E-books are fast becoming tools of corporate surveillance

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by leebase

They provided no evidence that libraries aren't selling data on the books and ebooks of their patrons.

In Canada, your local library has a privacy officer though that position is often filled by someone who has other duties. The only way to get information on books and ebooks borrowed by a patron is to show up with a court order. Anonymized data could be sold though no one seems to be lining up to pay for that type of information, the sort of information that says 39% of library loans are physical books, 44% are ebooks and the remaining 17% is CDs, DVDs, audiobooks, etc.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DNSB

Sadly, the first payment model for Kindle Unlimited was pretty much what you are advocating for. To put it mildly, it was a disaster for most authors. You might want to check articles such as A History of Kindle Unlimited for more on this.

Authors might do well from sales (less than 1% of them), but never from libraries. KU is essentially a subscription library and the incessant "Free on Kindle Unlimited" is dishonest for a subscription library. Our local library is free (unlike KU), yet no-one talks about free books, not even the Library, because they (paper, ebook, audio book or whatever) are only borrows. So the KU marketing is doubly dishonest and takes away from real sales of books, but it's automatic income for Amazon even if someone doesn't borrow and unlike other libraries they pay nothing up front. No wonder Archive Org thinks they should be able to run their Open Library (which pays nothing).

So almost everything about every version of KU is hearsay or propaganda. Amazon decides the rules, the money etc. This A History of Kindle Unlimited is interesting, but a lot is speculative in terms of the percentage of authors that benefit significantly. Each change was because the model was fundamentally broken and none would have been needed if it had worked like UK or Ireland library in the first place. Also the people that benefited at each stage (apart from when subscriber number were too low) were not the authors giving a good deal to readers, but Amazon and scammers. Of course Amazon wants to make a profit and in the UK & Ireland Libraries make no profit. They are loss making by design. Amazon with KU has a broken version of late 18th C / early 19th C British Subscription libraries, so stupidly designed that it can only work by invasion of the privacy of the reader. My local library, apart from not using the info commercially, has no idea if I read any of the paper books or ebooks or audio books I borrow, without me taking any mitigating steps. If you do implement privacy with Amazon, no-one gets paid. That's the Emperor with no clothes, the elephant in the room. KU is inherently broken and wrong.

The model of tracking is fundamentally wrong, even if it achieves Amazon's aims (which are not fairness for consumers or authors/publishers) but boosting Amazon. The exclusive nature is also wrong. I know there are "libertarian capitalists" here, but their views on not regulating corporate entities only benefit the rich and powerful. Eventually the EU will ban the KU system (no upfront payment, tracking of people and exclusivity) because it's exploitive, monopolistic and dishonest marketing.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Authors might do well from sales (less than 1% of them), but never from libraries. KU is essentially a subscription library and the incessant "Free on Kindle Unlimited" is dishonest for a subscription library. Our local library is free (unlike KU), yet no-one talks about free books, not even the Library, because they (paper, ebook, audio book or whatever) are only borrows. So the KU marketing is doubly dishonest and takes away from real sales of books, but it's automatic income for Amazon even if someone doesn't borrow and unlike other libraries they pay nothing up front. No wonder Archive Org thinks they should be able to run their Open Library (which pays nothing).

Oddly, many of the authors I've chatted with use KU because the majority of their income came from KU. Some of them are now moving to wide since KU is not paying as much as it used to. Some have been burned by having their KU enrollment cancelled when their books were found on pirate sites and others have had their accounts dropped for no known reason.

Possible reasons for the dropping payments has been discussed to death but one popular theory is the mix of AI written content and AI driven clickfarms taking a larger chunk of the KU pie. Sadly, since Amazon does not release that data, those theories are not testable.

As for the local library being free? Last time I looked, the taxpayers pay for the majority of the local library expenses out of their tax payments in addition to donations and other income sources. TANSTAAFL.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DNSB

As for the local library being free? Last time I looked, the taxpayers pay for the majority of the local library expenses out of their tax payments in addition to donations and other income sources. TANSTAAFL.

The Library makes a loss. It's free for all residents, not just the ones that pay tax. A social service. The libraries here have no donations or other income.

But taxes pay also for the public parks, which are also free to use.
Taxes pay for the pavements and street lights, which are free to use.
There are maybe four or five tolls (a couple of bridges, a tunnel, a road or two). The rest of the roads free and paid for by taxes.

Bus & train (and some other services) are free for over 65 and some other people, and often a companion.
The TV licence is free for age 70 and up and some other people, otherwise €160 p.a.

Only people above a certain income pay income tax. Certain incomes can be tax free. Companies d other business also pay tax. Food and children's clothes/footwear have no VAT.

Dental, hospital, doctors and prescriptions can be free and are also subsidised for those that pay.

So in the normal sense of the word Irish Libraries are free, but don't advertise free books, they are loans (even the ebooks & audio books not monitored like KU), yet KU advertises free titles and it's a subscription service and loans with pervasive tracking.

[DNSB]

Sadly since I am one of the people who is paying taxes, I am paying for the local library, the roads and other infrastructure. They are not "free" since free implies that no one is paying anything for them given the definition of free that would apply is "without cost or payment" or "given or available without charge". That I am not charged a direct fee to use a local park does not make it free when part of my property taxes goes to the costs involved with that park.

No TV license here though the CBC does get government support. Income tax is much the same as in Ireland. Below a certain income, the basic deductable makes the total payable zero.

Dental I pay for though Canada is introducing a new dental plan starting next year with seniors 87 years or older thought that age limit will be dropping. Prescriptions I also pay for a private plan since the provincial Pharmacare program has, for me, a deductible of $3,750 annually (income dependent so having saved for my retirement is costing me). Hospitals are covered by a provincial plan so "free" though going by my tax bill breakdown, that "free" is costing me.

[Renate]

Originally Posted by Quoth

Bus & train (and some other services) are free for over 65 and some other people, and often a companion.

Wow! That's great. Can I move there?

I have to pay $4 for a 100 mile bus ride.
Errr, wait, that's a pretty good deal too.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by Renate

Wow! That's great. Can I move there?

I have to pay $4 for a 100 mile bus ride.
Errr, wait, that's a pretty good deal too.

Luxembourg has free public transport for everyone. Theory is to reduce car use. Unlike Ireland you don't have to be old or decrepit.

I don't know if you can move here. Have you at least one Irish grandparent (can be born in NI UK if it was before 1922), or a citizen of any EU country, or yourself born in the NI part of the UK. Or married to someone that qualifies on any of those?

Or you can be an asylum seeker / refugee, or Ukrainian. Or get visa / job permit and apply for naturalisation eventually.

[Renate]

I am both old and decrepit, but I have no direct connection to Ireland.
I did vacation there once with my guitar on my back and enjoyed it greatly.
We'll have to see what 2024 brings in the States to consider emmigration.

[drofgnal]

Originally Posted by Uncle Robin

Nah, it's a machiavellian ploy by Big Print to scare people back to dead tree books

Sounds like the latest in conspiracy theories. Maybe this thread belongs in the politics sub forum.

[John F]

Originally Posted by drofgnal

Sounds like the latest in conspiracy theories. Maybe this thread belongs in the politics sub forum.

You must be a minion of Big Print trying to get the thread moved to obscurity.

[ekbell]

Originally Posted by Quoth

That's a consequence of the payment system also being broken. Amazon should pay in advance (per number simultaneously lent, so nothing if no-one borrows), (a library has to buy the paper or ebooks) and then pay a small royalty per loan, even if it's not read (Like UK and Irish Libraries do).

The critical difference between Amazon Unlimited and the old style subscription libraries is that Amazon is not choosing the books that go into the library. Before you can set up a payment system such as in UK and Irish libraries, you need to figure how to prevent scammers from getting a upfront payment for garbage in a system which can get submissions from anyone with access to the internet. Ideally without needing a multitude of slush readers who'd then need to be paid.

Honestly I'm glad Amazon is not calling it a subscription library as I don't think that an uncurated, poorly organized collection of books deserves to be called a library.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by ekbell

Honestly I'm glad Amazon is not calling it a subscription library as I don't think that an uncurated, poorly organized collection of books deserves to be called a library.

They are taking subscriptions. It's bad they don't check what they are offering.
It is a subscription library, so time they curated the content. Greed that they don't.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by John F

You must be a minion of Big Print trying to get the thread moved to obscurity.

Minions of Big Print, on average, get more than the living wage, which is more than the minimum wage. Most authors don't even earn a fraction of the minimum wage.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by haertig

"But we have to snoop on you so we can pay our authors!" is not a compelling reason for me to open myself up to their monitoring and analyzing of what I read and how I read it. Because I have a feeling they are not doing this just for the altruistic purposes of paying authors. They are doing it to increase their profits with enhanced advertising and targeted marketing based on data they glean from me. I choose not to supply them with that data.

I think this data is being sent to they know what it is you are reading regardless of what eBooks you've bought. Lots of eBooks are bought. But I think they want to know which ones you actually read.

For KU. the time reading is important. It helps Amazon make sure you are not just flipping pages to help get the author money.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by issybird

Who said anything about altruism? It's a business. Moreover, targeted marketing only works to the extent you actually fall for it. Why not show them and just not buy? I have to say it's stunning the number of cowboy romances I've not bought even though Goodreads has told me I'd like them.

Do you get told you also like alien romances with the green guy on the cover?