News from CES on e-ink!

[frahse]

e-ink at CES 2020!

https://www.axios.com/whats-happened...9a075cafa.html

Lenovo debuted a 5G-equipped laptop powered by a Qualcomm chip that promises 24 hours of battery life. It's due out this spring for around $1,500. Also from Lenovo: a ThinkBook model with an e-ink display on its lid and the ThinkPad X1 Fold, a $2,500 Windows 10 laptop with dual screens.

[tomsem]

Originally Posted by frahse

e-ink at CES 2020!

https://www.axios.com/whats-happened...9a075cafa.html

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/le...en-specs-price

The ThinkBook Plus was announced here at CES 2020, and it comes with a secondary display meant to foster collaboration. While the main, 13.3-inch FHD display is closed, the E Ink screen can show email and calendar notifications from Microsoft Outlook. You can also use it to take notes with Lenovo’s included stylus. The idea is you’ll only do what you’ll need to on the screen during meetings, rather than being engrossed entirely in your laptop. It will start at $1,199 when it goes on sale in March.

In other words, use of E Ink screen is very restrictive. Where is it not possible to take notes with your laptop open, and more efficiently?

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbrea...-date-ces-2020

Last year, Lenovo showed off what it described as the “world’s first foldable PC” — a prototype OLED tablet that could fold up like a book or a tiny laptop. Now, at CES 2020, Lenovo is announcing how it’s going to sell the idea as a commercial product. It’s called the ThinkPad X1 Fold, and it’ll be available this year.

This is dual OLED screen, just to make the thing smaller. Nothing to do with e-ink. I predict it will not ship (just as foldable smartphones aren’t ready yet). Then there’s the question of why anyone would buy it, or why anyone would prefer it to a non-folding (and more trouble free) screen.

[Quoth]

Though Lenovo did have a weird tablet with a separate eInk touch screen for input where a keyboard would be on a laptop.

I can't see a big demand, especially if expensive. I got a quite good Lenovo full HD laptop with decent GPU for under €500 a couple of years ago and last week a decent Lenovo 10" Android tablet for under €120 (great for PDFs and quick look at a website, I put a 256G micro SDXC card with 62 G Byte of ancient PDF magazines, textbooks, datasheets and service manuals, all scans). Inc local tax.
A Forma here is about €100 more than the Kobo Libra I got recently and still would be no good for most of those PDFs. On some the colour is important.
The Laptop is 1920 x 1080, my 2002 laptop is 1600 x 1200, superior for PDF, but the tablet is better as it can be used portrait. Far faster and easier to use than the 10" Windows 10 x86 Atom tablet I've now passed on.

[frahse]

Originally Posted by tomsem

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/le...en-specs-price


In other words, use of E Ink screen is very restrictive. Where is it not possible to take notes with your laptop open, and more efficiently?

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbrea...-date-ces-2020



This is dual OLED screen, just to make the thing smaller. Nothing to do with e-ink. I predict it will not ship (just as foldable smartphones aren’t ready yet). Then there’s the question of why anyone would buy it, or why anyone would prefer it to a non-folding (and more trouble free) screen.

True. And true. However progress can be slow and circuitous and remember when Pads with pens were ridiculed by Steve Jobs and others.

I keep my little (about 4 x 3 x 1/2 inch) Electronic Franklin with it's Dictionary and Thesaurus and "Bookman cards insertion slot on my bigger computer desk just to remind me of that.

[Dav_25]

After having a great success with the Hisense A5, Hisense announced at the CES 2020 that they will release the frst color Eink phone soon:

https://blog.the-ebook-reader.com/20...k-phone-video/

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by Dav_25

After having a great success with the Hisense A5, Hisense announced at the CES 2020 that they will release the frst color Eink phone soon:

https://blog.the-ebook-reader.com/20...k-phone-video/

The phone is going to tank.It looks washed out and the display is slow for a phone.

[tomsem]

Maybe they are getting somewhere, but it is hard to tell from the video except that the color is still not great.

This might be good for someone who works outdoors a lot, or surfs (it needs waterproofing for that): you would not have to seek some shade to operate it. But it is a steep tradeoff in display performance for that capability.

[latepaul]

I thought the colour was acceptable (as a trade-off) but unless/until the refresh rate is good enough to use a GPS app I wouldn't be interested.

Actually scratch that, the thing the refresh rate needs to be good enough for is typing and I suspect that's a faster refresh that would be ok for maps/Waze.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by latepaul

I thought the colour was acceptable (as a trade-off) but unless/until the refresh rate is good enough to use a GPS app I wouldn't be interested.

Actually scratch that, the thing the refresh rate needs to be good enough for is typing and I suspect that's a faster refresh that would be ok for maps/Waze.

The refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

For you the refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

Many other people might find a colour eInk a useful advance over greyscale eInk.

[latepaul]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

Not true - I almost never stream video on my phone.

(I omitted the implied "for me" because so did you)

[underscore]

Originally Posted by latepaul

I thought the colour was acceptable (as a trade-off) but unless/until the refresh rate is good enough to use a GPS app I wouldn't be interested.

Actually scratch that, the thing the refresh rate needs to be good enough for is typing and I suspect that's a faster refresh that would be ok for maps/Waze.

My k1 is decent enough for maps/waze
I admit that i don't watch that many youtube videos on it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vvf9TJzBNI

[leebase]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

For you the refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

Many other people might find a colour eInk a useful advance over greyscale eInk.

"Many" -- compared to what? Enough to warrant inventing the technology, marketing and supporting it? That's really questionable.

Already eInk itself is way past it's hey day. Phones with large screens and tablets (from expensive to fairly cheap) have taken all of the oxygen out of that market.

One would assume color eInk would be more expensive than b&w eInk. And if you don't have "video quality" you are remove all of the movie, tv, youtube, web video use cases.

Now you are left with readers of static material who aren't satisfied with b&w --- AND --- who don't feel they can read comfortably on a tablet....AND...who are willing to pay more than b&w ink.

And "how many" answer needs to be "millions and millions" or else you are going to have to significantly increase the price due to the lack of economies of scale.

I remain skeptical such a market will ever exist even if the tech EVER actually arrives. And by arrives, I mean "photo quality color". Short of that, then there isn't ANY chance of a mass market product.

[leebase]

As for this Lenovo franken device. Thud. That's the sound of the market's reaction to this device. This isn't going anywhere. It's not going to sell, and nobody else will be making their own version of this.

It has a kindle app. Are you going to read on a 3.5lb kindle rather than buying a $89 kindle? I didn't think so.

Lets you see your outlook (only!) schedule. Really. This is less obtrusive than looking at your phone?

Take notes. Instead of using a pad of paper and then just taking a picture of your notes to import into OneNote? Again, I don't think so.

This screams of "we need to have something innovative!"....but nobody could think of anything useful and Apple hadn't put out anything revolutionary to copy from.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

For you the refresh has to be fast enough for streaming video or forget it.

Many other people might find a colour eInk a useful advance over greyscale eInk.

I think they would find color eInk useful. But on a Reader, not a smartphone where you expect to do things like video and games. Plus, the screen does look washed out and that makes taking photos not as good as it should be.