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Old 09-06-2010, 03:22 PM   #1
sirmaru
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Possible cause of K3 resets........

I was thinking that possibly NONE of these events reported here of K3 resets, dying, freezes are the fault of the device.

I was reading on the internet that EMI (Electro Magnetic Interference) can cripple many electronic devices including but not limited to defibrilators, pacemakers, etc.

Those waves are generated by microwave ovens, old TV's, high electric utility wires, defective appliances, etc.

Amazon sells a device with high rated user reviews which sells for only $ 73.60. I just ordererd one. Its called the Lutron 822 - Digital EMF Meter.

My Kindle WiFi only had its main problems after I went to Church with it. After it was home for a short time, it worked PERFECTLY.

Thus, there may be EMI interference in certain rooms in that Church. In my house evidently there are no such problems.

If that is the case, then my replacement K3 coming this Wednesday will have the same problems if I bring it to Church. My Franklin BIB 475 Bible had the same problems in Church as well as did a replacement unit. It never had any problem in my house.

From what I read on the internet, the EMI problem may only be in certain locations in a building. This meter may disclose if it really exists in my Church.

If that is true, my K3 problems are easily resolved. I don't bring it there anymore and use my NowBible which, evidently, is not affected by EMI.

Also, if that is true, and I don't know yet until I receive the device, it could be more important to find the EMI leaks in Church to prevent some folks using medical devices from having damage to those devices. That is far more important than the K3.

Last edited by sirmaru; 09-06-2010 at 03:30 PM.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:35 PM   #2
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even if it is EMI causing lockups, it is still amazon's fault for not shielding the device properly. i really hope it is software and not EMI, because then it can be fixed.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:37 PM   #3
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I do not think that is possible it would never have passed the FCC testing in the US.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:38 PM   #4
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My K1 and K2 work just fine. The K2 has a metal back but the K1 also has a rubberized back (don't have my K3 yet).

We are in a cycle of high solar flares but I'm not sure it's causing problems for Kindles or any other ebook readers.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:40 PM   #5
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True, electrical interference can cause problems with electronics, as can RF (radio frequencies) which are also electro-magnetic waves just at a different set of frequencies. However, the K3 is most likely shielded to prevent this. My Kindles sit on my desk with two computers running and at least three ham radios. Even when I transmit with my HF radio using 100 watts I never have a problem with my Kindles.

If you want to test out your theory, place your Kindle in a Faraday box. You can build one out of a cardboard box and wrap aluminum foil all around it. That would protect your Kindle from a the EMP (electro-magnetic pulse) generated by a nearby nuclear explosion, so it will definitely shield it against household electrical interference. If you still encounter the problems then your theory is incorrect.

My guess is that the problem lies with firmware issues and not electro-magnetic interference.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:42 PM   #6
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We'll have to defer that to Dave, who I understand is some sort of EE (electricity exorcist?). Just as one data point, my church has a small 40,000 watt TV station leasing space on the roof, and I haven't run into much trouble. Sometimes my fillings get hot during service, but my K3 runs just the same there as back home.

Last edited by pen_sq; 09-06-2010 at 03:45 PM.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:42 PM   #7
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Quote:
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We are in a cycle of high solar flares but I'm not sure it's causing problems for Kindles or any other ebook readers.
Actually we are just climbing up out of an extended period of low solar activity. The Sun is on a cycle of around 11 years and right now we are near the low end of the cycle. In about 5-7 years it will peak.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:45 PM   #8
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Actually we are just climbing up out of an extended period of low solar activity. The Sun is on a cycle of around 11 years and right now we are near the low end of the cycle. In about 5-7 years it will peak.
Hmm, I recently heard Andrew Fracknoy say otherwise.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:47 PM   #9
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The Kindle is tested to certify with FCC and CE regulations so it is sufficiently shielded against interference in the home and workplace. The regulations also require that the Kindle be shielded against generating interference itself. The Kindle contains a cell phone so it has even more strenuous regulations regarding shielding.

If you decide to take your Kindle and put it next to a Tesla coil then sure, you're going to have some issues but in normal operation it will be fine. If you look at the various Kindle 3 teardown pictures or videos you'll see that nearly all the important components in the Kindle is shielded in small metal cans.

sirmaru, you need to wait for the replacement Kindle from Amazon before attempting to come up with any other situations or scenarios as to why your Kindle doesn't work. You've already gone through bad firmware, manufacturing defect in all/some Kindles and now EMI.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:57 PM   #10
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I have noticed that my K3's wifi connection is much more sensitive to the microwave. My laptop never seems to notice when it's on, but my K3 will lose the connection.

The EMP thought is very interesting, although I have seen people with replacements do fine, presumably at home as they were with the one they returned, but others still have trouble.
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Old 09-06-2010, 03:59 PM   #11
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Quote:
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I have noticed that my K3's wifi connection is much more sensitive to the microwave. My laptop never seems to notice when it's on, but my K3 will lose the connection.

The EMP thought is very interesting, although I have seen people with replacements do fine, presumably at home as they were with the one they returned, but others still have trouble.
if that is the case I do not see how it passed the FCC requirements. That would make it a big problem.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:08 PM   #12
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You are CORRECT !

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Originally Posted by Tiersten View Post
sirmaru, you need to wait for the replacement Kindle from Amazon before attempting to come up with any other situations or scenarios as to why your Kindle doesn't work. You've already gone through bad firmware, manufacturing defect in all/some Kindles and now EMI.
Tiersten,

You are correct. I'm just floating THEORIES at this point. As it happens every device I use from cars to PC's to everything else has it's own little problems. Same with all the software I use.

In the end the big problems get resolved and we just have to live with the little problems.

The Sony PRS 900 I used also had a lot of little problems which were never resolved. I learned to work around them. I'm going to keep it, however, as a spare just in case the K3 does go out of commission for awhile.

I'm sure in the end all of us will have our own LITTLE problems with the K3 which may be specific to each of us. Maybe we are just doing something wrong ourselves and don't know it.

So far as I am concerned, if I cannot use the K3 in Church for any reason, its not really a big deal. I still have my NowBible which works perfectly there.

Most of my uses for the K3 are READING BOOKS at home away from my PC. I find it beneficial to rotate the PC and the K3 to read the books. My eyes feel a lot better doing that. The other K3 features of enhanced legibility, etc. make up for any small problems.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:08 PM   #13
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if that is the case I do not see how it passed the FCC requirements. That would make it a big problem.
Not really. 802.11b/g uses 2.4GHz which is the part of the ISM unlicensed bands. So long as you don't interfere with ISM (Industrial, Scientific and Medical) usage you can generally do whatever you like so long as you stay within the defined limits for power output.

Microwave ovens operate at 2.45GHz and do generate a large amount of interference so the Kindle being affected by it isn't particularly unusual. It all depends on the exact antenna and radio chipset used in the device. 2.4GHz video senders are even worse than microwaves as they'll stomp over a wide range of frequencies.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:15 PM   #14
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Quote:
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You are correct. I'm just floating THEORIES at this point. As it happens every device I use from cars to PC's to everything else has it's own little problems. Same with all the software I use.
A theory is fine but you have to be careful about how you word it and should gather some evidence before stating it as a fact. There is no point in worrying yourself or others until there is something more concrete to go on.

As for your theory about interference at the church, there may be multiple possibilities as to why. Some churches use a massive loop antenna to broadcast the service to people with induction loop hearing aids. Other churches may use a wireless transmission system for their microphones. In both cases, they shouldn't interfere but they may not be correctly installed or faulty and therefore be generating significant amounts of RFI. It isn't the fault of the Kindle though.

Next time you're at church, you should do some testing with your Kindle and ask others if they have any issues with electronic devices. Bring a small AM/FM radio with headphones with you and see if radio reception is any different when actually inside the church.
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Old 09-06-2010, 04:15 PM   #15
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If you decide to take your Kindle and put it next to a Tesla coil then sure, you're going to have some issues but in normal operation it will be fine.
This had never occurred to me. When I go in for my (4 Tesla) MRIs, I typically try to read my pbooks while I wait within the room as they do the prep.

I know they're shielded. My earrings don't fly off until I get inside. But I wonder how close would be too close for the Kindle?

Would there be any lasting effects if I got too close?
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