Question about Steve Jordan books - Page 4

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-24-2007, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

If you had contacted them first, you could have cut a deal like a free link on your page to their site. I've done something similar on my site. No money involved. The deal would not work for the whole music piece though. If I'm not mistaken you are allowed to use music snippets no longer that 20seconds freely. Cut one on a loop and you're done.

Maybe, but I imagine people will want to listen to a 20-second loop of any song a lot less than what they're hearing now. Most people hate short loops of background music, even when they like the song, and I don't want my site to sound like the inside of a young fashions store (endless techno-beat loops are medically proven to shrivel brain cells). It wouldn't be worth it.

nekokami · 10-24-2007, 01:25 PM

If you have access to a Mac, you could use Meditation Music to create a longer track of interesting mood music (or Garage Band, for that matter -- that's what I used for the music at http://zigraphix.com).

You're right, Steve, I doubt the publisher is going to pay any attention to your site at this point. I just think it's ironic for a content author to be using someone else's content without explicit permission at their site.

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-24-2007, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nekokami

You're right, Steve, I doubt the publisher is going to pay any attention to your site at this point. I just think it's ironic for a content author to be using someone else's content without explicit permission at their site.

The irony wasn't lost on me, either...

JSWolf · 10-24-2007, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Jordan

What's Happening! reruns, with commercials advertising "a very special Blossom".

If that's not the seventh circle of hell, it must have a balcony overlooking it.

I just thought of something even worse... reruns of the short lived TV series ... THE BRADY BRIDES!

HappyMartin · 10-25-2007, 04:40 AM

Sky News for me would do it

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-26-2007, 09:44 AM

There's always a careful balance you have to strike, between entertainment and annoyance. Stores go through a lot of trouble, using psychological and customer profiles to pick colors, background music, textures (and even, when they can, products!) to suit the people they want to come into their store. Sometimes they are so good at targeting their customers, that any non-customer is almost repulsed to be in that store. (It's the feeling I get whenever I walk into teens' clothing stores. Yeah, I'm old.) Other times, they can't manage to even hit their intended target.

For years I thought about background music for my site, only to be unsatisfied with anything I could use (or convinced that visitors would detest it after about 3 seconds). With the Solaris music (closing credits theme), I thought I added a nice bit of atmosphere for the site, to match its primarily SF theme. I deliberately set it low in volume, to keep it secluded to the background... for those who keep their volumes low, the music would reach them subliminally before they even identified it. At first I thought I'd hide it, but I was reminded that people like a "stop" button, and supplied one. I thought all of this would make for a more enjoyable site for all.

Anyway, that was my thinking.

Whenever you do these things, it is with the hope or expectation that your audience will appreciate it. With the web, that audience can be very particular... many people hate all website music/noise unconditionally, others hate animation as vehemently. Some will tolerate these things, depending on the selections and their application. Others love everything that's different, and they delight in finding gems like this.

This site has the usual mix of tastes, when it comes to websites... that much is clear from this thread! There's no one overriding voice on the matter, so I wouldn't consider any of the opinions expressed here as a clear mandate one way or the other.

However... after due consideration over the past few days, I have repeatedly returned to Neko's comment:

Quote:

I just think it's ironic for a content author to be using someone else's content without explicit permission at their site.

Neko is right: I should not be using Fox's copywritten music without permission... even if it is not earning me any money, even if it is not doing any harm to Twentieth Century Fox's reputation or bottom line. With everything else I have tried to say, and defend, on this site, it is not just ironic... it is downright hypocritical... for me to do so.

So, I will be taking the Solaris music down this weekend. (For the moment, I don't plan to replace it with anything else. If I do: Beware...)

I hope some people enjoyed it while it was there. I also hope everyone here doesn't think too bad of me for my lapse in judgement--it wasn't the first, and I'm sure it won't be the last, either--but I'm not too petty to admit that when you're right, you're right.

Thanks for keeping me honest. Go Team!

HarryT · 10-26-2007, 09:52 AM

Hi Steve,

I think you've made the right decision there.

If it's any help, there's lots of out of copyright classical stuff available. A music "performance" copyright only lasts for 50 years (that's so in the UK, at least), so any recording of music which is itself out of copyright made prior to 1956 can be freely used.

yvanleterrible · 10-26-2007, 10:03 AM

Hey Steve! That was a nice bit of soul searching and a good show of maturity. I applaud you.

I have an idea for you. Just ask around here for a musician to help you. You could have him write and play a sci-fi mood bitty for you. With 'Garage Band' a sequencer and a midi keyboard it's pretty easy. Hey you could borrow that stuff and do it yourself!
You could trade that music for copies of your book and a link to this musician's site and of course credits on your site.

nekokami · 10-26-2007, 10:29 AM

Sorry to be the cause of such angst... but I think you did make the right decision.

You could always see if CommanderROR could let you use a nice violin piece....

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-26-2007, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nekokami

Sorry to be the cause of such angst...

Not at all... in fact, it was my actions that caused the angst... and your words that took it away.

The suggestions are good, too, and worth thinking about... for some other time...

mores · 10-29-2007, 07:20 AM

flashkit has a lot of free sound-loops, i think you might find something that fits your site.
http://www.flashkit.com/loops/Ambient/
notice the little (fake) equalizer-thingie they have, it shows that something is playing, it catches the eye, and if it bothered someone you could turn it off.

anyhow, it's good to see your site is back up and running.

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-29-2007, 10:32 AM

Yeah, and it was a pain while the registrars were screwed up! If only I could claim loss of revenue and sue somebody...

(Heck... if only I could claim revenue...

)

For the record, I am going to give further thought to background music, but I do have to admit, it is a polarizing factor. As long as I'm trying to sell on the web, there's no reason to drive visitors away (after all, no one's likely to leave my site because I don't have music).

I honestly thought I'd found some background music, and a way to present it, that wouldn't bug anyone, even the most fervent web-music-hater. How wrong I was...

So, if I use music in the future, it will be in a much more limited way... say, in an intro splash (that one can click past), or on an individual page somewhere in the site.

Stay tuned. Buy e-books. And tell your friends.

yvanleterrible · 10-31-2007, 08:36 AM

Warning this is off topic!

I'm reading "Factory Orbit". I'm not finished but I like it. It's upbeat and positive. I've noticed that throughout the book there are numerous references to actual companies and brand names.
Here's a suggestion I've made in the past. You know the links from the beginning of the book to the head of chapters? Well you could get the same from the name of a company to an add page at the end of the ebook. That would take an hour to program, then you reformat for the PRS and bring one with you to said company and discuss a possible investment with them.

Say, I really like that Ipad! You think they'll have one someday?

Steven Lyle Jordan · 10-31-2007, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

Here's a suggestion I've made in the past. You know the links from the beginning of the book to the head of chapters? Well you could get the same from the name of a company to an add page at the end of the ebook. That would take an hour to program, then you reformat for the PRS and bring one with you to said company and discuss a possible investment with them.

We have talked about product placement and branding before. I could easily see placing ads at the back of a book for any companies or products mentioned therein. After just reading an article on News.com about Trent Reznor joining the ranks of those who believe music will be free, whether musicians like it or not, the idea of supporting artists through endorsement deals and product placement looks better and better all the time.

Of course, product placement can be tough in science fiction, but sometimes it works just fine!

Quote:

Originally Posted by yvanleterrible

Say, I really like that Ipad! You think they'll have one someday?

Gad, I hope so! As well as the rest of the things I described in the story... not to mention the orbital facility! As far as I can determine, all of the things described in Factory Orbit, including the facility itself, and the Ipad, are possible with today's technology and knowledge. We don't need transporters or alien technology or cold fusion to pull any of it off.

<shameless_plug>I still think that, with the administration talking about going to the Moon, and NASA sort of leaning towards more research, less work, we are on the cusp of the era where corporations get to space and discover better ways of doing things. I think it could be the biggest boost to the american manufacturing industry since the automobile.</shameless_plug>

yvanleterrible · 10-31-2007, 03:01 PM

Don't want to bust any bubble but we have a common problem to solve before space faring concerns. Our house is burning up!

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10-24-2007, 01:25 PM	#47
nekokami fruminous edugeek Posts: 6,745 Karma: 551260 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northeast US Device: iPad, eBw 1150	If you have access to a Mac, you could use Meditation Music to create a longer track of interesting mood music (or Garage Band, for that matter -- that's what I used for the music at http://zigraphix.com). You're right, Steve, I doubt the publisher is going to pay any attention to your site at this point. I just think it's ironic for a content author to be using someone else's content without explicit permission at their site.

10-25-2007, 04:40 AM	#50
HappyMartin Martin Kristiansen Posts: 1,546 Karma: 8480958 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Johannesburg Device: Kindle International Ipad 2	Sky News for me would do it

10-26-2007, 09:52 AM	#52
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383043 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	Hi Steve, I think you've made the right decision there. If it's any help, there's lots of out of copyright classical stuff available. A music "performance" copyright only lasts for 50 years (that's so in the UK, at least), so any recording of music which is itself out of copyright made prior to 1956 can be freely used.

10-26-2007, 10:03 AM	#53
yvanleterrible Reborn Paper User Posts: 8,616 Karma: 15446734 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Que Nada Device: iPhone8, iPad Air	Hey Steve! That was a nice bit of soul searching and a good show of maturity. I applaud you. I have an idea for you. Just ask around here for a musician to help you. You could have him write and play a sci-fi mood bitty for you. With 'Garage Band' a sequencer and a midi keyboard it's pretty easy. Hey you could borrow that stuff and do it yourself! You could trade that music for copies of your book and a link to this musician's site and of course credits on your site.

10-26-2007, 10:29 AM	#54
nekokami fruminous edugeek Posts: 6,745 Karma: 551260 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Northeast US Device: iPad, eBw 1150	Sorry to be the cause of such angst... but I think you did make the right decision. You could always see if CommanderROR could let you use a nice violin piece....

10-29-2007, 07:20 AM	#56
mores Guru Posts: 834 Karma: 102419 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Vienna, Austria Device: iPhone	flashkit has a lot of free sound-loops, i think you might find something that fits your site. http://www.flashkit.com/loops/Ambient/ notice the little (fake) equalizer-thingie they have, it shows that something is playing, it catches the eye, and if it bothered someone you could turn it off. anyhow, it's good to see your site is back up and running.

10-29-2007, 10:32 AM	#57
Steven Lyle Jordan Grand Sorcerer Posts: 8,478 Karma: 5171130 Join Date: Jan 2006 Device: none	Yeah, and it was a pain while the registrars were screwed up! If only I could claim loss of revenue and sue somebody... (Heck... if only I could claim revenue... ) For the record, I am going to give further thought to background music, but I do have to admit, it is a polarizing factor. As long as I'm trying to sell on the web, there's no reason to drive visitors away (after all, no one's likely to leave my site because I don't have music). I honestly thought I'd found some background music, and a way to present it, that wouldn't bug anyone, even the most fervent web-music-hater. How wrong I was... So, if I use music in the future, it will be in a much more limited way... say, in an intro splash (that one can click past), or on an individual page somewhere in the site. Stay tuned. Buy e-books. And tell your friends.

10-31-2007, 08:36 AM	#58
yvanleterrible Reborn Paper User Posts: 8,616 Karma: 15446734 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Que Nada Device: iPhone8, iPad Air	Warning this is off topic! I'm reading "Factory Orbit". I'm not finished but I like it. It's upbeat and positive. I've noticed that throughout the book there are numerous references to actual companies and brand names. Here's a suggestion I've made in the past. You know the links from the beginning of the book to the head of chapters? Well you could get the same from the name of a company to an add page at the end of the ebook. That would take an hour to program, then you reformat for the PRS and bring one with you to said company and discuss a possible investment with them. Say, I really like that Ipad! You think they'll have one someday?

10-31-2007, 03:01 PM	#60
yvanleterrible Reborn Paper User Posts: 8,616 Karma: 15446734 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Que Nada Device: iPhone8, iPad Air	Don't want to bust any bubble but we have a common problem to solve before space faring concerns. Our house is burning up!

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