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Old 08-08-2008, 09:07 PM   #1
nekokami
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Original manga-style graphic novel

Um. This is slightly embarrassing, but it's been suggested that I start a thread here telling people I'm working on a manga-style graphic novel. There's a link in my signature line, but you have to register at that site to see the images, and they're reduced in size and resolution due to the limits of the site, so I also put them in my gallery here at MR:

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/album.php?albumid=62

The photo gallery lists them from most recent to least recent, so go to the "last" image and use the "prev" button to navigate. I'll post additional pages as they are completed. I'm only up to 6 "finished" pages so far, though I've got the plot, dialogue, storyboards, etc. for rather more than that.

Synopsis:

Quote:
Younger son of a famous teahouse in Shiga Prefecture, Mitsunari has accepted an arranged engagement to Jyunko, only child of one of the most prestigious teahouses in Tokyo. Jyunko is beautiful, graceful, and kind. However, as he begins to get to know his betrothed, Mitsunari realizes that all is not as it seems....

Please be advised that this manga story contains some mature and controversial themes. Recommended audience: Older teens and up.
For the curious, I'm not actually much good at drawing. I use 3D software (usually Daz Studio, sometimes Carrara or Hexagon) to generate the images, then compose the pages using Manga Studio. I'm not completely happy with what happens to the images when they get imported to Manga Studio, so I'm still working on that part of the process.

Comments welcome, of course, either here, in the gallery, or in PM... whatever.

Edit: the link in my sig line now points to this thread. It used to point to http://artzone.daz3d.com/index.php?a...view&uid=20599 in case anyone cares.
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Old 08-08-2008, 09:09 PM   #2
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yay ! go neko !!

go read it y'all, it's about to get really exciting.
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Old 08-08-2008, 10:24 PM   #3
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Wholly Cripes!! Get your sword! Grab your spear!

I gotta know what happens next!

It's looking great Mistress nekokami! Really great!
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Old 08-09-2008, 10:27 AM   #4
nekokami
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Working on it today....
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Old 08-09-2008, 11:33 AM   #5
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Hey, this looks intriguing .

I've not read any manga-style stories before, and initially found myself just reading the text. Second time through I paid attention to the graphics as well, and then it gelled.

Good job and thanks Nekokami! Looking forward to the next installment .
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Old 08-09-2008, 02:09 PM   #6
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Nice, but the dithering is not the best I've seen - what process do you use to create the final images?

I've recently read Eden: It's an Endless World! by Hiroki Endo on the prs-505 and the dithering/general image quality produced by FangornUK's comiclrf script definitely looked better, perhaps you could run your source images through that?

For the rest it's great, but I've always been a sucker for CGI and manga, so any combination will sit well with me
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Old 08-09-2008, 05:56 PM   #7
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Thanks for the input.

As noted earlier, I generate my images using Daz Studio as 3d software (sometimes using Cararra for landscapes or Hexagon for model editing, and in one case I used a "comp" photo as a background). I use a Daz Studio plugin called pwToon to get the outlines, but for some elements, e.g. hair and eyes, I use pwSketch, because I like the way it looks better. (pwToon provides nice configurable outlines, and can do shading as zip tones, but doesn't convert color or patterns to b&w. pwSketch does, but doesn't do fixed-width outlines.)

Then I import the PNG files into Manga Studio, after setting up the panels. Manga Studio can convert to grayscale or can convert to screentone-- it doesn't handle colored image import (not that I want color for this anyway). I've been using the screentone setting, which I think is making the outlines a bit grainy. I also set this project up at 300dpi, which I think was an error. I thought it would be plenty given that I'd only be using 72 dpi in the screen version, but the way Manga Studio converts to screentones introduces a lot of pixelation, even though I have screentones set to 85 lines (the maximum). From Manga Studio I output JPG files at 300 dpi. The result is what you see in my gallery here at MR... except that MR automatically reduces file size and so I may be losing some image definition there. At Artzone I'm restricted in filesize, so I manually reduce the JPG file dimensions, usually with Fireworks.

Things I'm thinking of trying:

a - converting the various color/pattern files ("textures") to b&w screentone patterns and then applying them in Daz Studio, and importing the resulting rendered images to Manga Studio with minimal image conversion-- this should greatly improve the crispness of the outlines.

b - Importing the images to Manga Studio as grayscale, rather than converting to tone. I don't know how this would look in print, but it would probably look a lot better on the screen, as screentones actually don't display well at 72 dpi.

c - Either way, I might redo the existing pages at 600 dpi, though that would generate some really huge JPG files, and I wouldn't be able to post them at MR or AZ at that file size.

I may post a couple of examples of my image conversion experiments in this area. I'd love to get comments about which results look best to folks when viewing online. The odds of printing ever being much of a concern for this title are pretty low, after all.
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Old 08-09-2008, 07:35 PM   #8
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Well, I tried importing to grayscale rather than converting to tone in Manga Studio, and the pages look much nicer while I'm looking at them in Manga Studio, but the export still apparently converts to screentone. I did update page 6 slightly to make it more clear that Miyako, who has just arrived on the scene, is carrying gardening implements and not just random sticks.
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Old 08-09-2008, 10:10 PM   #9
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Page 7 is up. Sorry, the ninjas will be in the next page. (Glimpses, anyway!)
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Old 08-09-2008, 11:19 PM   #10
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It's intriguing. I want to know what happens next.

(The kimono sleeves aren't entirely accurate, but I doubt whether that's very important.)
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Old 08-10-2008, 12:02 AM   #11
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Tessen and Shuriken!

I know you can't rush art, but this is gonna be painful having this one page at a time.

Thanks nekokami!
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Old 08-10-2008, 05:59 AM   #12
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Hm, do you mind showing me one of the PNG files before you imported it to Manga Studio? I'd like to experiment with different conversion methods, maybe you'll like one of them.
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Old 08-10-2008, 06:19 AM   #13
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looking forward to seeing how this progresses....
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Old 08-10-2008, 01:21 PM   #14
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I did some more experimenting with image export and I'm considerably happier with the results. Readers might want to check the album here. Comments appreciated!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patricia View Post
It's intriguing. I want to know what happens next.

(The kimono sleeves aren't entirely accurate, but I doubt whether that's very important.)
I know the kimono don't look quite right. I've actually made several in "real life," from traditional patterns. There are major problems with getting the 3-d software I use to handle the sleeves correctly. Hopefully it doesn't get in the way of the story too much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IceHand View Post
Hm, do you mind showing me one of the PNG files before you imported it to Manga Studio? I'd like to experiment with different conversion methods, maybe you'll like one of them.
As noted above, I did experiment with different aspects of the import/export process. It's not a problem with how the files get imported to Manga Studio (though there are some stubborn format problems that I still want to chase down). It's a problem with how Manga Studio exports the files. It wants to convert every page to a "screentone" version, even if I want to keep grayscale.

I ended up using a 25% view in Manga Studio and taking a screen shot, which seems really lame, but at least the results are viewable online.

Scott McCloud, one of my own favorite American comic artists, has some excellent advice about online display of art, and one of his recommendations is not to use crosshatching or screentone, which are designed to allow display of different shades of gray in printing. At 72dpi they look pretty bad, whereas just using a shade of gray can look fine. So that's what I'll be aiming for in the online version from now on, I think (and I rather doubt there will ever be a print version).
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Old 08-10-2008, 05:52 PM   #15
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But don't let my trivial comment re sleeves discourage you. I'm really looking forward to the next installment.
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