Epubs with errors soft-bricking my Kobo

305869 · 05-21-2023, 03:24 PM

When I got my first ereader (a Kobo Libra 2) and didn't know much about the subject I ran into an issue with a particular epub soft bricking the Kobo entirely.

Once the epub was loaded and the Kobo processed it, the entire system became unresponsive. If I did a hard reboot, it would work for about 2-3 seconds and then freeze again. Not enough time to plug it in and remove the epub. The only solution that worked for me was a factory reset using the physical buttons. I did this several times until I figured out it was a particular file causing the problem.

I was told to run it through epubcheck and that epub had over 4000(!!!) errors. I just went and obtained a pdf version instead and the issue was solved.

I've been pretty paranoid about epubs since then since I don't fancy having to factory reset the Kobo again with all the stuff I've got on it. Which sucks because epubs are so much nicer to read than PDFs since they are so customisable. But I find that most of my epubs have errors. Even epubs from legitimate sources can easily have hundreds of errors and I don't know how to fix them all. I tried converting them to a different format and back to epub using Calibre, but this still produces a file with errors. So I don't know what to do to avoid this problem.

I guess I'm looking for any thoughts on this. Has anyone had this issue with a Kobo? How do I know if a file is safe to load onto the Kobo, other than it having 0 errors? I can fix some of the simpler ones with the HTML but some are beyond me to fix, and there's hundreds or thousands of them in some files. I wasn't sure whether to post this on the Kobo forum or the epub forum but I feel like it's a Kobo issue mostly since my other reader can handle those files fine.

Sorry for the long post.

Aleron Ives · 05-21-2023, 04:18 PM

Where are you getting your books? I've bought books from Kobo and gotten free books from Standard E-Books, Project Gutenberg, and my local library, and I've never had a problem with a book crashing my device in this manner.

Karellen · 05-21-2023, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 305869

I've been pretty paranoid about epubs since

It's a pretty naive viewpoint, and its a bit like saying "I once had a flat tyre in my car, so I never want to use a car again..." but I understand you may be out of your depth with epubs or ebooks in general.

I, and many other members here, use epubs exclusively. Yes, most of us have encountered the problem epubs. The problems are not because they are epubs, but because the "idiots" that created or converted the books have a poor understanding of what they are doing. All they really know is how to press a button or two without an understanding of what the process involves. That's when you need to be a bit smarter than them and know how to fix their mistakes.

If you want to put a bit of effort into learning about epubs, you will find that pretty soon, you can fix all those errors "with your eyes closed". Maybe start with this site... https://standardebooks.org/manual/1.7.0/1-code-style to learn the basics.

But with such vague info, nobody will really be able to help you. So post some of the error messages and lets see what they are.

Sirtel · 05-21-2023, 04:45 PM

I don't usually bother to fix any errors unless the book doesn't display correctly on my Kobos. Which doesn't happen often, and I've never had an epub brick a Kobo. I do edit the css of every book I put on my readers, but I do this to fix the formatting, not errors.

I have a couple thousand books on my Kobos. I've had to fix the errors in perhaps a handful of them. Not because there aren't any, but because most errors are relatively harmless and cause no issues.

JSWolf · 05-21-2023, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karellen

If you want to put a bit of effort into learning about epubs, you will find that pretty soon, you can fix all those errors "with your eyes closed". Maybe start with this site... https://standardebooks.org/manual/1.7.0/1-code-style to learn the basics.

I've seen the code Standard eBooks uses. There is no way I would ever try to learn anything from them. They do so much so badly. The code they use is a nightmare.

Keep it simple is the way to do it and they choose keep it as complicated as possible so it doesn't work in all cases when it should.

JSWolf · 05-21-2023, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 305869

When I got my first ereader (a Kobo Libra 2) and didn't know much about the subject I ran into an issue with a particular epub soft bricking the Kobo entirely.

Once the epub was loaded and the Kobo processed it, the entire system became unresponsive. If I did a hard reboot, it would work for about 2-3 seconds and then freeze again. Not enough time to plug it in and remove the epub. The only solution that worked for me was a factory reset using the physical buttons. I did this several times until I figured out it was a particular file causing the problem.

I was told to run it through epubcheck and that epub had over 4000(!!!) errors. I just went and obtained a pdf version instead and the issue was solved.

I've been pretty paranoid about epubs since then since I don't fancy having to factory reset the Kobo again with all the stuff I've got on it. Which sucks because epubs are so much nicer to read than PDFs since they are so customisable. But I find that most of my epubs have errors. Even epubs from legitimate sources can easily have hundreds of errors and I don't know how to fix them all. I tried converting them to a different format and back to epub using Calibre, but this still produces a file with errors. So I don't know what to do to avoid this problem.

I guess I'm looking for any thoughts on this. Has anyone had this issue with a Kobo? How do I know if a file is safe to load onto the Kobo, other than it having 0 errors? I can fix some of the simpler ones with the HTML but some are beyond me to fix, and there's hundreds or thousands of them in some files. I wasn't sure whether to post this on the Kobo forum or the epub forum but I feel like it's a Kobo issue mostly since my other reader can handle those files fine.

Sorry for the long post.

There's no need to be paranoid about ePub if you don't download them from a dodgy source.

Karellen · 05-21-2023, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

I've seen the code Standard eBooks uses. There is no way I would ever try to learn anything from them. They do so much so badly. The code they use is a nightmare.

Keep it simple is the way to do it and they choose keep it as complicated as possible so it doesn't work in all cases when it should.

I don't use that site for any coding. I only used it during my early learning phase to understand the basic and structure of ebooks. I found it quite clear and easy to read. The html/css I learnt elsewhere.

Having said that, I had no idea the site is rated so poorly. It's not something I refer to anymore, but still have the site bookmarked.

305869 · 05-21-2023, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karellen

It's a pretty naive viewpoint, and its a bit like saying "I once had a flat tyre in my car, so I never want to use a car again..." but I understand you may be out of your depth with epubs or ebooks in general.

I, and many other members here, use epubs exclusively. Yes, most of us have encountered the problem epubs. The problems are not because they are epubs, but because the "idiots" that created or converted the books have a poor understanding of what they are doing. All they really know is how to press a button or two without an understanding of what the process involves. That's when you need to be a bit smarter than them and know how to fix their mistakes.

If you want to put a bit of effort into learning about epubs, you will find that pretty soon, you can fix all those errors "with your eyes closed". Maybe start with this site... https://standardebooks.org/manual/1.7.0/1-code-style to learn the basics.

But with such vague info, nobody will really be able to help you. So post some of the error messages and lets see what they are.

Thank you for the link. It's a pretty big deal to me because I had just manually imported my library which is pretty big and tagged everything inside the Kobo which took a couple hours when it happened. So it's a bit more annoying than fixing a flat tire. By the end I was using Calibre to do it so I didn't have to redo it every time it happened but I hate the folder structure that it stores them in so I'd rather not.

I can fix some HTML errors manually, but probably not 4000 of them or even 100. It sounds like a lot of work. I'll definitely post some errors if I attempt fixing some of them and need help, thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aleron Ives

Where are you getting your books? I've bought books from Kobo and gotten free books from Standard E-Books, Project Gutenberg, and my local library, and I've never had a problem with a book crashing my device in this manner.

I think the particular epub file that caused this issue was a free book downloaded from archive.org. I deleted it back when this happened after finding a pdf version

Aleron Ives · 05-21-2023, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karellen

I had no idea the site is rated so poorly.

It isn't. Standard E-Books does good work, and its books are a step up from Project Gutenberg IME.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 305869

I think the particular epub file that caused this issue was a free book downloaded from archive.org.

IMHO the simplest solution to your problem is to get your books from more reputable sources to increase the likelihood that they aren't a disaster under the hood.

Quoth · 05-21-2023, 05:29 PM

The archive org (Internet Archive AKA Wayback machine) simply scrapes the OCR layer of the PDF (made from scan saved as TIFF) as a mobi or epub. Just NEVER download anything other than a PDF (or TIFF for your own OCR) from them, and only if no-one else has it (inc buying from Amazon, Kobo etc). Their quality is abysmal.

305869 · 05-21-2023, 05:35 PM

I will keep that in mind, thank you

Karellen · 05-21-2023, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 305869

I can fix some HTML errors manually, but probably not 4000 of them

That is a phenomenal amount of errors in one book. Sounds like a problem at the paragraph level. Probably one well placed edit could fix most of those errors.

DNSB · 05-21-2023, 06:54 PM

For what it is worth, I run all my ebooks through Sigil/epubcheck (I prefer Sigil to calibre's ebook editor for most tasks) before sending them to my ereaders. I have seldom seen as many errors as you seem to be seeing and those few were from sources such as one book from archive.org where the program they are using to convert to epub seems to have been written by someone who once heard there are epub specifications but never bothered to look at them.

Oddly the one from archive.org was a relatively quick fix since 99% of the errors were from a paragraph style that incorrectly specified a width using a syntax that was never part of the various CSS versions. After that, the issues from a PDF to epub conversion were left (paragraphs split, images at random locations, etc.).

JSWolf · 05-22-2023, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aleron Ives

It isn't. Standard E-Books does good work, and its books are a step up from Project Gutenberg IME.

When their ePub fails in ADE when there is no need for it, that's bad code.

05-21-2023, 03:24 PM	#1
305869 Connoisseur Posts: 95 Karma: 28344 Join Date: Mar 2023 Device: Kobo Libra 2, Boox Leaf 7"	Epubs with errors soft-bricking my Kobo When I got my first ereader (a Kobo Libra 2) and didn't know much about the subject I ran into an issue with a particular epub soft bricking the Kobo entirely. Once the epub was loaded and the Kobo processed it, the entire system became unresponsive. If I did a hard reboot, it would work for about 2-3 seconds and then freeze again. Not enough time to plug it in and remove the epub. The only solution that worked for me was a factory reset using the physical buttons. I did this several times until I figured out it was a particular file causing the problem. I was told to run it through epubcheck and that epub had over 4000(!!!) errors. I just went and obtained a pdf version instead and the issue was solved. I've been pretty paranoid about epubs since then since I don't fancy having to factory reset the Kobo again with all the stuff I've got on it. Which sucks because epubs are so much nicer to read than PDFs since they are so customisable. But I find that most of my epubs have errors. Even epubs from legitimate sources can easily have hundreds of errors and I don't know how to fix them all. I tried converting them to a different format and back to epub using Calibre, but this still produces a file with errors. So I don't know what to do to avoid this problem. I guess I'm looking for any thoughts on this. Has anyone had this issue with a Kobo? How do I know if a file is safe to load onto the Kobo, other than it having 0 errors? I can fix some of the simpler ones with the HTML but some are beyond me to fix, and there's hundreds or thousands of them in some files. I wasn't sure whether to post this on the Kobo forum or the epub forum but I feel like it's a Kobo issue mostly since my other reader can handle those files fine. Sorry for the long post.

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05-21-2023, 04:18 PM	#2
Aleron Ives Wizard Posts: 1,026 Karma: 11500112 Join Date: Sep 2022 Device: Kobo Libra 2	Where are you getting your books? I've bought books from Kobo and gotten free books from Standard E-Books, Project Gutenberg, and my local library, and I've never had a problem with a book crashing my device in this manner.

05-21-2023, 04:45 PM	#4
Sirtel Grand Sorcerer Posts: 10,147 Karma: 224760044 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Estonia Device: Kobo Sage & Libra 2	I don't usually bother to fix any errors unless the book doesn't display correctly on my Kobos. Which doesn't happen often, and I've never had an epub brick a Kobo. I do edit the css of every book I put on my readers, but I do this to fix the formatting, not errors. I have a couple thousand books on my Kobos. I've had to fix the errors in perhaps a handful of them. Not because there aren't any, but because most errors are relatively harmless and cause no issues.

05-21-2023, 05:29 PM	#10
Quoth the rook, bossing Never. Posts: 11,166 Karma: 85874891 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper11	The archive org (Internet Archive AKA Wayback machine) simply scrapes the OCR layer of the PDF (made from scan saved as TIFF) as a mobi or epub. Just NEVER download anything other than a PDF (or TIFF for your own OCR) from them, and only if no-one else has it (inc buying from Amazon, Kobo etc). Their quality is abysmal.

05-21-2023, 05:35 PM	#11
305869 Connoisseur Posts: 95 Karma: 28344 Join Date: Mar 2023 Device: Kobo Libra 2, Boox Leaf 7"	I will keep that in mind, thank you

05-21-2023, 06:54 PM	#13
DNSB Bibliophagist Posts: 35,498 Karma: 145557716 Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Vancouver Device: Kobo Sage, Forma, Clara HD, Lenovo M8 FHD, Paperwhite 4, Tolino epos	For what it is worth, I run all my ebooks through Sigil/epubcheck (I prefer Sigil to calibre's ebook editor for most tasks) before sending them to my ereaders. I have seldom seen as many errors as you seem to be seeing and those few were from sources such as one book from archive.org where the program they are using to convert to epub seems to have been written by someone who once heard there are epub specifications but never bothered to look at them. Oddly the one from archive.org was a relatively quick fix since 99% of the errors were from a paragraph style that incorrectly specified a width using a syntax that was never part of the various CSS versions. After that, the issues from a PDF to epub conversion were left (paragraphs split, images at random locations, etc.).

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