what about limiting certain areas the site until someone has been a member "x" long? - Page 2

daffy4u · 09-25-2010, 02:50 PM

It has helped me to make liberal use of the "ignore" features. I have some posters on ignore, many threads on ignore and some forums (including the Lounge which I check maybe once a week). Makes my life easier.

genegenie · 09-25-2010, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roger the rabbit

What about some way of being able to give negative Karma!
(say a fixed percentage of what the offending poster has).

Then when their K gets below a certain figure or (%age of what they had or %reduction) they can't post for a week, 10 days, or something.

Or will this lead to vigilante (ism) or too complicated.

(Just an idea)

Or will this lead to vigilante (ism)

I think that is very likely, human nature being what it is.

poohbear_nc · 09-25-2010, 03:50 PM

Speaking as a mod - the recent spate of unpleasantness in the llounge - and elsewhere - was quite disturbing - and the mods did their human best to keep up with - and stomp on - both the original offending posters and the resultant sockpuppetry. Members sending in reports as soon as the sockpuppets appeared helped us track them down through many forums. Unfortunately, there are simply individuals who have nothing better to do with their time than try to bring down forums/websites, etc. I don't know - maybe there's a club where they hang out and brag.

It is simply impossible for the mods to keep up with, let alone read, ALL the posts here. We rely on the MR members to alert us when things start to go bad. When you report a post as either spam or for being offensive, your reports go to a central thread that is monitored virtually 24 hours/day - given the spread of mods over the time zones. And EVERY report is read. Sometimes action is taken swiftly. Other times there is a delay, as decisions are made by the group of mods.

So, rather than imposing rules, I encourage all members to alert us as soon as you notice anyone or any post that is spam, offensive, or questionable. The sooner we know something is wrong, the sooner we can act to correct it, or modify the postings. You - the MR members - are the best means of keeping the trolls out of our forums. And I thank you all for helping us "greenies" keep up with that recent rash that KK described in the OP!

Worldwalker · 09-25-2010, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roger the rabbit

What about some way of being able to give negative Karma!
(say a fixed percentage of what the offending poster has).

Then when their K gets below a certain figure or (%age of what they had or %reduction) they can't post for a week, 10 days, or something.

Or will this lead to vigilante (ism) or too complicated.

(Just an idea)

Bad idea. When someone posts a perfectly legal but unpopular idea, they'll get de-karmaed by everyone who disagrees with them. Take the argument I was having with some of the OTW followers regarding the "proper" role of men and women in fanfic. They disagreed with me, strongly (of course, I was right). You think my karma wouldn't have been a smoking crater if they could have done that? And that's just over whether sorting people by sex is a good idea or not. Imagine what would have happened if I'd been defending an unpopular religious viewpoint.

It's not popular speech that needs protection. MR doesn't need to empower mobs.

Worldwalker · 09-25-2010, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poohbear_nc

I don't know - maybe there's a club where they hang out and brag.

That would be 4chan.

poohbear_nc · 09-25-2010, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Worldwalker

That would be 4chan.

How nice for them!

EowynCarter · 09-25-2010, 04:32 PM

Quote:

I belong to two other chat-rooms where you are not able to start a Thread until you have given your opinion (politely) to a subject or asked a question in ten posts.

That's the kind of thing that lead to "Mm, i'll go somewhere else". You really fell welcome when it's considered you're here to troll / spam / whatever...
Innocent until proven guilty anyone ?

It's fine just the way it is.

kindlekitten · 09-25-2010, 05:37 PM

a thread has just been closed that is a perfect example of this. the "delete the koran" thread. disucssions were for the most part amongst regular members going along just fine. there were a series of trolls that came in and Harry deleted their posts which is perfectly understandable. then he closed it. which I don't think is right. the trolls are going to continue to mob any juicy topic in the lounge. I don't want the lounge closed. I think that restricting it to a time as member really might be a good thing. takes you three days to get married, a month to buy a handgun, at least a waiting time to post in the lounge is resonable.

I don't think waiting times in the other forums, especially the device forums is a good idea as many times people come in just a few times when they get their device and have questions that make or break their using experience with it.

negative karma is a bad bad idea. just really bad. paying for membership, while a nice idea might possibly bar some people who have been good members.

I'd really like some more discussion on this. I have a feeling the situation will get worse before it gets better

TGS · 09-25-2010, 05:53 PM

It is worth bearing in mind that trolling only works because people respond to the trolls, (and I'm as guilty as the next person of that). I still think that imposing restrictions on the vast majority of new members in order to prevent a few trolls winding people up for a day at most (and then it is only those people who cannot resist having a quick look at the latest installment of garbage the troll has posted, (again, I include myself in that)), is not the way to go. It's an imperfect world - and I don't think it can be legislated to perfection.

ardeegee · 09-25-2010, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

the trolls are going to continue to mob any juicy topic in the lounge.

Yes, and closed threads is the intent of their actions, not a side effect. They want to silence ideas that they don't agree with.

tompe · 09-25-2010, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

a thread has just been closed that is a perfect example of this. the "delete the koran" thread. disucssions were for the most part amongst regular members going along just fine. there were a series of trolls that came in and Harry deleted their posts which is perfectly understandable. then he closed it. which I don't think is right.

I did not understand why that thread was closed. You cannot remove posts and then close the thread because of the removed posts.

Also closing a thread is letting the people that destroy the thread win.

I really think that threads are closed too often. Why not let the thread live and let people abandon it if it does not work?

kindlekitten · 09-25-2010, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TGS

It is worth bearing in mind that trolling only works because people respond to the trolls, (and I'm as guilty as the next person of that). I still think that imposing restrictions on the vast majority of new members in order to prevent a few trolls winding people up for a day at most (and then it is only those people who cannot resist having a quick look at the latest installment of garbage the troll has posted, (again, I include myself in that)), is not the way to go. It's an imperfect world - and I don't think it can be legislated to perfection.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardeegee

Yes, and closed threads is the intent of their actions, not a side effect. They want to silence ideas that they don't agree with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tompe

I did not understand why that thread was closed. You cannot remove posts and then close the thread because of the removed posts.

Also closing a thread is letting the people that destroy the thread win.

I really think that threads are closed too often. Why not let the thread live and let people abandon it if it does not work?

that's my point. that thread was closed WAY too early. I understand Harry's frustration with the Trolls, but there was good discussion going on. this is as opposed to the "atheist zealot" thread that had been pretty much overtaken by one particular troll and it was obvious it wasn't going to go anywhere.

this most recent thread issue, it seemed like the regulars were doing a pretty good job of dodging the troll bombs and sticking to the topic at hand. we as a group are learning to do that better and better and then to have our good behaviour rewarded with early closure is very disappointing!

anyway... I STILL think it is worth consideration to limit the lounge, and maybe even a few other areas to members that have been around for awhile

Alexander Turcic · 09-25-2010, 06:19 PM

Related to the thread kindlekitten mentions: It's closed while we need to review some posters (with their reappearing sockpuppets) who - as correctly pointed out here - have made it their goal to interrupt the discussion of that particular thread. Looking into that right now.

astra · 09-25-2010, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

a thread has just been closed that is a perfect example of this. the "delete the koran" thread

Apparently, I walked away in time!

Alexander Turcic · 09-25-2010, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

this most recent thread issue, it seemed like the regulars were doing a pretty good job of dodging the troll bombs and sticking to the topic at hand. we as a group are learning to do that better and better and then to have our good behaviour rewarded with early closure is very disappointing!

anyway... I STILL think it is worth consideration to limit the lounge, and maybe even a few other areas to members that have been around for awhile

Alas, it is not that easy. For instance, in this particular thread, the last user who has been interrupting the discussion with racist remarks has been a member here for almost two years, and he has made normal posts in the past. While restricting access may turn away the most obvious of trolls, it's not a solution to prevent some individuals from showing their worst when disagreeing with a topic.

Like I said, we're looking into this and contemplating solutions.

09-25-2010, 06:19 PM	#28
Alexander Turcic Fully Converged Posts: 18,163 Karma: 14021202 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Switzerland Device: Too many to count here.	Related to the thread kindlekitten mentions: It's closed while we need to review some posters (with their reappearing sockpuppets) who - as correctly pointed out here - have made it their goal to interrupt the discussion of that particular thread. Looking into that right now. Last edited by Alexander Turcic; 09-25-2010 at 06:23 PM.

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09-25-2010, 02:50 PM	#16
daffy4u I'm Super Kindle-icious Posts: 6,734 Karma: 2434103 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Long Drive, Calinadia Candafornia Device: KDXG, KT, Oasis	It has helped me to make liberal use of the "ignore" features. I have some posters on ignore, many threads on ignore and some forums (including the Lounge which I check maybe once a week). Makes my life easier.

09-25-2010, 03:50 PM	#18
poohbear_nc Now what? Posts: 58,891 Karma: 135181808 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Durham, NC Device: Every Kindle Ever Made & To Be Made!	Speaking as a mod - the recent spate of unpleasantness in the llounge - and elsewhere - was quite disturbing - and the mods did their human best to keep up with - and stomp on - both the original offending posters and the resultant sockpuppetry. Members sending in reports as soon as the sockpuppets appeared helped us track them down through many forums. Unfortunately, there are simply individuals who have nothing better to do with their time than try to bring down forums/websites, etc. I don't know - maybe there's a club where they hang out and brag. It is simply impossible for the mods to keep up with, let alone read, ALL the posts here. We rely on the MR members to alert us when things start to go bad. When you report a post as either spam or for being offensive, your reports go to a central thread that is monitored virtually 24 hours/day - given the spread of mods over the time zones. And EVERY report is read. Sometimes action is taken swiftly. Other times there is a delay, as decisions are made by the group of mods. So, rather than imposing rules, I encourage all members to alert us as soon as you notice anyone or any post that is spam, offensive, or questionable. The sooner we know something is wrong, the sooner we can act to correct it, or modify the postings. You - the MR members - are the best means of keeping the trolls out of our forums. And I thank you all for helping us "greenies" keep up with that recent rash that KK described in the OP!

09-25-2010, 05:37 PM	#23
kindlekitten Professional Adventuress Posts: 13,368 Karma: 50260224 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: The Olympic Peninsula on the OTHER Washington! (the big green clean one on the west coast!) Device: Kindle, the original! Times Two! and gifting an International Kindle	a thread has just been closed that is a perfect example of this. the "delete the koran" thread. disucssions were for the most part amongst regular members going along just fine. there were a series of trolls that came in and Harry deleted their posts which is perfectly understandable. then he closed it. which I don't think is right. the trolls are going to continue to mob any juicy topic in the lounge. I don't want the lounge closed. I think that restricting it to a time as member really might be a good thing. takes you three days to get married, a month to buy a handgun, at least a waiting time to post in the lounge is resonable. I don't think waiting times in the other forums, especially the device forums is a good idea as many times people come in just a few times when they get their device and have questions that make or break their using experience with it. negative karma is a bad bad idea. just really bad. paying for membership, while a nice idea might possibly bar some people who have been good members. I'd really like some more discussion on this. I have a feeling the situation will get worse before it gets better

09-25-2010, 05:53 PM	#24
TGS Country Member Posts: 9,058 Karma: 7676767 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Denmark Device: Liseuse: Irex DR800. PRS 505 in the house, and the missus has an iPad.	It is worth bearing in mind that trolling only works because people respond to the trolls, (and I'm as guilty as the next person of that). I still think that imposing restrictions on the vast majority of new members in order to prevent a few trolls winding people up for a day at most (and then it is only those people who cannot resist having a quick look at the latest installment of garbage the troll has posted, (again, I include myself in that)), is not the way to go. It's an imperfect world - and I don't think it can be legislated to perfection.

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