Page Numbers in Nook & Kobo vs Kindle

[GoodCompany]

Greetings. I started e-reading with the Sony PRS-350 Reader Pocket Edition (5" screen) which served me well for many years. A few months back I bought my first Kindle, the basic version, and am somewhat disappointed. I bought a Kindle as my reading habits run more to the niche market that Amazon caters to and Kobo does not. I thought it would be nice to not be converting and side-loading everything for a change, and the Kindle does have some features I thought I would enjoy and I do. I have one major frustration however. The Sony Reader gave you page numbers for every single book, small press or not, converted or not. I really don't like reading without some idea where I am in a book. Location 627 or 19% doesn't really cut it for me. Kindle does give you page numbers for mainstream books, but several of the last ones I've purchased have been without. Amazon say it's up to the publisher whether to include page numbers or not, but how did Sony figure out how to include page numbers on all books all those years ago and the developers at Amazon still haven't? So...my question is, do Nook or Kobo behave like the Kindle (some books have page numbers, some don't) or like the Sony? I haven't been on the forum for a while and just read about the Nook Glow 3 which definitely has me intrigued (Night Mode very appealing). I also just saw an article on a google search from 2013 where you could download apps for Kindle and Playstore on the Nook, but then saw something that contradicts that. Gosh that would be great. Do the new Nooks allow that? At any rate, if anyone can enlighten me on the Nook & Kobo page numbering issue, that would be swell. Many thanks!

[Terisa de morgan]

I don't know about Nook but Kobo behaves as Sony as both of them relies on the same support (Adobe reader) and the page number is not something manually added but calculated.

[HarryT]

I would also note that if you send a book to the Kindle using Calibre, it will always have (again, calculated) page numbers.

[robko]

As I understand it, the Kindle "true" numbers that you are talking about reflect the actual pages in a particular edition of the paper version of the book.
Kobo, Nook, Sony, Adobe Digital Editions are using "artificial" pages calculated on a certain number of characters equaling one "page" (# of pages is independent of font size, margins etc) OR (at least in the case of Kobo's own book format) the number of "screens" of text at the current font size/margin/line spacing settings (so if you increase the font size the total number of pages will go up). Since it sounds like you just want the relative position in the book for your own information any of these should work (if you're trying to share a specific page with someone else it gets more complicated).

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by robko

As I understand it, the Kindle "true" numbers that you are talking about reflect the actual pages in a particular edition of the paper version of the book.

That's correct. They are in a separate ".apnx" file which is present for some books you download from Amazon, but not for others. It's up to the publisher to provide it. If you send books to the Kindle using Calibre, the Kindle driver in Calibre generates a ".apnx" file using calculations similar to those used by ADE-based readers.

Kobo, Nook, Sony, Adobe Digital Editions are using "artificial" pages calculated on a certain number of characters equaling one "page" (# of pages is independent of font size, margins etc) OR (at least in the case of Kobo's own book format) the number of "screens" of text at the current font size/margin/line spacing settings (so if you increase the font size the total number of pages will go up). Since it sounds like you just want the relative position in the book for your own information any of these should work (if you're trying to share a specific page with someone else it gets more complicated).

Yep.

[barryem]

I think it's worth getting used to using locations and percentages as they're really a lot more relevant in ebooks. Like you I found them confusing and unintuitive at first but once I learned what they were and got used to them they became more meaningful than page numbers.

As I recall a location is 128 character spaces in the book, including invisible characters for formatting. The advantage of that is that it remains constant regardless of font size or margins. You can use that to go right where you want to go, where page numbers get you fairly close.

When I begin a book I'll usually make a mental note of how many locations are in it. On the Kindle you'll find that with the Goto button. From then on I pretty much know where I am if I want to.

Actually i go more by percentages these days but I have the bottom of the page show time left in chapter so I don't normall see either while I'm in the book. I don't really care that much anyway.

I think the best handling of this is in the Moon+ app on Android. They have a number at the bottom like (7/9) meaning you're on screen 7 of the 9 screens in the chapter. If you change the font size those numbers also change but since you see both you kind of know where you are in the chapter. Then off to the right there's the percentage of the way through the book. I wish all readers did it like this.

Barry

[Hemmi]

I dislike that about my Kindle also. Can't get used to it at all. Between that and no page turn buttons, I don't understand how anyone prefers Kindles.

I've never had an ereader that doesn't show page numbers. All my Sonys do, my Nooks, and my lone Kobo. It's only the Kindle that doesn't have it.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by Hemmi

I dislike that about my Kindle also. Can't get used to it at all. Between that and no page turn buttons, I don't understand how anyone prefers Kindles.

Well, I'm with you on this, but I still prefer Kindles. I just prefer the models with buttons - Voyage and Oasis. As for page numbers, I sideload all my books from Calibre and the main reason for this is to get page numbers on my Kindles. I just couldn't get used to locations. But Calibre-generated numbers are perfect for me.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by Hemmi

I dislike that about my Kindle also. Can't get used to it at all. Between that and no page turn buttons, I don't understand how anyone prefers Kindles.

I'm curious as to why you consider ADE's computed page numbers to be superior to the Kindle's equally computed positions. Both are a construct, and bear no relation to the printed page.

[Hemmi]

Page numbers are something I understand. Read a paper book, and there are page numbers. If I read an e-book, I want to see that same thing. It has much more meaning to me than location which is useless. I'd turn that off if I could. Luckily, I have many other ereaders to choose from that give me what I want.

[HarryT]

ADE page numbers and Kindle locations are both numbers which show your position in a book. Neither has any connection with actual "pages".

The overwhelming majority of Amazon's books do have page numbers (which do correspond to pages in a printed book). If you send books to your Kindle using Calibre, every book will have (fake) page numbers.

[JSWolf]

If you read an ePub eBook on a nook and you read the same ePub on a Kobo, you will have the exact same page numbers as they both use ADE page numbers. If you read an ePub converted to kepub (via Kobo's store or a Calibre plugin) then you don't get page numbers that make the nook at all.

Kindle page numbers do not match Kobo or nook.

[GoodCompany]

Thank you so much for the help! Delighted to see that working through Calibre absolutely does the trick. Correct, "artificial" page numbers are just fine as I'm not in a classroom or book club situation. While I realize for most readers the majority of Amazon's books will come with page numbers, the last five I've purchased did not, hence the frustration. Though I currently share Hemmi's feelings, Barryem and HarryT -- interesting perspectives.

[4691mls]

The Sony page numbers seem to be only approximate anyway - typically the numbers at the bottom of one page will read something like "page 97-98 of 300", then the next one is "page 98-99". I have occasionally seen a book where one page would be 97-98, the next would be 98, and the next 98-99.

I would be OK with having a percentage instead of a page number if the percentage were based on the actual book and not the book plus any excerpts, etc. that follow The Overdrive app, which I use occasionally, just shows a "book progress" percentage based on everything so I don't know how much is left in the actual story. At least with the Sony page numbering system I can look at the table of contents to see what page the book ends and subsequent stuff begins, so I have some idea what is left in the story itself.

[dordale]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

IIf you read an ePub converted to kepub (via Kobo's store or a Calibre plugin) then you don't get page numbers that make the nook at all.

This is incorrect--if you convert ePubs to kepubs via Calibre, the resulting kepub will still have ADE page numbers. If you set the Kobo to display page numbers for the entire book, it will display ADE page numbers. If you have it set to display page numbers for the current chapter, it will display "screen counts" which change when font size, margins, and line spacing changes. I personally haven't bought any kePubs from Kobo, but I'm betting this is how they work as well.