8+ Readers in comparison

[emai7s2]

Originally Posted by mgmueller

… I haven't used Android for a while. And when fumbling around with it, I remember why. For me, clearly #3 behind iOS and Windows 8. iOS = #1 as a gadget. Windows 8 = #1 as a business tool. Android = ?! … But I really come to despise Android. I hate those permanent updates of system apps … in general, I'm done with Android. It doesn't have a single advantage over iOS or Windows 8, but quite a few disadvantages...

Hi mgmueller,

I don't quite follow your comparisons - are you comparing only smartphone OS's, or are you comparing Android to desktop systems?

I've been using Android a few years, and generally speaking, it's worked pretty well. I've never used other smartphones, so I don't know what drawbacks it might have compared to iOS or Windows.

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by emai7s2

Hi mgmueller,

I don't quite follow your comparisons - are you comparing only smartphone OS's, or are you comparing Android to desktop systems?

I've been using Android a few years, and generally speaking, it's worked pretty well. I've never used other smartphones, so I don't know what drawbacks it might have compared to iOS or Windows.

I'm only comparing tablet OS, I'm not into smartphones.
I'm comparing iOS (iPad mini Retina), Android (Google Nexus 7, Nvidia Shield Tablet, ....) and Windows 8 (Microsoft Surface Pro 3, Dell Venue 8 Pro, ...).

I'm a stickler for details. Once I've found something that bothers me, I can't forget about it.
The update process of stock apps (calendar, mail, ...) is such a thing on Android.

Update process on iOS: You don't get updates for stock apps. From time to time, maybe every 2 months, there's a big update from Apple and the entire OS gets an upgrade. Simple, smooth, intransparent. Nothing to bother.

Update process on Windows 8: You get frequent updates, often a few times per day. You decide what to update, you can delete and reinstall. A bit complicated, not quite so smooth, absolutely transparent.

Update process on Android: You get frequent updates, almost as often as on Windows 8. With root, you see how it works: The stock apps are in ROM. The original in ROM gets deactivated and the update in user memory gets activated instead. I hate such things. With root you can move from user memory to ROM, but you never know what will happen. Relatively complicated, not smooth at all, semi-transparent.

Either hide it all, as on iOS. Or make it all user-manageable. But Android is somewhere in-between and, to me, clearly the worst of the 3.

[emai7s2]

Originally Posted by mgmueller

I'm only comparing tablet OS, I'm not into smartphones. I'm comparing iOS (iPad mini Retina), Android (Google Nexus 7, Nvidia Shield Tablet, ....) and Windows 8 (Microsoft Surface Pro 3, Dell Venue 8 Pro, ...).

Ok, thanks, I understand now.

The Surface Pro 3 looks like a very compelling machine, but I wish Microsoft had packaged it better. Somehow having to spend top dollar on a machine, and then pay extra on top of that for the keyboard is just irritating. I know that's irrational but I suspect many feel the same way.

The funny thing is I didn't blink an eye to buy an Apple Newton for $1200 back in the day, and also paid extra for additional memory ($250 /20mb) and for a keyboard. So the market has involved and radically changed expectations.

So in terms of price/performance, the Surface Pro 3 is actually far better than what I'm used to.

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by emai7s2

...The funny thing is I didn't blink an eye to buy an Apple Newton for $1200 back in the day, and also paid extra for additional memory ($250 /20mb) and for a keyboard. So the market has involved and radically changed expectations....

That's the odd thing!
In 2002, I've paid 4000 Euros for a fantastic Toshiba notebook. Satellite Pro xxx.
A few years later, prices dropped to less than 1500 Euros.
Or even more extreme:
About 30 years ago, I've paid 700 German Marks (= 350 Euros nowadays) for a disk drive for my beloved Commodore 64! A game back then was 100 German Marks. Nowadays consumers find 5 Euros for an iOS game expensive...
And I guess, this decline in prices is one of the main reasons for the parallel decline of quality...

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by mgmueller

I'm only comparing tablet OS, I'm not into smartphones.
I'm comparing iOS (iPad mini Retina), Android (Google Nexus 7, Nvidia Shield Tablet, ....) and Windows 8 (Microsoft Surface Pro 3, Dell Venue 8 Pro, ...).

I'm a stickler for details. Once I've found something that bothers me, I can't forget about it.
The update process of stock apps (calendar, mail, ...) is such a thing on Android.

I have no clue what you mean by this... I've had a HTC Flyer for 3 years and only ever saw one update (which I didn't install as I went for the custom rom instead). And I had to manually start searching for it...

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

I have no clue what you mean by this... I've had a HTC Flyer for 3 years and only ever saw one update (which I didn't install as I went for the custom rom instead). And I had to manually start searching for it...

I mean updates of the apps, not the OS.
iOS, for example, doesn't update the stock apps, but puts them all in an update of the OS.
Android not only is updating the 3rd party apps, but the stock apps (Google Maps, Google Mail, ...) as well.
For those stock apps, the original remains in ROM, but gets de-activated. You sees this in settings (all apps, not just under the downloaded ones) as well: You can't uninstall those apps, only disable them.
If you root your tablet, this becomes perfectly transparent. You can move the update to ROM then, thus overwriting the original. If then you reset your unit, the updated app is present already.
Most won't bother, but personally I find those double apps annoying.
There are frequent updates to the stock apps, almost daily. After less than a week you've got dozens such double apps...
That's one of the main reasons, why I root my Androids...

[Sweetpea]

I rooted my first Android because I wanted a custom ROM and the second one because I didn't want some of the "default" apps that came with it (Samsung is really bad in that regard!)

I never noticed that it installed a new version beside the old one instead of updating the existing one...

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

...I never noticed that it installed a new version beside the old one instead of updating the existing one...

Unfortunately, that's the downside of an "open" OS. It's way more transparent than iOS.
Same as you, I rooted first to get rid of some pre-installed bloatware.
Then I checked about the updates. In the app settings, you see "uninstall updates". When doing so, the original from ROM remains. So I used the root, to move the updates over to ROM. It's a tricky process and it doesn't always work. Quite bothersome.
But since I saw the doublets, it annoys me...

[Glorfindel]

Originally Posted by mgmueller

But since I saw the doublets, it annoys me...

It's like in chess, once you notice the pieces aren't centered, you become obsessed

[Glorfindel]

I would get it sooner than a iBend

[mgmueller]

First impressions:

I like the touch and feel. Not quite iPad quality, but close enough.
I'd describe it "somewhere between Apple and Samsung".

So far, I love the OS and functionality.
Example:
In WiFi settings, I can prioritize my WiFis.
I hate it, when my iPad chooses the stronger, albeit significantly slower one in some areas in my house.

The keyboard works great.
The letters are in 3 physical rows.
A fourth row with context sensitive additional keys is on the screen.
The physical keyboard is my main reason for loving BlackBerry. I tend to write lengthy emails and especially in taxis and on bumpy roads I'm not a fan of touch keyboards. And they simply cover lot of screen estate. Might not be that big a problem on phablets like iPhone 6+ anymore, but still is not perfect in my opinion.

The OS obviously is based on the one we found on BlackBerry Playbook (which I loved as well and which at its time had been way ahead of iOS and Android, but simply died due to lack of apps).
One swipe from the top opens the settings menu of the respective screen/app you're on. One swipe from the bottom puts the app into the background for multi-tasking.
Of course I can use my PlayBook ID, so I should have some apps for download already.
So I'll head over to the BlackBerry app store now and after that to the Amazon app store, in which I should have plenty of apps as well.

Scrolling via the physical keyboard works great!

Interesting enough, it's less bulky than I had expected. The screen is huge of course and the square form of course adds some bulk. But the 3 key rows are smaller than I (for whatever reason) would have thought. I easily could imagine myself using it as a phone, although I certainly will use a headset anyway...

So far, I really like it.
It very much reminds me of BlackBerry PlayBook: Great OS, serious lack of apps. Thank goodness, this time at least they've added the Amazon App Store. I still miss all the Google apps and probably will try to side load them. But at least for the standard apps I don't have to fumble around with Java and stuff, like before on PlayBook.

The keyboard is great, nothing to criticize there.

With the Snap app, I can install my apps from Google Play. Not all are working well on the square screen, but now I've got 3 sources: BlackBerry store, Amazon App store, (kind of) Google Play. I search exactly in that order: BlackBerry store, as those apps tend to be optimized to the screen format. Amazon App store, after all it comes pre-installed. Snap as my "last resort". I still can't find all apps respectively some need Google Play services and others crash for no apparent reason. But I find maybe 80% and those are mere gadgets anyway.

There's one slight disappointment: As on iOS; I can't add "real" signatures to emails. I can add pure text and some HTML. But no CI-conform signatures with logos, corporate fonts and such. I guess, this really only can be done in Outlook to full extent. So I still will take some Windows tablet with me, when on the road. But BlackBerry Passport probably can be my main companion for a quick note or mail or message "on the fly". I'm not even that much faster on the relatively small keyboard than on touch keyboards. But I enjoy it much more, it has some more natural "flow".

My momentary verdict:

Pros:
I'm a fan of physical keyboards. Swype as an alternative is great and actually I'm not that much faster with physical keyboards. But I find it way more convenient and can use it under all circumstances (taxi, bumpy road, ...).
The context sensitive prediction works surprisingly well. Often enough, I find the next word already as a suggestion, without having to type a single key.
It efficiently switches between languages automatically.
Battery life is fantastic, I can't make an entire day on my iPhone 4S, but here the battery still holds another 50%.
I like the form and size. I can type with 2 fingers without having to lay it down.
I like the BlackBerry hub, where all the communication is collected in a single app.
I like the OS with its swiping gestures.

Cons:
It very much reminds me of my (once beloved) BlackBerry PlayBook: Great OS, great hardware. Still I rarely us it due to lack of apps.
For the Passport, its a bit better: The Amazon app store comes pre-installed and you find the most important apps there. You can install kind of a portal to your apps in Google Play. But the latter often don't work, they'd need Google Play services. I can install Google Maps, for example, but for now it's not working.
For now, I only miss half a dozen apps or so. But the limited assortment definitely is a bottleneck.

Anyway: I'll replace my iPhone 4S by it still this week.

I really love the job-related possibilities.
Basic stuff, such as syncing my reminders/tasks is so much more convenient than on iPhone.
I don't seem to be able to solve my issues about email signatures and email fonts, though.
Still: Huge improvement over iPhone and definitely my business phone from now on!

Interesting experience:
For most of my gadgets, for example last for NVIDIA Shield Tablet, it's many about tuning it.
On NVIDIA Shield, I've spent a lot of time with rooting, moving apps to the ROM and such.
On BlackBerry Passsport, it's mainly about simply using it. Great experience. I really like it!

A bit annoying:
The Micro SD card is pretty useless. We've seen this before on some Android units, for example. There's no option to move apps or at least content (i.e. maps in navigation or travel apps). There aren't that many interesting apps, so the internal 32GB probably will do. But for now, the SD card only can be used for movies, music and such.

I love the swiping gestures, liked them on BlackBerry PlayBook before as well.
They seem rater trivial, but come quite naturally.

I love the password entry on the start screen.
Haven't seen this method before:
You define a password, as usual.
Additionally, you choose a picture with a grid. And you choose a number.
After that, each time you have to enter the startup-password, you find a matrix of numbers. This matrix changes every time. You look, where you find the number you chose in the matrix. Then you move the entire matrix, until your number aligns with the position on the picture grid you've defined. It can be done in 2 seconds and seems relatively secure to me. Even if somebody would watching me, dragging around the matrix, it would be of no use for the next attempt.

A bit annoying:
Some apps from the Amazon App Store don't work.
Some crash entirely, some simply don't work well on the square screen.
But they all show in the Amazon App Store on the BlackBerry Passport.
Amazon probably isn't responsible: They simply provide a single store, I guess.
But BlackBerry either should implement a filter. Or at least offer a refund, similar to Google.
It's no biggy, the apps are cheap enough. Still, I have bought half a dozen apps I'll never be able to use (no need for those business apps on my Kindle Fire HDs.)

More from time to time...

[emai7s2]

Thanks for the BB report. How about battery life, viewing videos, etc?

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by emai7s2

Thanks for the BB report. How about battery life, viewing videos, etc?

Couldn't test such things yet.
Just setting it up....

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by emai7s2

Thanks for the BB report. How about battery life, viewing videos, etc?

Battery still 92% after 2 hours of "normal usage" (BB Messenger, installing and testing apps).

[mgmueller]

Originally Posted by emai7s2

Thanks for the BB report. How about battery life, viewing videos, etc?

Battery life is benchmark.
My iPhone 4S never makes an entire day, usually the battery is drained around noon.
Here I easily can make an entire day and it still holds up to 50%.

Videos work as expected. The display is great, nothing to complain. Given the square format, you either have to accept black bars or zoom and loose some information.
Not an issue for me, I won't watch movies on such a small display.
But of course the square form can have the same problems with some apps. If they're not optimized to the "exotic" ratio, you either loose information or it gets kind of cramped. Most of the times it's no problem, but sometimes for example the start screen of some apps looks a bit distorted.
I search for apps in the BlackBerry store first. They all work flawlessly. Then I check the Amazon app store. Here it's a bit more critical, but most apps work fine. Of course you don't find everything in Amazon, they lack the entire Google portfolio for example. Last but not least I've sideloaded the app "Snap". Here you can log into your Google Play account and install most apps you find in Google. Only problem: Quite a few Apps (Google, but 3rd party as well) ask for Google Play Services. Without those, Google Maps or Tripadvisor for example don't work. I haven't found a workaround yet, those apps for now simply don't work.