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Old 02-25-2018, 03:23 PM   #76
PeterT
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Only a percentage of book readers use e-ink ebook readers.
Makes no difference if only one or all book readers use e-ink it's still a percentage,which might range from close to 0% to 100%.
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Old 02-25-2018, 04:06 PM   #77
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For coffee table style heavily color illustrated type books it is still hard to beat the slick paper printed book.
IMO, an e-book with illustrations of decent resolution on a 40+" UHD display would blow away any printed coffee table book.
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Old 02-25-2018, 04:26 PM   #78
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I have a hoard of ereaders, but this is the one issue I have. I'm not sure there is a big enough market for 10" ereaders, but I'm hopeful that eventually Amazon will come out with one. There are plenty of baby boomers with diminishing vision who would certainly benefit, but it won't succeed if it is significantly more costly than current models. I use a tablet now to read magazines and I don't really enjoy the reflection or running out of power all the time. I like to be able to go a couple of weeks without recharge!
I'm kind of surprised that Amazon doesn't offer a large e-ink device. I would definitely reconsider using e-ink if they offered one with a large screen. As it is, I can get by with reading on my 5.3" phone when I'm out and about, but prefer the 10" tablet for longer, serious reading.
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Old 02-25-2018, 04:46 PM   #79
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I know a few hardcore readers in real life. None use an eink e-reader. They read on paper or iPads.
There are a lot of "hardcore" readers here (and elsewhere) who almost exclusively use eInk. Amazon seems to understand that, as statements in recent interviews indicate.
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Old 02-25-2018, 04:52 PM   #80
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Now I wonder if that's effectively only for books read within the purchase eco-system. In my case, I tend not to read any of my Kobo-purchased titles on my Kobo (for a start, it's full) and load them onto my Icarus instead.
This is true for me as well. Almost all the books I've bought on Amazon (and many of these are reprints of religious or historical books) have been moved to my Sonys and (some, not all) read there. And many of those are books I have (or had) in paper form (so read earlier in my life). On the other hand, I've read about 30 novels (and some non-fiction) in the last three (or four) months mostly on my Kindles that I borrowed from the library. I'm pretty sure Amazon keeps track of that also – so I guess I'm kind of "evening out."
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Old 02-25-2018, 05:04 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by rcentros View Post
There are a lot of "hardcore" readers here (and elsewhere) who almost exclusively use eInk. Amazon seems to understand that, as statements in recent interviews indicate.
I don't think Amazon supports eink solely out of a desire to cater to avid readers. I think they support eink because the devices are encouraging users to stay within the Kindle ecosystem.

On my phone, I can just as easily pull up a Nook, Google or Kobo app as the Kindle app.

Last edited by Alohamora; 02-25-2018 at 05:28 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old 02-25-2018, 05:26 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Alohamora View Post
I don't think Amazon supports eink solely out of a desire to cater to aid readers. I think they support eink because the devices are encouraging users to stay within the Kindle ecosystem.

On my phone, I can just as easily pull up a Nook, Google or Kobo app as the Kindle app.
That's a good point. On my Amazon tablet I mostly read using the Kindle app, but with the Aldiko app I can also read Google Books with Adobe DRM. I have quite a few ebooks through Google.
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Old 02-25-2018, 05:33 PM   #83
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I have a new neighbor who moved in recently and she was telling me that she reads as much as she can on her Kindle but it bothers her eyes and she does the rest of her reading with used paperbacks. Then she showed me her Kindle and it turns out to be a 10" Fire tablet. She thought that was a Kindle ereader.

Amazon created that problem when the called the first Fire the Kindle Fire. That caused a lot of confusion and the next generation was simply the Fire tablet. But even in this forum full of knowledgeable people it's still called a Kindle Fire almost as much as it's called a Fire tablet. I've called it that myself a few times without thinking.

I think this points to part of the reason e-ink hasn't been a rising star recently: people don't really know about it. When they think of a Kindle they think of whatever Amazon device they've seen and that's probably a Fire more often than not. Even professional tech reviewers refer to e-ink readers as having backlights. People don't know.

Another reason is that a lot of people are perfectly happy reading on their phone or a tablet. A lot of people are bothered by reading on a backlit device but I think a lot more aren't. Others read on tablets such as the Fire or the Ipad.

I think another reason is that there's a kind of spiritual backlash: people saying they love the smell of rotting paper, etc.

And of course there's the highly dishonest marketing being done by the publishers to promote paper books and show how ebooks are falling behind. Publishers as used car salesmen! They're having an effect. They make more money with paper. They've been fighting ebooks from the start.

So what! Ebooks on e-ink makes more sense in a culture that mostly reads novels and in an environment where cutting down trees to make paper is detrimental to the environment.

For most of the world ebooks began with the first Kindle in 2007, 11 years ago. I'm not sure cars caught on as fast as ereaders have. I'm pretty sure airplanes didn't. I just looked at a chart of ereader sales which spiked in 2011 selling almost 4 times as many as in 2010. Since then their sales have been declining but not nearly as much as tablet sales.

They're still selling over 20 million ereaders worldwide every year and that's a lot.

Barry
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Old 02-25-2018, 06:39 PM   #84
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I have a new neighbor who moved in recently and she was telling me that she reads as much as she can on her Kindle but it bothers her eyes and she does the rest of her reading with used paperbacks. Then she showed me her Kindle and it turns out to be a 10" Fire tablet. She thought that was a Kindle ereader.
Did you show her your e-ink Kindle? If so, what did she think?
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:16 PM   #85
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I don't think Amazon supports eink solely out of a desire to cater to avid readers. I think they support eink because the devices are encouraging users to stay within the Kindle ecosystem.

On my phone, I can just as easily pull up a Nook, Google or Kobo app as the Kindle app.
I think Amazon "supports" eInk because it makes them money to do so. And, in recent (November, 2017) interview, Amazon’s Chris Green, VP of Design spoke about a single use device ...

Quote:
He was extremely optimistic as to the future of e-readers in general. It’s a great example of how a device with a single purpose is often the right tool for the job.

“It’s the difference between a hammer and a Swiss Army Knife, isn’t it? If you want to go on a vacation or commute, you want a hammer — you want a real e-reader, so you don’t fall down a rabbit hole of your phone.”

And the Kindle business, he pointed out, is booming: “The last Prime Day was the best sales day ever in the U.S. — and the market is just growing. It’s taking off,” he said.

“We’re going to be here for a long time.”
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:20 PM   #86
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I guess many factors will contribute to the ereader's death

There are probably some reasons that, combined together, will cause slow demise of e-book readers. Some of them are listed in the article, like the declining number of people who actually read books, or little real innovation in the world of e-readers. I may add a couple of my own observations, which made me give my Kindle to my son and switch to a tablet instead.
  • Being locked to one ecosystem. As much as I like Kindle, I occasionaly read books that are unavailable in its format (like older books that have been scanned and are available on Google books). The same goes for many non-English books. To read these I need a tablet which is not tied to just one e-book ecosystem.
  • I read many academic books. While Kindle is OK for fiction, it is less then ideal for textbooks, academic books and generally non-fiction (because of complex formatting, tables, illustrations, footnotes etc.)
  • To make notes I can easily attach a (bluetooth) keyboard to my tablet. This is impossible to do with a Kindle. Also, there is no note-taking app on Kindle, like Evernote or OneNote and the note-taking functionality of Kindle itself is too limited for my needs.
  • Too few ebooks formatted for Kindle use real pages. This makes quoting them very awkward. Conversely, most books available through Google Books have real page numbers.
  • PDF support on e-readers is erratic. Some readers will display some PDFs, but they can't be relied upon.
  • I seriously considered buying the new Oasis, mainly because of its being waterproof. But the price is so steep for what it can do that I stayed with my tablet, buying a cheap waterproof case (or rather sleeve).
That said, I hate Google Books being tied to the ADE system, which on the whole is much more restrictive than the Amazon's one, so whenever there's a choice, I still buy books from Amazon.
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:36 PM   #87
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[*]Being locked to one ecosystem. As much as I like Kindle, I occasionaly read books that are unavailable in its format (like older books that have been scanned and are available on Google books). The same goes for many non-English books. To read these I need a tablet which is not tied to just one e-book ecosystem.
You're not locked to one ecosystem if you can be bothered to learn about de-DRM-ing and converting. I buy books from Kobo and Google all the time and read them on my e-ink Kindles, so do most of the other active members of MobileRead. Granted, many people don't want to bother and for them it's just easier to use different apps on their tablet (which I personally feel would be a major pain in the backside, but to each his own).

As for nonfiction books, academic papers and PDF-s, a tablet is indeed the better option.
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Old 02-25-2018, 08:57 PM   #88
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You're not locked to one ecosystem if you can be bothered to learn about de-DRM-ing and converting. I buy books from Kobo and Google all the time and read them on my e-ink Kindles, so do most of the other active members of MobileRead. Granted, many people don't want to bother and for them it's just easier to use different apps on their tablet (which I personally feel would be a major pain in the backside, but to each his own).

As for nonfiction books, academic papers and PDF-s, a tablet is indeed the better option.
That requires extra steps via computer, though. I expect majority of consumers find downloading directly using the device with the requisite app easier.
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Old 02-25-2018, 09:17 PM   #89
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IMO, an e-book with illustrations of decent resolution on a 40+" UHD display would blow away any printed coffee table book.
As a pretty serious photographer, I know that nothing beats a printed photo using high quality color and lighting control. Calibrated screens are getting better, but I don't know of any tablets that can be calibrated. (which is what we are talking about), and if the 40 inch UHD display is not calibrated, it is no more accurate than a tablet.
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Old 02-25-2018, 09:21 PM   #90
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You're not locked to one ecosystem if you can be bothered to learn about de-DRM-ing and converting. I buy books from Kobo and Google all the time and read them on my e-ink Kindles, so do most of the other active members of MobileRead. Granted, many people don't want to bother and for them it's just easier to use different apps on their tablet (which I personally feel would be a major pain in the backside, but to each his own).

As for nonfiction books, academic papers and PDF-s, a tablet is indeed the better option.
Personally, I find that WAY too much trouble! If I have a non Kindle book I want to read, I just use my tablet. I like my Paperwhite very much, and I prefer to use it, but it's just easier to occasionally use my tablet.
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