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Old 03-25-2018, 11:27 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredbiker View Post
Over the past year or so, I've had about 3,000 books open in the editor - anything from a quick fix to major surgery. If I've learned anything, it's that no matter how I try to automate or streamline some function, the next book breaks the mould and is totally screwed up by whatever I thought I had working so well. The variation in ebook coding is so vast it is just amazing. It keeps the hobby interesting!

I have come to agree about not converting most of the time. I'm so used to the editor it is just easier. And if I type in find <div.*?>, replace with nothing, and hit "replace all", I know I can backtrack if I have to.

But I keep finding old short stories from early mystery and sci-fi magazines that have all in-line styling and no CSS files--the only way I've found to deal with those is to convert, as it gets rid of the in-line stuff and creates a CSS file. The originals can be so dense with code it's migraine time to try and read it. No idea how else to do that.

This thread is amazing, it is like a history of just about everything I've bumped into and learned or tried over the past year. You guys are wonderful.
There are times when converting is going to be much easier such as your example with inline coding. But, when you are dealing with ePub from the major publishers, you are going to find it easier to remove the unused CSS and edit from there.

It's amazing that some people prefer to convert instead of learning how to do it by hand. I find it overall easier to do it by hand.
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Old 03-25-2018, 11:36 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by deback View Post
JS - Most of everything you said in your last post does not apply to me. I know how to code with CSS and HTML. I'm a book editor, FPS--and valedictorians tend to learn how to do things easily and quickly--and achieve the best results.

I have lots of extra styling codes that fix a lot of things that I used to fix manually. I have lots of transform rules added that fix a lot of things that I used to have to spend time fixing manually. Conversion works great for me and does NOT make editing any harder and does not mess up things. Actually, conversion makes everything much easier. Once in a while, I'll have to manually edit something, but that happens far less often than when I used to do all the editing manually.

In fact, I've saved hundreds of hours (or more) by modifying and converting with all my extra settings that fix a lot of things automatically for me. I can load up 100 files, run modify, run convert, run check book, and run ToC on each of the files, and be done with all of it in a very short amount of time.

The results in all the books are fantastic, they all work fine, all the errors found by Calibre are gone (with very few manual edits needed), everything is justified, all the blank line spaces are gone, all the indents are how I want them, the text looks very nice, and I love how my files look when I'm done. They look much cleaner and are much better than when I started, that I can tell you.

I wish I could show you my system. If I could, I'm 100% sure you would quit criticizing me for everything. You might also want to save time and use my system, which would save you tons of time, with much better results.
I'm not criticizing you. I'm disagreeing with you for the sake of the OP. Your way works for you, but your way doesn't work for the OP. You use ADE for Windows and ADE for Windows has very limited options. Kobo's version of ADE (RMSDK) has more options. So what you do isn't as appropriate for a Kobo as it is for ADE. The difference is in what works for the reading system in use and you and the OP use difference systems. While both have the same underlying code, the options available are different and that makes the process different. You do some things such as font embedding, line-height, justification, and margins. A Kobo can change the default font, change the margins, change the justification, and change the line-height. Also, ADE starts at the cover where with Kobo, it starts at the first entry in the NCX ToC. So things are different and that's why I am saying to do things differently. And one other thing Kobo has that ADE doesn't is a much wider array of font sizes.

I used to code what I wanted when I used to use a more primitive version of RMSDK. But some of that just I no longer code because Kobo's don't need it coded. That's the difference and that's why I was disagreeing. It's not that you are wrong, it's that your way is not appropriate for the OP.
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Old 03-25-2018, 11:39 AM   #33
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Since TashPerth started this thread, he/she hasn't made any more posts - I wonder why.

I'll stick my neck out and suggest TashPerth is a she (Natasha) from the Scottish Perth or the Aussie one. She has obviously moved on whilst others - all men I'll venture - continue to wage a mansplaining battle even after she's stopped listening and left the room - yawning.

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@BR, absolutely right. It's a discussion.
Both of you obviously didn't bother to check TashPerth's public profile. If you did, you'd have noticed that she hasn't been back to MR since making the original post. So if she's moved on, then she's moved on from MR and not just this thread.
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Old 03-25-2018, 12:29 PM   #34
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It's amazing that some people prefer to convert instead of learning how to do it by hand. I find it overall easier to do it by hand.
What I find amazing is that some people prefer to do it by hand, when many things can be done automatically that will save a lot of time. I did it by hand for several years, but then I finally did the research needed to figure out how I could automate many of the things I was doing by hand. Now, I spend much less time doing what I do than the way I used to do it--at least 80% or more less time, which means I can get more books done than I used to get done and have a lot more time to do other things.

I realize that many e-readers will format everything, and I realize that ADE doesn't format anything, but all of my files (after I get done with them) will work fine on all the e-readers that do format everything. They will work on any device.

All my life, I've always tried to find ways to do things easier and quicker and receive the same results. And that's what I've done with editing and reformatting e-books.

It doesn't matter to me whether you do your thing by hand or automate what you do, but I don't think it's right for you to post negative opinions about what I'm doing, when you really have no idea how my books look when I finish (and you don't know what all the Extra CSS and Transform Rules I've added to the Convert settings are, which are a big part of how I can do many things automatically). I've only posted how I do things in order to help others know that there are ways you can do things automatically, without having to spend extra time doing manual editing. I don't mind editing things manually (in fact, I love doing it), but due to the volume of books I edit and reformat, I had to do something to decrease the amount of time I was spending on doing that.

Thanks to the authors of Polish, Modify ePub, ePubMerge, and Calibre, and thanks to BetterRed and the others who treat users fairly and politely on this forum!
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:07 PM   #35
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What I find amazing is that some prefer to convert when it's easier to do by hand.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:15 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
What I find amazing is that some prefer to convert when it's easier to do by hand.
OMG! I don't believe you! Modifying and converting a file takes a few seconds; editing by hand (all the things that modify and convert will do automatically) can take several minutes or more, depending on what needs to be fixed. What part of this don't you understand? It's both easier and less time-consuming when using my system.
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Old 03-25-2018, 03:38 PM   #37
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One thing you cannot fix with conversion is graphics. You need to check those by hand and hand fix as needed.
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Old 03-25-2018, 04:19 PM   #38
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One thing you cannot fix with conversion is graphics. You need to check those by hand and hand fix as needed.
Yup, I do that, as I've already said in a previous post. Usually, when they need to be edited, it is the cover image and maybe the title page(s). Remember when I said I have a macro that adds class calibre3a to the .css file that has height: 100% and width: 100%? I quickly change the class on the image pages to calibre3a, and I'm done. Takes just a few seconds to fix those images.
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Old 03-25-2018, 04:24 PM   #39
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Yup, I do that, as I've already said in a previous post. Usually, when they need to be edited, it is the cover image and maybe the title page(s). Remember when I said I have a macro that adds class calibre3a to the .css file that has height: 100% and width: 100%? I quickly change the class on the image pages to calibre3a, and I'm done. Takes just a few seconds to fix those images.
I do suggest that before deciding to convert, take the time to learn how to do it manually. You'll never know which is better for you if you don't know how to do it manually.
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Old 03-25-2018, 06:59 PM   #40
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I do suggest that before deciding to convert, take the time to learn how to do it manually. You'll never know which is better for you if you don't know how to do it manually.
If you're talking to me, I've already told you that I've been using Calibre to edit and reformat books for years--manually. I'm much more advanced with all of this than you think I am. I have manually edited thousands of books and certainly know how to do any of the editing manually.

Why do you keep saying the same things over and over? Do you just like to argue?
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Old 03-26-2018, 03:59 PM   #41
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If you're talking to me, I've already told you that I've been using Calibre to edit and reformat books for years--manually. I'm much more advanced with all of this than you think I am. I have manually edited thousands of books and certainly know how to do any of the editing manually.

Why do you keep saying the same things over and over? Do you just like to argue?
I'm saying it in general to everyone reading this thread who may be confused about our discussion.
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Old 03-27-2018, 11:25 AM   #42
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I'm saying it in general to everyone reading this thread who may be confused about our discussion.
Um, as such a reader I think both of you were quite clear several repetitions ago.

To sum up, using the ePub editor will give you more fine control but if you realize that you will always be making the exact same changes a properly set-up conversion can save time.

(and I expect that the OP simply hasn't bothered to sign-in again)
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:03 PM   #43
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Um, as such a reader I think both of you were quite clear several repetitions ago.

To sum up, using the ePub editor will give you more fine control but if you realize that you will always be making the exact same changes a properly set-up conversion can save time.

(and I expect that the OP simply hasn't bothered to sign-in again)
Actually, using the editor can save time. There are some things a conversion won't do. And some things a conversion will not do correctly like converting a small font size to 9pt. Also, a conversion won't change when the eBook uses different fonts sizes and you want only one. A conversion won't change when the eBook uses overly large spacing. A Conversion won't always fix paragraph spaces because no only can they be removed, so can section breaks (sometimes).

So try both and see what you prefer.
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:46 PM   #44
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There will always be some files that need manual editing (and I do that all the time), but most of the files come out like I want them to--by running modify and convert, with all the extra CSS and transform rules I've added.

Here's an estimate:

Let's say I drag 50 books into Calibre, run modify, run convert, run ToC, run the editor to check the book for each file, automatically fix any errors found (which are usually ID errors or mimetype errors, and once in a while, typos in the .css file, since modify and convert have already fixed the rest of the errors), and then view each file in ADE 2.0.

I would estimate I will have to reopen the editor for about 10 of those 50 books to manually fix one thing (or sometimes, more, if the book is very badly coded)--usually resize the cover image, and sometimes, resize the title page image, or possibly remove codes that add blank line spaces between paragraphs, or edit the CSS code to remove the blank line spaces between paragraphs, and once in a while, I'll have to add text-align: justify to the "calibre" class because Styling did not add that from the Extra CSS codes I've added (bug in Calibre, I guess). Sometimes, I'll spend extra time to fix the top and bottom spacing for chapter titles and change the first paragraph indentation to no-indentation. I don't always do that, though, due to the huge volume of books I edit and fix.

These are just a few of the examples of things I might have to manually edit after modifying and converting (which almost always fixes the other 80% of errors that I used to spend lots of time fixing manually).

So, I can definitely say that doing all manual editing does NOT save time; it wastes much more time than is needed.
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:50 PM   #45
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Here are all the codes I've added in the Extra CSS Styling section of Look and Feel:
Spoiler:

.calibre {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
line-height: 1.2;
text-align: justify;
}
body {
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.body {
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.cover {
text-align: center;
}
.level {
margin-top: 0.25em;
margin-bottom: 0.25em;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.tocsection {
margin-top: 0.25em;
margin-bottom: 0.25em;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.toc {
margin-top: 0.25em;
margin-bottom: 0.25em;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.tocchp {
margin-top: 0.25em;
margin-bottom: 0.25em;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.fmtx {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.fmtx1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.fmtx2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.cot {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.cotx {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.chapteropenertext {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.chapteropenertext1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.chapteropenertext2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.para-ind {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-ind1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-ind2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-ind3 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-indent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-indent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-indent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-top: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-noindent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.para-noindent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.para-noindent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.paranoindent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.paranonindent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.partnumber {
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.tni {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.co {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.tx {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.tx1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
}
.tx2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.text {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.text1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.text2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-p {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para-pf {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-ind {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-ind1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-ind2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noind {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noind1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noind2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noind3 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-indent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-indent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.no-indent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noindent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noindent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noindent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.noindent3 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.non-indent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.non-indent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.non-indent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.nonindent {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.nonindent1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.nonindent2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.nonindent3 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.indent {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.indent1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.indent2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.indent3 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.ind {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.ind1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.ind2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.ind3 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.paraflush {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.paraflush1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.paraflush2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.para-flush {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.para-flush1 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.para-flush2 {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.ft {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.it {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para1 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para2 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.para3 {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.x03-co-body-text {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.x04-body-text {
margin-top: 0;
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.normal {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}
.booksection {
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.story {
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
}
.p {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p1 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p2 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p3 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p4 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p5 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p6 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p7 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p8 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p9 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.p10 {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.tc {
text-align: justify;
line-height: 1.2;
}
.follow {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
margin-top: 0;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 1.2em;
}
.left {
margin-bottom: 0;
margin-left: 0;
margin-right: 0;
margin-top: 1em;
text-align: justify;
text-indent: 0;
}


Once in a great while, I'll have to manually edit one of these, due to the creator of the file using something like "nonindent" for all paragraphs, but this doesn't happen very often, so it still saves tons of time having these extra CSS codes added into the conversion. Once in a while, Calibre does not honor one of these, and like I've previously said, it's usually the "justify" line in the "calibre" class.
Last edited by deback; 03-27-2018 at 10:00 PM. Reason: use spoiler on long logs and such
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