Copyright Reform Poll

pdurrant · 04-01-2020, 04:15 AM

Do the copyright laws need reform?

Current law is life of author+50 years or life of author+70 years.

The Berne convention (& successor conventions) require a minimum term or life of author+50 years. Changing seems practically impossible.

But let's ignore the practicalities. In your ideal world, what would we do with copyright?

If none of the options I've put in the poll come close to your choice, suggest something in the thread.

The poll results are hidden until the poll ends on the morning of the 1st of May.

Quoth · 04-01-2020, 04:43 AM

I'd like it to be life + 25, but I'd be happy with the Berne Convention of life +50. The increases to 75 and 95 are nothing to do with rewarding estate of author and little to do with books. It's driven by the desire to have various Corporates have control forever of the music, TV, animations and movies that they have produced.

DRM should be illegal. It doesn't stop piracy and is really designed to control the consumer.

pdurrant · 04-01-2020, 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quoth

DRM should be illegal. It doesn't stop piracy and is really designed to control the consumer.

I think we'll have to leave DRM to another thread.

JSWolf · 04-01-2020, 07:22 AM

I went lifetime of the author plus a number of years. The reason being that an author can die early and will no longer be supporting his/her family. So I do think his/her family should still get money from the books. Life+70 is stupid and brought on because Disney didn't want to lose copyright on the mouse. I'd be fine with life+50 and leave it be at that. Let the mouse be public domain.

library addict · 04-01-2020, 07:29 AM

Hidden until closed. I need to remember to come back and check.

I voted life plus a number of years.

pwalker8 · 04-01-2020, 08:35 AM

Fixed length, plus limited renewal. For the vast majority of books, the original 28 year copyright is more than adequate. Few books make any money after the initial release.

I'm open to a scheme where the author has the original copyright and then can renew the copyright as long as the book remains in print. Easy enough to do with ebooks. Renewal fee being a percentage of the sales from the previous 5 years assuming that you are renewing every 5 years. Of course, I also think that no book should be eligible for copyright unless an electronic version of it, in one of a specific format, resides in the Library of Congress, with the renewal fee's being dedicated to the maintenance of said library along with a mechanism for the general public to get electronic copies of any book that is in public domain.

Not going to happen, of course.

pdurrant · 04-01-2020, 08:35 AM

I've voted, but I won't give my opinion as I don't want (as poll creator) to bias anyone. I'm happy for others to chat.

SleepyBob · 04-01-2020, 09:54 AM

I voted fixed length, but I think there needs to be a different standard for published vs not published works.

pdurrant · 04-01-2020, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleepyBob

I voted fixed length, but I think there needs to be a different standard for published vs not published works.

To be able to copy something, one needs the original. If it's not published, only the author has the original.

tubemonkey · 04-01-2020, 10:16 AM

"The lifetime of the author, plus a number of years renewable indefinitely."

Failure to renew places the work(s) into the public domain.

theducks · 04-01-2020, 12:36 PM

Lifetime of the Author + 25 years ONLY IF HUMAN.
Corporations a simple 70, non-renewable.

My rationale:
For Human authors, dependents (not extended to just any heirs), The creator may not have been available to the rest of the Family, or the work impacted Family life due to deadlines and other requirements (tours...).
I chose 25, because most offspring are on their own by then. Thus less impact on THEIR lives.
Dependents should get something, as they may have been a sounding board or other contributor to the creation. But not the 'Aunt Tillies'

Sirtel · 04-01-2020, 01:46 PM

The lifetime of the author. Anyone can die early, not just authors. Why should their dependents get special treatment? When a street cleaner dies early, will his dependents get financial support for the next 25 or 50 years? Is the street cleaner's job less important than the author's? Do the street cleaner's dependents deserve financial support less than the author's dependents?

doubleshuffle · 04-01-2020, 02:42 PM

Life +20

CWatkinsNash · 04-01-2020, 02:58 PM

Lifetime plus some years to allow for time to clear out any existing contracts and product that may exist. I suppose the exact number should be averaged from terms of typical single-product contracts across various media.

I think we also need to legally update / clarify what counts as "published" in the digital age, for the purposes of applying compulsory licensing rules and determining if something is a personal document / not intended for publication.

MarjaE · 04-01-2020, 04:33 PM

We ought to find other solutions. And expecting everyone to join the gig economy isn't one.

The current system interferes with research, with preservation, and with accessibility.

Once we have other solutions, phasing it out should be possible, but until then short fixed terms may be a workable compromise. With anonymous works, collective works, authors disappearing, etc. life of the author was not, is not, and cannot be practical.

View Poll Results: What's your ideal form of copyright?
None. Copyright should just be abolished.	5	3.97%
Perpetual. Copyright should never expire.	0	0%
Some fixed length from first publication.	22	17.46%
Some fixed length, renewable a limited number of times.	20	15.87%
Some fixed length, renewable indefinitely.	5	3.97%
The lifetime of the author only.	21	16.67%
The lifetime of the author, plus a number of years.	28	22.22%
The lifetime of the author, plus a number of years renewable a limited number of times.	4	3.17%
The lifetime of the author, plus a number of years renewable indefinitely.	1	0.79%
Some fixed length, or the lifetime of the author, whichever is longer.	10	7.94%
Some fixed length, or the lifetime of the author plus a number of years, whichever is longer.	7	5.56%
The Blue One next to the Fish.	3	2.38%
Voters: 126. You may not vote on this poll

04-01-2020, 04:15 AM	#1
pdurrant The Grand Mouse 高貴的老鼠 Posts: 71,506 Karma: 306214458 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Norfolk, England Device: Kindle Voyage	Copyright Reform Poll Do the copyright laws need reform? Current law is life of author+50 years or life of author+70 years. The Berne convention (& successor conventions) require a minimum term or life of author+50 years. Changing seems practically impossible. But let's ignore the practicalities. In your ideal world, what would we do with copyright? If none of the options I've put in the poll come close to your choice, suggest something in the thread. The poll results are hidden until the poll ends on the morning of the 1st of May. Last edited by pdurrant; 04-01-2020 at 04:32 AM.

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04-01-2020, 04:43 AM	#2
Quoth the rook, bossing Never. Posts: 11,157 Karma: 85874891 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper11	I'd like it to be life + 25, but I'd be happy with the Berne Convention of life +50. The increases to 75 and 95 are nothing to do with rewarding estate of author and little to do with books. It's driven by the desire to have various Corporates have control forever of the music, TV, animations and movies that they have produced. DRM should be illegal. It doesn't stop piracy and is really designed to control the consumer.

04-01-2020, 07:22 AM	#4
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 73,974 Karma: 128903378 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	I went lifetime of the author plus a number of years. The reason being that an author can die early and will no longer be supporting his/her family. So I do think his/her family should still get money from the books. Life+70 is stupid and brought on because Disney didn't want to lose copyright on the mouse. I'd be fine with life+50 and leave it be at that. Let the mouse be public domain.

04-01-2020, 07:29 AM	#5
library addict Grand Sorcerer Posts: 12,883 Karma: 35535698 Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: USA Device: Nexus 7 2, Samsung Galaxy Tab A 8" (retired=Sony PRS650, Kobo Mini)	Hidden until closed. I need to remember to come back and check. I voted life plus a number of years.

04-01-2020, 08:35 AM	#6
pwalker8 Grand Sorcerer Posts: 7,195 Karma: 70314280 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Atlanta, GA Device: iPad Pro, iPad mini, Kobo Aura, Amazon paperwhite, Sony PRS-T2	Fixed length, plus limited renewal. For the vast majority of books, the original 28 year copyright is more than adequate. Few books make any money after the initial release. I'm open to a scheme where the author has the original copyright and then can renew the copyright as long as the book remains in print. Easy enough to do with ebooks. Renewal fee being a percentage of the sales from the previous 5 years assuming that you are renewing every 5 years. Of course, I also think that no book should be eligible for copyright unless an electronic version of it, in one of a specific format, resides in the Library of Congress, with the renewal fee's being dedicated to the maintenance of said library along with a mechanism for the general public to get electronic copies of any book that is in public domain. Not going to happen, of course.

04-01-2020, 09:54 AM	#8
SleepyBob Evangelist Posts: 420 Karma: 8522810 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Wisconsin, USA Device: Kindle PW3	I voted fixed length, but I think there needs to be a different standard for published vs not published works.

04-01-2020, 10:16 AM	#10
tubemonkey monkey on the fringe Posts: 45,477 Karma: 158151390 Join Date: May 2010 Location: Seattle Metro Device: Moto E6, Echo Show	"The lifetime of the author, plus a number of years renewable indefinitely." Failure to renew places the work(s) into the public domain.

04-01-2020, 12:36 PM	#11
theducks Well trained by Cats Posts: 29,800 Karma: 54830978 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Central Coast of California Device: Kobo Libra2,Kobo Aura2v1, K4NT(Fixed: New Bat.), Galaxy Tab A	Lifetime of the Author + 25 years ONLY IF HUMAN. Corporations a simple 70, non-renewable. My rationale: For Human authors, dependents (not extended to just any heirs), The creator may not have been available to the rest of the Family, or the work impacted Family life due to deadlines and other requirements (tours...). I chose 25, because most offspring are on their own by then. Thus less impact on THEIR lives. Dependents should get something, as they may have been a sounding board or other contributor to the creation. But not the 'Aunt Tillies'

04-01-2020, 01:46 PM	#12
Sirtel Grand Sorcerer Posts: 10,128 Karma: 224760044 Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Estonia Device: Kobo Sage & Libra 2	The lifetime of the author. Anyone can die early, not just authors. Why should their dependents get special treatment? When a street cleaner dies early, will his dependents get financial support for the next 25 or 50 years? Is the street cleaner's job less important than the author's? Do the street cleaner's dependents deserve financial support less than the author's dependents?

04-01-2020, 02:42 PM	#13
doubleshuffle Unicycle Daredevil Posts: 13,923 Karma: 185041098 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Planet of the Pudding Brains Device: Aura HD (R.I.P. After six years the USB socket died.) tolino shine 3	Life +20

04-01-2020, 02:58 PM	#14
CWatkinsNash IOC Chief Archivist Posts: 3,950 Karma: 53868218 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Fruitland Park, FL, USA Device: Meebook M7, Paperwhite 2021, Fire HD 8+, Fire HD 10+, Lenovo Tab P12	Lifetime plus some years to allow for time to clear out any existing contracts and product that may exist. I suppose the exact number should be averaged from terms of typical single-product contracts across various media. I think we also need to legally update / clarify what counts as "published" in the digital age, for the purposes of applying compulsory licensing rules and determining if something is a personal document / not intended for publication.

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04-01-2020, 04:33 PM	#15
MarjaE Guru Posts: 924 Karma: 53902736 Join Date: Jun 2015 Device: multiple	We ought to find other solutions. And expecting everyone to join the gig economy isn't one. The current system interferes with research, with preservation, and with accessibility. Once we have other solutions, phasing it out should be possible, but until then short fixed terms may be a workable compromise. With anonymous works, collective works, authors disappearing, etc. life of the author was not, is not, and cannot be practical.