What is your process for testing an eBook across multiple devices? - Page 2

hobnail · 06-20-2021, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prestidigitweeze

I briefly tried the KePub Output plugin for Calibre but disabled it immediately because of the monospace font butchery and the obscene handling of squeezed em dashes. I hadn't noticed concentration-destroying spacing issues before or since.

Other people seem to use that plugin without issue, so perhaps there are inherent conflicts with the formatting of certain books. I only know that all four of the books I converted with that specific plugin had the same distracting spacing.

I think that plugin just adds spans around paragraphs, within the p tags. So the butchery is probably from the kobo's renderer. It was a long time ago when I tried it but I'd had a problem where if the book didn't have a cover page the entire book had messed up margins such that text was cut off at the edges.

davidfor · 06-21-2021, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prestidigitweeze

I briefly tried the KePub Output plugin for Calibre but disabled it immediately because of the monospace font butchery

Kobo do not supply a monospaced font. For epubs, recent firmware will use a font whose name starts with "Courier" if one is added to the device. This is what @DNSB referred to. But, I do not believe that kepubs do this. Or at least my quick test didn't show it.

Personally, I find the concern over monospaced fonts a bit strange. I remember noticing that the Kobo devices didn't support them when I got my original Touch. But, the only times I have ever noticed the lack is when someone points it out in discussions like this. All the books I have either don't need one, or use an embedded monospace font.

Quote:

and the obscene handling of squeezed em dashes. I hadn't noticed concentration-destroying spacing issues before or since.

What is a "squeezed em dash"? In the kepub renderer, the handling of spacing around emdashes, endashes and similar is wrong. But, you have to care for it to be noticeable or a problem.

Quote:

Other people seem to use that plugin without issue, so perhaps there are inherent conflicts with the formatting of certain books. I only know that all four of the books I converted with that specific plugin had the same distracting spacing.

No, it is a sign of how little people care about the typography. Most people don't care if ligatures are used. Or know what they are. Or if hyphens are used when emdashes or endashes should be used. Hell, most people have no idea what any of that meant. They might notice "smart" quotes instead of "straight" quotes, but, again, they probably don't care. I think if you showed the rendering of an epub and a kepub to someone, they would probably see the difference, and might even say the epub was better, but, it wouldn't matter to them. In the case of kepubs and epubs, most would probably say that the other advantages of kepubs outweigh the disadvantages.

And, as @hobnail said, it is not the driver or conversion, it is the renderer. These differences are in how the renderer lays out the text.

Uncle Robin · 06-21-2021, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davidfor

No, it is a sign of how little people care about the typography. Most people don't care if ligatures are used. Or know what they are. Or if hyphens are used when emdashes or endashes should be used. Hell, most people have no idea what any of that meant..

THIS! I know what ligatures are, I know what kerning is, but despite my best efforts at searching, have been totally unable to find a damn to give about either, at least when it comes to English recreational reading.

theducks · 06-21-2021, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davidfor

Kobo do not supply a monospaced font. For epubs, recent firmware will use a font whose name starts with "Courier" if one is added to the device. This is what @DNSB referred to. But, I do not believe that kepubs do this. Or at least my quick test didn't show it.

Sad news, for us who like books with relevant type.
eg Cursive for hand (short) written notes. Mono-spaced for old typewriters or glass teletype messages....
Do I need a rooted device to use the Courier method?
If I embed a mono-spaced font, will it be used?

DNSB · 06-21-2021, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

Sad news, for us who like books with relevant type.
eg Cursive for hand (short) written notes. Mono-spaced for old typewriters or glass teletype messages....

That's what embedded fonts are for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

Do I need a rooted device to use the Courier method?

Rooted? A foreign concept for a Kobo ereader. Just place a font whose name starts with Courier in a fonts (note no upper case) directory in the root of the exposed storage. If you have another favourite such as Source Code Prime, use the patch to enable using that font instead.

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

If I embed a mono-spaced font, will it be used?

If done properly, it will work. One of the few books where I bothered to do this was Andy Weir's The Martian where I liked seeing the VXWorks output in a monospaced font.

theducks · 06-21-2021, 01:23 PM

@DNSB

Thanks. So many different devices, I get confused which solution works with which. Right now I am fighting with 'Great Vibes' (A free Cursive from Google). I won't work on either my K4 (AZW3) or my Aura (as KEPUB), but looks fine in Calibre/Sigil.

hobnail · 06-21-2021, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

Sad news, for us who like books with relevant type.
eg Cursive for hand (short) written notes. Mono-spaced for old typewriters or glass teletype messages....

I've converted several books from Project Gutenberg where they have telegrams, and hand written notes or letters. I punt on the latter and just use italics. And for the kobo for the telegrams it just gets sans serif, which is better than nothing.

Quoth · 06-22-2021, 07:06 AM

I use font embedding. Of course Kindle users might not select it, so I check that the styles all make sense on a DXG, KK3 and PW3 in default mode (DXG only has default, though on a good day it does support monospaced, serif and sans).

JSWolf · 07-09-2021, 02:13 PM

It would help when comparing Readers to show both using the same eBook starting at at the same place.

theducks · 07-10-2021, 12:30 AM

I've never had dropcaps render identical on my Kobo and Kindle. For some reason they land just a tad different vertically .

JSWolf · 07-13-2021, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

I've never had dropcaps render identical on my Kobo and Kindle. For some reason they land just a tad different vertically .

And if the dropcaps are rendered for a specific font/line height, then they will break when the same settings whoever made the eBook are not used. I don't use the same line height or font so I will break dropcaps.

Dropcaps are one thing that needs to go away. Also, on a Kindle, a large first letter can also break the look of the eBook with that line being too high.

Quoth · 07-14-2021, 09:18 AM

I hate Drop Caps even in paper books. A publisher ego thing that should have stopped a 100 years ago. It was a fashion and reduces readability. We have better formatting styles to show the start of a chapter or section. I remove the formatting in ebooks.

Also they don't always work.

JSWolf · 07-14-2021, 01:35 PM

Another thing I dislike is when smallcaps are used to denote the start of a chapter and/or section. If you are going to denote the start of a chapter/section, do so with a non-indent as long as you also using proper spacing or a proper character between the sections. I prefer a 60% wide 2px <hr/>. It works realy well and if it gets to the end of the screen/page, you do see the line be it the bottom or the top and you easily know you are starting another section.

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06-21-2021, 01:23 PM	#21
theducks Well trained by Cats Posts: 29,809 Karma: 54830978 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Central Coast of California Device: Kobo Libra2,Kobo Aura2v1, K4NT(Fixed: New Bat.), Galaxy Tab A	@DNSB Thanks. So many different devices, I get confused which solution works with which. Right now I am fighting with 'Great Vibes' (A free Cursive from Google). I won't work on either my K4 (AZW3) or my Aura (as KEPUB), but looks fine in Calibre/Sigil.

06-22-2021, 07:06 AM	#23
Quoth the rook, bossing Never. Posts: 11,164 Karma: 85874891 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper11	I use font embedding. Of course Kindle users might not select it, so I check that the styles all make sense on a DXG, KK3 and PW3 in default mode (DXG only has default, though on a good day it does support monospaced, serif and sans).

07-09-2021, 02:13 PM	#24
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 74,015 Karma: 129333114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	It would help when comparing Readers to show both using the same eBook starting at at the same place.

07-10-2021, 12:30 AM	#25
theducks Well trained by Cats Posts: 29,809 Karma: 54830978 Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Central Coast of California Device: Kobo Libra2,Kobo Aura2v1, K4NT(Fixed: New Bat.), Galaxy Tab A	I've never had dropcaps render identical on my Kobo and Kindle. For some reason they land just a tad different vertically .

07-14-2021, 09:18 AM	#27
Quoth the rook, bossing Never. Posts: 11,164 Karma: 85874891 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper11	I hate Drop Caps even in paper books. A publisher ego thing that should have stopped a 100 years ago. It was a fashion and reduces readability. We have better formatting styles to show the start of a chapter or section. I remove the formatting in ebooks. Also they don't always work.

07-14-2021, 01:35 PM	#28
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 74,015 Karma: 129333114 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	Another thing I dislike is when smallcaps are used to denote the start of a chapter and/or section. If you are going to denote the start of a chapter/section, do so with a non-indent as long as you also using proper spacing or a proper character between the sections. I prefer a 60% wide 2px <hr/>. It works realy well and if it gets to the end of the screen/page, you do see the line be it the bottom or the top and you easily know you are starting another section.