-2019, 08:08 PM   #68
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They’re effectively the same. Amazon is, in this instance, a software company while Apple is a hardware company.

Buy a Kindle and you’re locked in to using Amazon for your books. Yeah you can read them elsewhere if you have another device but most people have at most a computer a tablet and a smartphone. So they’re basically locked in to Amazon if they have a kindle fire.

Buy an iPad and you can get the nook app the kobo app the Amazon app. Sure you can only read any books you purchase from Apple on the iOS device or a Mac but you’re not limited to them.


So which is more restrictive? The company that doesn’t let you use any other bookstores on their device or the one that requires you to use their device to read books from them but let’s you use every other bookstore?

Seems pretty six of one half a dozen of the other to me.

Last edited by MGlitch; 04-28-2019 at 08:11 PM.
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Old 04-28-2019, 08:43 PM   #69
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Yeah, apple, which instigated e-book agency, which sets the retailers cut at 30%, allows other bookstores. apple's cut for sales by other bookstores is 30%. Oops.
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Old 04-28-2019, 08:58 PM   #70
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I would put it more along the lines that Apple allows other ebook apps on their platform. Have you seen a Books, Kobo or B&N app on the Kindle Fire? Apple is a hardware company that includes services to help sell their hardware.
None of which changes the fact that, as a non-Apple device user, I couldn't use Apple's eBook service — even if I wanted to. That's what I thought when I asked my original question, but I wasn't sure. Can't get much more "walled garden" than that for me.
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Old 04-28-2019, 09:02 PM   #71
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Talking about apples & oranges! When referring to the ipad & using amazon, nook or kobo apps is VERY DIFFERENT than referring to the 'restrictions' of the amazon kindle e-ink reader & disregarding the the amazon kindle fire tablets behave better than the ipad. I have the 'kindle' fire hdx & have installed play store & other apps to get & read books. Comparisons could do better with 'similar' type hardware as the purposes are for different uses.

I have an ipad 6th gen which will not even recognize the ios user guide when the book is moved to a different folder with a "unrecognizable format"; had to relocate the book back to the original place. Cannot even use another reader, fbreader, marvin, mapleread, to read the ios user guide; as ios don't recognize the format ibooks won't read the book. Had me not to be concerned about books from apple.

Kobo e-ink have their own restrictions & do believe that the kobo tablets have more freedom.
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Old 04-28-2019, 09:06 PM   #72
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And that's because Apple allows other apps and Amazon doesn't. ...
Well, actually, Kobo and Nook apps can be installed on Amazon Fires. (I have installed them on my Fire.) They're not in the Appstore, but Android APKs can be downloaded and Amazon Fires can install apps from "unknown sources."
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Old 04-28-2019, 11:00 PM   #73
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This walled garden thing doesn't really match what Amazon has. My Fire has the Google Play store. I can install 3rd party apps from other sources. I can buy books from Nook or Kobo and put them on my Paperwhite via Calibre. Amazon doesn't make that real easy but they don't try to make it difficult either. There are instructions all over the internet about how to get around Amazon's limitations.

Apple makes it a bit more difficult to get around they're walls but not a lot more.

It's easy enough to do most things on most devices if you know how and it's easy to find out how. The walled garden is an illusion. It only fools those who don't care.

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Old 04-29-2019, 02:14 AM   #74
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Talking about apples & oranges! When referring to the ipad & using amazon, nook or kobo apps is VERY DIFFERENT than referring to the 'restrictions' of the amazon kindle e-ink reader & disregarding the the amazon kindle fire tablets behave better than the ipad. I have the 'kindle' fire hdx & have installed play store & other apps to get & read books. Comparisons could do better with 'similar' type hardware as the purposes are for different uses.

I have an ipad 6th gen which will not even recognize the ios user guide when the book is moved to a different folder with a "unrecognizable format"; had to relocate the book back to the original place. Cannot even use another reader, fbreader, marvin, mapleread, to read the ios user guide; as ios don't recognize the format ibooks won't read the book. Had me not to be concerned about books from apple.

Kobo e-ink have their own restrictions & do believe that the kobo tablets have more freedom.
So you had to modify your fire hdx in order to gain access to other bookstores.

And you’re basing everything about apples ebooks around reading the users guide. Which also really has nothing to do with Apples walled garden. And you note you’ve got a plethora of third party reading apps on the iPad.
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Old 04-29-2019, 04:41 AM   #75
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So you had to modify your fire hdx in order to gain access to other bookstores.
No, you just change a standard Android setting to allow installation of APK files.
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