Ishmael, Story of B, Etc

Gideon · 03-22-2008, 05:42 AM

I don't believe these books are available in eBook format, but I'm anxious to get some other viewpoints about these books and hopefully, bibliophiles that we are, others have read them.

I read Ishmael a couple of years ago, and just finished reading The Story of B for a class I'm TA-ing (it's being used as a sort of intro book for a lower division class on meaning and culture - just something approachable to get some of the less trained students in the game.)

At any rate, finishing the Story of B I was really left with exactly the same impression I had of Ishmael... "Hmm... that sounds about right, I suppose. Now what?" Now, letting go of all the factual issues.. his essential thesis is the way we are living is not a way that can sustain us indefinitely. Pretty easy to agree there. And the books are long explanations of that from evolutionary and cultural perspectives....

But Quinn never actually gives you anything to work with in the end! It's great that someone is explaining some of these problems (I suppose) but "Now what?"!! The best I can gather is he is suggesting some sort of neo-tribalism, which is clearly out of the question. And thus his ideas more or less become nonsense.

Anyway, that is my frustration. I'm anxious to hear other ideas.

brecklundin · 04-06-2008, 05:56 AM

They are not. I actually bought the Ishmael book because I was sitting beside a really nice lady at Starbucks one day and happened to notice the title. I had previously noticed the title was to be had on Audible. But after speaking with her for an hour or more on the book I had yet to read, I was sold it is going to be a great read.

not sure I will get out of it what many others seem too. but for me I seem to get a lot from the writing of Edward Abbey, everything from Monkey Wrench Gang to Desert Solitaire [awesome non-fiction book about living and appreciating the American desert areas]) His writing has truly influenced my life as much as any author. So I have an appreciation of what people seem to get from Quinn's writings.

I am waiting for the right time when i feel up to hold a book long enough to read but will get to it before Spring is done I hope.

JSWolf · 04-06-2008, 07:16 AM

Ishmael is a Star Trek book by Barbara Hambly. It's a rather good one too. it's out of print. But it is available as an eBook.

http://www.simonsays.com/content/boo...=9780743419741

brecklundin · 04-08-2008, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Ishmael is a Star Trek book by Barbara Hambly. It's a rather good one too. it's out of print. But it is available as an eBook.

http://www.simonsays.com/content/boo...=9780743419741

Actually the OP's reference was to:

Ishmael: An Adventure of the Mind and Spirit by Daniel Quinn

He is also the author of "The Story of B". Both are said to be quite philosophical and many get a lot of deeper meaning from Quinn's writing.

But yeah, the ST Ishmael was one of the better ST's. I have it around here somewhere or had it...I never can remember...

coolriser092 · 12-14-2008, 07:15 PM

nubbish

lilac_jive · 12-14-2008, 07:40 PM

I had a few friends recommend Ishmael to me, but I never did get around to reading it. Sadly, not available for the Reader yet.

grooks · 12-14-2008, 08:23 PM

For those interested in the Daniel Quinn ideas, there is a 3rd book in that series called 'My Ishmael'.

PKFFW · 12-15-2008, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gideon

I don't believe these books are available in eBook format, but I'm anxious to get some other viewpoints about these books and hopefully, bibliophiles that we are, others have read them.

I read Ishmael a couple of years ago, and just finished reading The Story of B for a class I'm TA-ing (it's being used as a sort of intro book for a lower division class on meaning and culture - just something approachable to get some of the less trained students in the game.)

At any rate, finishing the Story of B I was really left with exactly the same impression I had of Ishmael... "Hmm... that sounds about right, I suppose. Now what?" Now, letting go of all the factual issues.. his essential thesis is the way we are living is not a way that can sustain us indefinitely. Pretty easy to agree there. And the books are long explanations of that from evolutionary and cultural perspectives....

But Quinn never actually gives you anything to work with in the end! It's great that someone is explaining some of these problems (I suppose) but "Now what?"!! The best I can gather is he is suggesting some sort of neo-tribalism, which is clearly out of the question. And thus his ideas more or less become nonsense.

Anyway, that is my frustration. I'm anxious to hear other ideas.

Having read all three in the series I can only agree with you. Definitely left with a feeling of "yeah that's great and totally spot on but what do we do about it?". Unfortunately Quinn doesn't seem to have any suggestions in that direction, or at least no concrete workable ones.

Obviously the main point Quinn was driving at was the fundamental difference between how "tribes" view the world and how we in "modern culture" have come to view the world. His idea of Takers and Leavers. At the crux of this difference is the false belief we in modern culture seem to hold so dear that states how we live, the path we have taken, etc is just "human nature", implying that it can be no other way. His examination of this belief in the light of the fact that tribal societies have lived for thousands of years, and continue to do so today, quite differently to us is an attempt to open the readers mind to the possibility that things can be different. This is the first step in finding a solution to the problems we are faced with.

I think the books work very well in that regard. Many I know who have read the books have been left with the same feeling of "what now?" but they have also been left thinking about the issues and thinking about what they may do personally to make a difference. Hopefully as this idea/message spreads, someone might eventually read the book and be prompted to think of the issues and might just be the person who does come up with a workable suggestion.

Cheers,
PKFFW

BlackVoid · 12-16-2008, 05:04 AM

I would love to read these books, it is a real shame that they are not available in ebook format.

As for "Now what?", there are many books and internet resources available.
Like this, but there are man others.
http://www.energybulletin.net/

If we are not downsizing our consumption and population, then nature will do it for us. It is not going to be pretty. And the real problem is, that likely we are at the tipping point. Resources (especially oil) are depleting fast.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ulxe1ie-vEY

grooks · 12-16-2008, 02:26 PM

For those you liked the Daniel Quinn books, two other books that you may like:

Mutant Message Down Under by Marlo Morgan
Celestine Prophecy by James Redfield (1st book in a series)

Both are available as ebooks through Fictionwise, BooksonBoard and Sony.

03-22-2008, 05:42 AM	#1
Gideon Wearer of Pants Posts: 1,050 Karma: 7634 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Norman, OK Device: Amazon Kindle DX / iPhone	Ishmael, Story of B, Etc I don't believe these books are available in eBook format, but I'm anxious to get some other viewpoints about these books and hopefully, bibliophiles that we are, others have read them. I read Ishmael a couple of years ago, and just finished reading The Story of B for a class I'm TA-ing (it's being used as a sort of intro book for a lower division class on meaning and culture - just something approachable to get some of the less trained students in the game.) At any rate, finishing the Story of B I was really left with exactly the same impression I had of Ishmael... "Hmm... that sounds about right, I suppose. Now what?" Now, letting go of all the factual issues.. his essential thesis is the way we are living is not a way that can sustain us indefinitely. Pretty easy to agree there. And the books are long explanations of that from evolutionary and cultural perspectives.... But Quinn never actually gives you anything to work with in the end! It's great that someone is explaining some of these problems (I suppose) but "Now what?"!! The best I can gather is he is suggesting some sort of neo-tribalism, which is clearly out of the question. And thus his ideas more or less become nonsense. Anyway, that is my frustration. I'm anxious to hear other ideas.

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04-06-2008, 05:56 AM	#2
brecklundin Banned Posts: 1,906 Karma: 15348 Join Date: Jun 2007 Device: mine	They are not. I actually bought the Ishmael book because I was sitting beside a really nice lady at Starbucks one day and happened to notice the title. I had previously noticed the title was to be had on Audible. But after speaking with her for an hour or more on the book I had yet to read, I was sold it is going to be a great read. not sure I will get out of it what many others seem too. but for me I seem to get a lot from the writing of Edward Abbey, everything from Monkey Wrench Gang to Desert Solitaire [awesome non-fiction book about living and appreciating the American desert areas]) His writing has truly influenced my life as much as any author. So I have an appreciation of what people seem to get from Quinn's writings. I am waiting for the right time when i feel up to hold a book long enough to read but will get to it before Spring is done I hope.

04-06-2008, 07:16 AM	#3
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 73,897 Karma: 128597114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	Ishmael is a Star Trek book by Barbara Hambly. It's a rather good one too. it's out of print. But it is available as an eBook. http://www.simonsays.com/content/boo...=9780743419741

12-14-2008, 07:15 PM	#5
coolriser092 Junior Member Posts: 1 Karma: 10 Join Date: Dec 2008 Device: none	nubbish

12-14-2008, 07:40 PM	#6
lilac_jive Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,870 Karma: 27376 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Device: PRS-505	I had a few friends recommend Ishmael to me, but I never did get around to reading it. Sadly, not available for the Reader yet.

12-14-2008, 08:23 PM	#7
grooks Wizard Posts: 1,326 Karma: 30250 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Fort Myers, FL Device: Pocketbook Era, Kobo Forma	For those interested in the Daniel Quinn ideas, there is a 3rd book in that series called 'My Ishmael'.

12-16-2008, 05:04 AM	#9
BlackVoid Evangelist Posts: 415 Karma: 510423 Join Date: Nov 2006 Device: Sony PRS-505	I would love to read these books, it is a real shame that they are not available in ebook format. As for "Now what?", there are many books and internet resources available. Like this, but there are man others. http://www.energybulletin.net/ If we are not downsizing our consumption and population, then nature will do it for us. It is not going to be pretty. And the real problem is, that likely we are at the tipping point. Resources (especially oil) are depleting fast. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ulxe1ie-vEY

12-16-2008, 02:26 PM	#10
grooks Wizard Posts: 1,326 Karma: 30250 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Fort Myers, FL Device: Pocketbook Era, Kobo Forma	For those you liked the Daniel Quinn books, two other books that you may like: Mutant Message Down Under by Marlo Morgan Celestine Prophecy by James Redfield (1st book in a series) Both are available as ebooks through Fictionwise, BooksonBoard and Sony.

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