Sigil vs InDesign

stevej46 · 08-13-2011, 01:24 AM

I have finally published my first eBook thru Lulu.com. Today my eBook had a link added to iBookstore. It took me several weeks to figure out what I was doing. I started first by trying to convert from OpenOffice .ODT to ePub using Calibre. After lots of tries and frustration, I downloaded and put the book together with InDesign. I still had errors when I exported to ePub format.

Now that I have finally finished my first book, I was wondering how others think about using just Sigil to create and edit their eBooks? Sigil sure helped me edit the ePubs I exported from InDesign. So do I even need InDesign now?

I hope to be able to contribute more to this forum. I feel I have finally learned enough to answer a few questions.

Steve Johnson

Toxaris · 08-13-2011, 03:43 AM

I never use InDesign. I create everything in Word, because I have some great macro's which help me to correct OCR errors and create a relative clean and complete export to HTML. I read that HTML into Sigil, do a little additional styling and the ePUB is ready.

For me that is a lot easier than InDesign. What I don't like about InDesign is the stylesheet it produces. It is much larger than it should be, with a lot of redundant code. That will not help the performance of the ePUB.

As you can see, no Calibre. I use Calibre for library management, not for ePUB creation.

charleski · 08-13-2011, 05:57 AM

InDesign's strengths lie in its page layout tools, which can't be beaten, but are largely irrelevant for reflowable content. There are certainly a lot of alternatives that are far cheaper and more suitable for ePubs. As Toxaris said, Word or similar programs like Atlantis or OpenOffice that can export xml are a good place to start, and offer a richer set of tools for text creation.

It's certainly possible to create an ePub entirely in Sigil. But it's really designed as an editor, and to get the most out of it you need to understand how xhtml and css works.

GeneS · 08-13-2011, 07:43 AM

I use either Word or Open Office to begin the process and then move to Sigil. The reason, for me, is simply that InDesign is a very special-use product and I can operate in the other formats for free.

frabjous · 08-13-2011, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toxaris

I create everything in Word

And you have a Tux avatar? Tux is ashamed of you.

I certainly don't think InDesign is the proper tool for ePub creation. Personally, I just write the (X)HTML in vim, or else write in LaTeX (again in vim) and convert to (X)HTML, hand-write the XML, and zip it up myself. But I'm a control freak.

DaleDe · 08-13-2011, 01:25 PM

There is a macro for ODT that can be used to product ePub files. It has its own forum here. Atlantis can also save directly into ePub format. Sigil is a great tool but you mostly have to work in code view directly changing xhtml code. It is not a writing tool currently.

Dale

Toxaris · 08-13-2011, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frabjous

And you have a Tux avatar? Tux is ashamed of you.

No, he isn't. My server is Linux and I run two installations on my laptop. Epub is Windows and almost everything else is Linux.

NeilPet · 08-17-2011, 03:41 PM

As long as the workflow for a serious book is manuscript => printed book => ebook, Indesign will largely be where the content for ebooks comes from. So the issues that we all suffer with in translating an ID ePub/Mobi file into a clean version will have to be dealt with.

Sorry, but "...ePub is Windows..."? On what planet?

crich70 · 08-17-2011, 07:52 PM

I use Sigil for epubs then Calibre to convert them to mobipocket.

DSpider · 08-17-2011, 08:48 PM

Sigil is multiplatform... 0.4.0 was just released 3 days ago.

And ePub is an open format. Meaning you could use any desktop OS and still manage to whip out a perfectly valid ePub.

Toxaris · 08-18-2011, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilPet

Sorry, but "...ePub is Windows..."? On what planet?

You misinterpret my post. What I stated, or at least meant to state, is that I create ePUBS on windows and for the rest of the activities I use Linux. Of course the format windows is not restricted to Windows.

Dillinquent · 08-22-2011, 06:16 PM

Most of my clients supply their ms' in Word or Open Office format which I export as filtered html and then clean up in Dreamweaver which has an excellent command for removing all the junk that Word & OO introduce. Once the code is clean I convert it to xhtml then copy and paste it into a blank Sigil book. I find Sigil a pain for editing the xhtml as it is always trying to second-guess what you're trying to do and has a nasty habit of screwing up your code if it doesn't like what you're doing. However Sigil is very good at making the TOC and packaging epubs, and the validation tool is superb.
InDesign is great for laying out magazines but rubbish for making epubs.

Toxaris · 08-23-2011, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dillinquent

I find Sigil a pain for editing the xhtml as it is always trying to second-guess what you're trying to do and has a nasty habit of screwing up your code if it doesn't like what you're doing.

I am a little puzzled. I almost use the same method. I don't use DreamWeaver but create clean HTML with a macro, but the rest is the same.

I don't find it a pain to edit the xhtml. In fact, Sigil does almost nothing to my code. Only when I switch views or give another windows the focus, Sigil will try to make sure the xhtml file is correct and proposes fixes to assure that. I never had it screwing up my code if the xhtml file was correct in the first place.

DaleDe · 08-23-2011, 10:47 AM

I suspect the difference might be whether you use Sigil in code mode or WYSIWYG mode. When people talk about using Sigil they need to be specific. The behavior Dillinquent offered sounds like WYSIWYG mode and what you describe is code mode.

Dale

Toxaris · 08-23-2011, 03:42 PM

Yeah, that could be. I am almost always in codeview and only check the bookview every now and then.

08-13-2011, 01:24 AM	#1
stevej46 Member Posts: 15 Karma: 10 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Centennial, Colorado Device: iPad	Sigil vs InDesign I have finally published my first eBook thru Lulu.com. Today my eBook had a link added to iBookstore. It took me several weeks to figure out what I was doing. I started first by trying to convert from OpenOffice .ODT to ePub using Calibre. After lots of tries and frustration, I downloaded and put the book together with InDesign. I still had errors when I exported to ePub format. Now that I have finally finished my first book, I was wondering how others think about using just Sigil to create and edit their eBooks? Sigil sure helped me edit the ePubs I exported from InDesign. So do I even need InDesign now? I hope to be able to contribute more to this forum. I feel I have finally learned enough to answer a few questions. Steve Johnson

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08-13-2011, 03:43 AM	#2
Toxaris Wizard Posts: 4,520 Karma: 121692313 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Heemskerk, NL Device: PRS-T1, Kobo Touch, Kobo Aura	I never use InDesign. I create everything in Word, because I have some great macro's which help me to correct OCR errors and create a relative clean and complete export to HTML. I read that HTML into Sigil, do a little additional styling and the ePUB is ready. For me that is a lot easier than InDesign. What I don't like about InDesign is the stylesheet it produces. It is much larger than it should be, with a lot of redundant code. That will not help the performance of the ePUB. As you can see, no Calibre. I use Calibre for library management, not for ePUB creation.

08-13-2011, 05:57 AM	#3
charleski Wizard Posts: 1,196 Karma: 1281258 Join Date: Sep 2009 Device: PRS-505	InDesign's strengths lie in its page layout tools, which can't be beaten, but are largely irrelevant for reflowable content. There are certainly a lot of alternatives that are far cheaper and more suitable for ePubs. As Toxaris said, Word or similar programs like Atlantis or OpenOffice that can export xml are a good place to start, and offer a richer set of tools for text creation. It's certainly possible to create an ePub entirely in Sigil. But it's really designed as an editor, and to get the most out of it you need to understand how xhtml and css works.

08-13-2011, 07:43 AM	#4
GeneS eBook Enthusiast Posts: 120 Karma: 726 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: US Device: Sony PRS-350, Astak PocketPro, iPhone, Asus eee Pad Transformer	I use either Word or Open Office to begin the process and then move to Sigil. The reason, for me, is simply that InDesign is a very special-use product and I can operate in the other formats for free.

08-13-2011, 01:25 PM	#6
DaleDe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,470 Karma: 13095790 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Grass Valley, CA Device: EB 1150, EZ Reader, Literati, iPad 2 & Air 2, iPhone 7	There is a macro for ODT that can be used to product ePub files. It has its own forum here. Atlantis can also save directly into ePub format. Sigil is a great tool but you mostly have to work in code view directly changing xhtml code. It is not a writing tool currently. Dale

08-17-2011, 03:41 PM	#8
NeilPet Junior Member Posts: 4 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Calgary, Alberta Device: iPad	As long as the workflow for a serious book is manuscript => printed book => ebook, Indesign will largely be where the content for ebooks comes from. So the issues that we all suffer with in translating an ID ePub/Mobi file into a clean version will have to be dealt with. Sorry, but "...ePub is Windows..."? On what planet?

08-17-2011, 07:52 PM	#9
crich70 Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,305 Karma: 43993832 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Monroe Wisconsin Device: K3, Kindle Paperwhite, Calibre, and Mobipocket for Pc (netbook)	I use Sigil for epubs then Calibre to convert them to mobipocket.

08-17-2011, 08:48 PM	#10
DSpider Evangelist Posts: 450 Karma: 343115 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Romania Device: PW2 2014	Sigil is multiplatform... 0.4.0 was just released 3 days ago. And ePub is an open format. Meaning you could use any desktop OS and still manage to whip out a perfectly valid ePub.

08-22-2011, 06:16 PM	#12
Dillinquent eBook pro Posts: 71 Karma: 5634 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Hertford, UK Device: PC, iPad, Kindle, Kindle Fire, Galaxy Ace	Most of my clients supply their ms' in Word or Open Office format which I export as filtered html and then clean up in Dreamweaver which has an excellent command for removing all the junk that Word & OO introduce. Once the code is clean I convert it to xhtml then copy and paste it into a blank Sigil book. I find Sigil a pain for editing the xhtml as it is always trying to second-guess what you're trying to do and has a nasty habit of screwing up your code if it doesn't like what you're doing. However Sigil is very good at making the TOC and packaging epubs, and the validation tool is superb. InDesign is great for laying out magazines but rubbish for making epubs.

08-23-2011, 10:47 AM	#14
DaleDe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,470 Karma: 13095790 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Grass Valley, CA Device: EB 1150, EZ Reader, Literati, iPad 2 & Air 2, iPhone 7	I suspect the difference might be whether you use Sigil in code mode or WYSIWYG mode. When people talk about using Sigil they need to be specific. The behavior Dillinquent offered sounds like WYSIWYG mode and what you describe is code mode. Dale

08-23-2011, 03:42 PM	#15
Toxaris Wizard Posts: 4,520 Karma: 121692313 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Heemskerk, NL Device: PRS-T1, Kobo Touch, Kobo Aura	Yeah, that could be. I am almost always in codeview and only check the bookview every now and then.