Audible lawsuit

[skinmaan]

ModMonkey, feel free to move this to News if it belongs there.

http://the-digital-reader.com/2017/0...aring-credits/

Digital audiobook seller Audible Inc. and its parent company Amazon.com Inc. on Friday were hit with a putative class action suit in California federal court by a consumer alleging he was trapped in a “shell game” that violates gift card laws and deprived him of using credits he earned.

Basically, this is about lost credits due to how long you hold on to them. I know people have lost credits like this and not always gotten love from Audible when you complain. I can only hope this suit will get Audible to update their policy.

skinmaan

[melmac]

It's always annoyed me that they take them away once you have too many to my mind I paid for it's mine they have no right to take it back. Having said that they have always reinstated it with no problems whenever it has happened usually takes just a minute on chat and it's done.

[tubemonkey]

Originally Posted by skinmaan

ModMonkey, feel free to move this to News if it belongs there.

http://the-digital-reader.com/2017/0...aring-credits/

Basically, this is about lost credits due to how long you hold on to them. I know people have lost credits like this and not always gotten love from Audible when you complain. I can only hope this suit will get Audible to update their policy.

skinmaan

They need to quit doing this. What's the rush? The credits are already paid for. Audible has their money, so why should they care when the credits are used?

[skinmaan]

I'm usually not one for the whole class action thing, but in this case I wish them the best of luck. Audible's policy on this is draconian, and even if they have relented on a case-by-case basis that only makes it worse. It means an uneven hand is at work and you are at their mercy, so to speak.

[pwalker8]

Class action lawsuits is a fairly blunt instrument. In most cases, it's not going to achieve the desired result. With that said, this is one reason that I stick with my current membership which is simply a discount rather than monthly credits. I tend to buy in bulk at irregular intervals depending on when books that I'm interested in are available.

[AnemicOak]

I remember the old days at Audible when your credits didn't even roll over to the next month.

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by AnemicOak

I remember the old days at Audible when your credits didn't even roll over to the next month.

Yikes! Is that the REALLY OLD Audible? Because I have the old Audible that lets me roll over more credits than they allow now, for my plan. Sometimes I think of switching plans, but I haven't wanted to lose the extended roll-over I have now.

[pwalker8]

I have a different plan for my niece and nephew where they get 12 credits, all at the start of the year. Since all the credits are normally used up by the end of summer, I have no idea what sort of roll over they have.

[tubemonkey]

What are Audible plans and benefits?

What happens if I do not use my monthly or yearly Audible credits?

Pick an Annual Audible Membership Plan

[AnemicOak]

Originally Posted by FizzyWater

Yikes! Is that the REALLY OLD Audible? Because I have the old Audible that lets me roll over more credits than they allow now, for my plan. Sometimes I think of switching plans, but I haven't wanted to lose the extended roll-over I have now.

Yes, really old. Back when you could do more than two credits a month on a monthly membership. I know there was one that was like $29.95 a month for 5 credits, but like I said no rollover. You had to use all of those credits of lose them. IIRC they rolled out new plans in 2005 and they're more or less unchanged [1 credit, 2 credits and the annual plans] from how they are now (some of the rollover terms may have changed).

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

They need to quit doing this. What's the rush? The credits are already paid for. Audible has their money, so why should they care when the credits are used?

Simple: bookkeeping.

For instance: I buy 10 credits for $100 this year, but I don't spend them. Which means that the company I buy those credits from has $100 profit (they got my money and gave me back nothing in return).
So, the next year, I don't spend anything, but those 10 credits I bought the year before. That means the company has a $100 loss. That they made $100 profit last year doesn't matter, that was last year. This year is this year.

Naturally, I'm absolutely no bookkeeper, so I probably put it down waaaaaay too simple, but it is the bottom line.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

Simple: bookkeeping.

For instance: I buy 10 credits for $100 this year, but I don't spend them. Which means that the company I buy those credits from has $100 profit (they got my money and gave me back nothing in return).
So, the next year, I don't spend anything, but those 10 credits I bought the year before. That means the company has a $100 loss. That they made $100 profit last year doesn't matter, that was last year. This year is this year.

Naturally, I'm absolutely no bookkeeper, so I probably put it down waaaaaay too simple, but it is the bottom line.

Most coupons expire at some point, just like checks become void after a certain time. It's probably not realistic to expect credits to remain on the books forever. O'Reilly books gives monthly download credits for online books and those credits expire after 3 or 4 months, so it's a very common business model. I suspect the real reason is simply because that's how we have always done it rather than specific intent.

[FizzyWater]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

Simple: bookkeeping.

For instance: I buy 10 credits for $100 this year, but I don't spend them. Which means that the company I buy those credits from has $100 profit (they got my money and gave me back nothing in return).
So, the next year, I don't spend anything, but those 10 credits I bought the year before. That means the company has a $100 loss. That they made $100 profit last year doesn't matter, that was last year. This year is this year.

Naturally, I'm absolutely no bookkeeper, so I probably put it down waaaaaay too simple, but it is the bottom line.

This is actually true of gift-cards, too. My mother used to work retail, and she hated how much her company would push gift cards at Christmas time. When people actually used them, she wasn't able to include those as "earnings" because as far as the company was concerned, they already had the money.

Enough people complained and got the law changed to say if you ask a person to give you money today so they can spend it at your store later, you actually have to allow them to spend it when they wish.

I think Audible has always been careful to call these "credits" so they can say that people are making their purchases, they're buying "credits", but credits have a limited lifespan. And they certainly tell you that up-front - I knew it from the first time I signed up for the service (got an Audible gift card from my dad, who did NOT know he was basically signing me up for a recurring fee).

I'm not saying I think it's fair to lose credits. I'm just saying that it's not something that's been hidden in the fine print, and that Audible's legal gymnastics have helped them so far.

It might turn out that they have to work more like "Groupon". You "buy" a credit, which allows you to purchase any audibook, regardless of the price difference between the cost of the book and the price you paid for the credit. But after ... 6 months, 1 year, whatever ... it converts to actual money and you have to spend it $1-to-$1 for audibooks at the member price.

[Catlady]

But Audible isn't giving an expiration date for credits; they're limiting the number that you can roll over, and they're making keeping credits contingent on keeping a membership. Seems to me that's a big difference.

And when Audible gives a coupon, they don't tell you at all what the expiration date is; they just suddenly disappear the amount at some point.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by Catlady

But Audible isn't giving an expiration date for credits; they're limiting the number that you can roll over, and they're making keeping credits contingent on keeping a membership. Seems to me that's a big difference.

Saying that you can only roll over so many credits, is saying that you need to spend the rest before a certain date, ergo, an expiration date.
And I don't understand that " keeping credits contingent on keeping a membership". I've not had a membership in years, but that never stopped me from accessing any books I have bought before...