Kindle Media Query

[Macsurfcat]

I think this is a revisit to an old topic, but I suppose I'm hoping for a better outcome. I've tried every form of Kindle conversion, and in every case, it appears Calibre is stripping out media queries targeting specific Kindle devices.

• Is this happening?
• Is there a work around?

[eschwartz]

Sounds like you may want to use kindlegen...

[Macsurfcat]

actually, we are in the middle of a dispute as to whether or not media queries of the form "@media amzn-mobi" will work using Kindle Previewer/kindlegen. When we add them to our CSS, they have no effect whatsoever, unless we use the form "@media amzn-kf8".

We have tested this many times, always with the same result:

"mobi" queries has no discernible effect on the output, either in a previewer or a kindle device

"kf8" will be incorporated in the generated CSS, and will effect the output for both an early Kindle, and a Fire type

when the kindle output file is "unpacked", a "mobi" type output will contain nothing in its style sheets that pertains to the query

Main CSS: epub selector:

.num00
{
font-size:small;
margin-top:1.3em;
margin-bottom:0em;
text-indent:-1.8em;
margin-left:3.5em;
margin-right:1.5em;
text-align:justify;
font-weight:normal;
}

Media Query: epub

@media amzn-mobi {
.num00
{
font-size:small;
margin-top:1.3em;
margin-bottom:0em;
text-indent:-3.8em;
margin-left:0em;
margin-right:1.5em;
text-align:justify;
font-weight:normal;
}
}

Unpacked Kindle file

style 0001.css [kindle file unpacked]

.num00
{
font-size:small;
margin-top:1.3em;
margin-bottom:0em;
text-indent:-1.8em;
margin-left:3.5em;
margin-right:1.5em;
text-align:justify;
font-weight:normal;
}

[kovidgoyal]

MOBI files support no CSS at all. Any CSS you specify is converted to the "equivalent" HTML 3.2 by both calibre and kindlegen.

As for amazon media queries, kindlegen is the only tool that uses/supports them. I never use kindlegen, so I have no idea as to the details of its media query support. The MOBI forum might be a better place to ask.

[Macsurfcat]

Yes, but when you unpack a mobi a CSS is output that accompanies the new epub generated by kindlegen. If the original epub used a media query of the form "amzn-kf8", the CSS of the new, kindlegen output epub, will include the media query in this form:


"@media all {
.num00
{
font-size:small;
margin-top:1.3em;
margin-bottom:0em;
text-indent:-3.8em;
margin-left:0em;
margin-right:1.5em;
text-align:justify;
font-weight:normal;
}
}

This is, in fact, a NEW media query exactly duplicating the original media query of form "amzn-kf8", in the original epub. Unless I'm greatly mistaken, the epub CREATED by kindlegen from our original epub is the file from which the mobi is created, and that is why the media query styles are incorporated in the final output.

Mobis don't use a CSS, but they incorporate the styles that are specified within, and if the media query is in an acceptable form, the styles enclosed within the query tag will be passed on to the mobi.

So, my original question stands, I think . . .

[kovidgoyal]

No, If you use kindlegen to produce a MOBI, the resulting MOBI will have

1) The old MOBi
2) The book in KF8 (new mobi) format
3) Optionally, the original epub

Depending on what tool you use to "unpack" the mobi what you get can come from any of those 3 sources. If you are seeing a CSS file it is definitely not from (1)

[Macsurfcat]

to "kovidgoyal":

I will take your advice, and continue this thread in MOBI.

thanks for your comments, and I LOVE Calibre, by the way

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by Macsurfcat

Yes, but when you unpack a mobi a CSS is output that accompanies the new epub generated by kindlegen.

I think you need to learn a bit more about Mobi, KF8 and the combined Mobi/KF8 that kindlegen produces.

A Mobi does not contain any CSS.

[Macsurfcat]

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

No, If you use kindlegen to produce a MOBI, the resulting MOBI will have

1) The old MOBi
2) The book in KF8 (new mobi) format
3) Optionally, the original epub

Depending on what tool you use to "unpack" the mobi what you get can come from any of those 3 sources. If you are seeing a CSS file it is definitely not from (1)

Ummm, there is NO old mobi.

I take an epub with a media query; I ingest it into Kindle Previewer; it spits out a new mobi, that I can preview, load into a Kindle device, etc.

If I use the Kindle Unpack [Calibre plugin] to look inside that NEW mobi, it generates two folders:

mobi7
mobi8

mobi8 includes a BRAND NEW epub.

That BRAND NEW epub features a CSS that includes the "@media all" tag, etc. featured above.

Am I missing something?

[Macsurfcat]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

I think you need to learn a bit more about Mobi, KF8 and the combined Mobi/KF8 that kindlegen produces.

A Mobi does not contain any CSS.

Sorry, I know the mobi doesn't use a CSS. However, the CSS in the original epub is used to generate the code within the Mobi, does it not?

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by Macsurfcat

Am I missing something?

You're missing the fact that Kindlegen generates a file that contains two version of your book. And old Mobi format version using HTML 3.2, and a new KF8 format version using HTML4 and CSS2.

The mobi7 in the kindleunpack output it the Mobi format bit. The mobi8 is the KF8 bit. So of course the KF8 bit contains CSS.

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by Macsurfcat

Ummm, there is NO old mobi.

I take an epub with a media query; I ingest it into Kindle Previewer; it spits out a new mobi, that I can preview, load into a Kindle device, etc.

If I use the Kindle Unpack [Calibre plugin] to look inside that NEW mobi, it generates two folders:

mobi7
mobi8

mobi8 includes a BRAND NEW epub.

That BRAND NEW epub features a CSS that includes the "@media all" tag, etc. featured above.

Am I missing something?

You are missing the part where the description for KindleUnpack points out it will create that EPUB, using the "option 3) original epub" if available.

[pdurrant]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

You are missing the part where the description for KindleUnpack points out it will create that EPUB, using the "option 3) original epub" if available.

KindleUnpack does generate a pseudo-epub from the KF8 section, even if the original sources have been stripped off.

[Macsurfcat]

Not missing that at all, I completely understand that . . .

Yes, the KF8 bit contains a CSS, and an epub that is NOT the original ingested by Kindlegen, and that CSS includes a "@media all" tag. And that, my friend, is the issue.

Returning to the first post, if you include a media tag of the form "amzn-mobi" in your CSS, in your original epub, and you ingest that into Kindle Previewer/Kindlegen, that media query neither effects the old mobi bit, nor the new KF8 bit. So, if I open that mobi on a Kindle Fire, or a "paperwhite", none of the styling enclosed within the media query will appear. If that is true, and it appears to be so, how do I target the older device/format?

Please comment

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by pdurrant

KindleUnpack does generate a pseudo-epub from the KF8 section, even if the original sources have been stripped off.

But ONLY if the sources were stripped.