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Old 04-14-2020, 04:29 PM   #1
arooni
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which english dictionary is the *fastest* in your experience (paperwhite 4)

I realize the Kindle is not a speed demon but often when I try to look up a word it takes so long that I lose interest in learning what it means and just infer from context. This along with sometimes herky/jerky highlighting (especially when trying to make multi page highlights) are my two biggest issues with koreader (though I can't help but love it versus the kindle native reading app :P).

Anyway, wondering if you found a dictionary that you found ultra rapid? I've tried wordnet, gnu, and 3-4 others that I don't remember. I've also turned fuzzy search off, and even tried saying "just 1 dictionary, don't search more than one".
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Old 04-14-2020, 05:52 PM   #2
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Still can't reproduce > 1s lookups on *any* device on my end ^^.

On the devices I have, the bottleneck is clearly I/O, the fastest one (Forma) happens the be the one with the least craptastic I/O performance.

TL;DR: Unless there's a specific quirk going on on newer Kindles that no-one has figured out yet, I'm afraid there's no magic bullet.

(I'd double-check manually with sdcv's CLI, while plugged in, and with the cpu governor pinned to performance, just in case).
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:22 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NiLuJe View Post
Still can't reproduce > 1s lookups on *any* device on my end ^^.

On the devices I have, the bottleneck is clearly I/O, the fastest one (Forma) happens the be the one with the least craptastic I/O performance.

TL;DR: Unless there's a specific quirk going on on newer Kindles that no-one has figured out yet, I'm afraid there's no magic bullet.

(I'd double-check manually with sdcv's CLI, while plugged in, and with the cpu governor pinned to performance, just in case).
Code:
[root@kindle koreader]# time ./sdcv -02 data/dict/ quaint
Found 3 items, similar to quaint.
-->WordNet (r) 1.7
-->quaint


quaint
     adj 1: strange in an interesting or pleasing way; "quaint dialect
            words"; "quaint streets of New Orleans, that most
            foreign of American cities"
     2: very strange or unusual; odd or even incongruous in
        character or appearance; "the head terminating in the
        quaint duck bill which gives the animal its vernacular
        name"- Bill Beatty; "came forth a quaint and fearful
        sight"- Sir Walter Scott; "a quaint sense of humor"
     3: attractively old-fashioned; "houses with quaint thatched
        roofs"; "a vaulted roof supporting old-time chimney pots"
        [syn: {old-time}]

-->GNU Collaborative International Dictionary of English
-->quaint

<p><b style="color: #00b">Quaint</b> <i>(?)</i>, <i style="color: #a00">a.</i> [OE. <span style="color: #8B4513">queint</span>, <span style="color: #8B4513">queynte</span>, <span style="color: #8B4513">coint</span>, prudent, wise, cunning, pretty, odd, OF. <span style="color: #8B4513">cointe</span> cultivated, amiable, agreeable, neat, fr. L. <span style="color: #8B4513">cognitus</span> known, p. p. of <span style="color: #8B4513">cognoscere</span> to know; <span style="color: #8B4513">con + noscere</span> (for <span style="color: #8B4513">gnoscere</span>) to know. See <a href="bword://Know">Know</a>, and cf. <a href="bword://Acquaint">Acquaint</a>, <a href="bword://Cognition">Cognition</a>.] <b>1.</b> Prudent; wise; hence, crafty; artful; wily. <span style="color: #00b">[Obs.]</span></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Clerks be full subtle and full <b>quaint</b>.</i> <small>Chaucer.</small></p><p><b>2.</b> Characterized by ingenuity or art; finely fashioned; skillfully wrought; elegant; graceful; nice; neat. <span style="color: #00b">[Archaic]</span> “ The <i>queynte</i> ring.” “ His <i>queynte</i> spear.” <small>Chaucer.</small> “ A shepherd young <i>quaint</i>.”  <small>Chapman.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Every look was coy and wondrous <b>quaint</b>.</i> <small>Spenser.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">To show bow <b>quaint</b> an orator you are.</i> <small>Shak.</small></p><p><b>3.</b> Curious and fanciful; affected; odd; whimsical; antique; archaic; singular; unusual; as, <span style="color: 33a"><i>quaint</i> architecture; a <i>quaint</i> expression.</span></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Some stroke of <b>quaint</b> yet simple pleasantry.</i> <small>Macaulay.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">An old, long-faced, long-bodied servant in <b>quaint</b> livery.</i> <small>W. Irving.</small></p><p><b>Syn.</b> -- <a href="bword://Quaint">Quaint</a>, <a href="bword://Odd">Odd</a>, <a href="bword://Antique">Antique</a>.  <i>Antique</i> is applied to that which has come down from the ancients, or which is made to imitate some ancient work of art. <i>Odd</i> implies disharmony, incongruity, or unevenness. An <i>odd</i> thing or person is an exception to general rules of calculation and procedure, or expectation and common experience. In the current use of <i>quaint</i>, the two ideas of <i>odd</i> and <i>antique</i> are combined, and the word is commonly applied to that which is pleasing by reason of both these qualities.  Thus, we speak of the <i>quaint</i> architecture of many old buildings in London; or a <i>quaint</i> expression, uniting at once the antique and the fanciful.</p>

-->Oxford Advanced Learner's Dictionary 8th Ed.
-->quaint


quaint  [quaint quainter quaintest] BrE  [kweɪnt] z_quaint__gb_1.wav NAmE  [kweɪnt] z_quaint__us_1.wav  adjective
attractive in an unusual or old-fashioned way
• quaint old customs
•  a quaint seaside village
Derived*Words: ↑quaintly ▪ ↑quaintness
Word*Origin:
 Middle English: from  Old French  cointe, from  Latin  cognitus  ‘ascertained’, past participle of  cognoscere. The original sense was  ‘wise, clever’, also  ‘ingenious, cunningly devised’, hence  ‘out of the ordinary’  and the current sense (late 18th cent.).
Example*Bank:
• The village looks rather quaint.
•  a quaint little town well worth a visit
•  Why not stay a night in this quaint seaside village?

real    0m 3.92s
user    0m 0.37s
sys     0m 0.77s
[root@kindle koreader]#
so getting 3+ seconds via sdcv ; is this due to multiple dictionaries being there? perhaps i need to move them out of that directory?
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:27 PM   #4
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i moved all dictionaries (except wordnet) to a disabled dictionaries directory in /koreader/data/disabled_dictionaries and it seems like sdcv really appreciate it. what's interesting is that in the koreader settings i told it to *only* use wordnet and none of the other dictionaries but it seemed to ignore that directive because when i physically moved the other dictionaries out of the path where it could see them lookup times via koreader were almost instantaneous. could this be the issue?

i've never seen lookups so fast! amazing! could my selection of available dictionaries i had previously be affecting lookups speeds (even though i told koreader to ignore them)

Code:
[root@kindle data]# cd disabled_dictionaries/
[root@kindle disabled_dictionaries]# ls -l
total 24
drwxrwxrwx    2 root     root          8192 Jan 26  2019 gcide
drwxrwxrwx    3 root     root          8192 Jul 29  2015 stardict-Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary-2.4.2
drwxrwxrwx    2 root     root          8192 Jan 30  2019 stardict-spanish-english-2.4.2
Code:
[root@kindle koreader]# time ./sdcv -02 data/dict/ quaint
Found 1 items, similar to quaint.
-->WordNet (r) 1.7
-->quaint


quaint
     adj 1: strange in an interesting or pleasing way; "quaint dialect
            words"; "quaint streets of New Orleans, that most
            foreign of American cities"
     2: very strange or unusual; odd or even incongruous in
        character or appearance; "the head terminating in the
        quaint duck bill which gives the animal its vernacular
        name"- Bill Beatty; "came forth a quaint and fearful
        sight"- Sir Walter Scott; "a quaint sense of humor"
     3: attractively old-fashioned; "houses with quaint thatched
        roofs"; "a vaulted roof supporting old-time chimney pots"
        [syn: {old-time}]

real    0m 0.07s
user    0m 0.01s
sys     0m 0.02s
[root@kindle koreader]# time ./sdcv -02 data/dict/ quaint
Found 1 items, similar to quaint.
-->WordNet (r) 1.7
-->quaint


quaint
     adj 1: strange in an interesting or pleasing way; "quaint dialect
            words"; "quaint streets of New Orleans, that most
            foreign of American cities"
     2: very strange or unusual; odd or even incongruous in
        character or appearance; "the head terminating in the
        quaint duck bill which gives the animal its vernacular
        name"- Bill Beatty; "came forth a quaint and fearful
        sight"- Sir Walter Scott; "a quaint sense of humor"
     3: attractively old-fashioned; "houses with quaint thatched
        roofs"; "a vaulted roof supporting old-time chimney pots"
        [syn: {old-time}]

real    0m 0.07s
user    0m 0.01s
sys     0m 0.02s
[root@kindle koreader]#
PS: is there any way to make the formatting more beautiful on the oxford advanced dictionary? seems very dense and could use some nice formatting but not sure how to adjust that

Last edited by arooni; 04-16-2020 at 02:51 PM.
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Old 04-16-2020, 03:48 PM   #5
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How many dictionaries were there? And how large were they? How fast are they on a one-by-one basis?

FWIW, on a PW2 (hot cache):

Code:
┌─(ROOT@kindle:pts/0)───────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────(/mnt/us/koreader)─┐
└─(1.06:60%:21:46:92%:#)── time ./sdcv -02 data/dict quaint                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            ──(Thu, Apr 16)─┘
Found 2 items, similar to quaint.
-->GNU Collaborative International Dictionary of English
-->quaint

<p><b style="color: #00b">Quaint</b> <i>(?)</i>, <i style="color: #a00">a.</i> [OE. <span style="color: #8B4513">queint</span>, <span style="color: #8B4513">queynte</span>, <span style="color: #8B4513">coint</span>, prudent, wise, cunning, pretty, odd, OF. <span style="color: #8B4513">cointe</span> cultivated, amiable, agreeable, neat, fr. L. <span style="color: #8B4513">cognitus</span> known, p. p. of <span style="color: #8B4513">cognoscere</span> to know; <span style="color: #8B4513">con + noscere</span> (for <span style="color: #8B4513">gnoscere</span>) to know. See <a href="bword://Know">Know</a>, and cf. <a href="bword://Acquaint">Acquaint</a>, <a href="bword://Cognition">Cognition</a>.] <b>1.</b> Prudent; wise; hence, crafty; artful; wily. <span style="color: #00b">[Obs.]</span></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Clerks be full subtle and full <b>quaint</b>.</i> <small>Chaucer.</small></p><p><b>2.</b> Characterized by ingenuity or art; finely fashioned; skillfully wrought; elegant; graceful; nice; neat. <span style="color: #00b">[Archaic]</span> “ The <i>queynte</i> ring.” “ His <i>queynte</i> spear.” <small>Chaucer.</small> “ A shepherd young <i>quaint</i>.”  <small>Chapman.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Every look was coy and wondrous <b>quaint</b>.</i> <small>Spenser.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">To show bow <b>quaint</b> an orator you are.</i> <small>Shak.</small></p><p><b>3.</b> Curious and fanciful; affected; odd; whimsical; antique; archaic; singular; unusual; as, <span style="color: 33a"><i>quaint</i> architecture; a <i>quaint</i> expression.</span></p><p><i style="color: #33f">Some stroke of <b>quaint</b> yet simple pleasantry.</i> <small>Macaulay.</small></p><p><i style="color: #33f">An old, long-faced, long-bodied servant in <b>quaint</b> livery.</i> <small>W. Irving.</small></p><p><b>Syn.</b> -- <a href="bword://Quaint">Quaint</a>, <a href="bword://Odd">Odd</a>, <a href="bword://Antique">Antique</a>.  <i>Antique</i> is applied to that which has come down from the ancients, or which is made to imitate some ancient work of art. <i>Odd</i> implies disharmony, incongruity, or unevenness. An <i>odd</i> thing or person is an exception to general rules of calculation and procedure, or expectation and common experience. In the current use of <i>quaint</i>, the two ideas of <i>odd</i> and <i>antique</i> are combined, and the word is commonly applied to that which is pleasing by reason of both these qualities.  Thus, we speak of the <i>quaint</i> architecture of many old buildings in London; or a <i>quaint</i> expression, uniting at once the antique and the fanciful.</p>

-->Online Etymology Dictionary, ©Douglas Harper/etymonline.com
-->quaint

<dt>quaint</dt><dd>c.1200, <i>cointe</i>, <span style="color: #47A">"cunning, ingenious; proud,"</span> from Old French <i>cointe</i> <span style="color: #47A">"knowledgeable, well-informed; clever; arrogant, proud; elegant, gracious,"</span> from Latin <i>cognitus</i> <span style="color: #47A">"known, approved,"</span> past participle of <i>cognoscere</i> <span style="color: #47A">"get or come to know well"</span> (see <a href="bword://cognizance">cognizance</a>). Modern spelling is from early 14c.
<br/><br/>
Later in English, <span style="color: #47A">"elaborate, skillfully made"</span> (c.1300); <span style="color: #47A">"strange and clever"</span> (mid-14c.). Sense of <span style="color: #47A">"old-fashioned but charming"</span> is first attested 1795, and could describe the word itself, which had become rare after c.1700 (though it soon recovered popularity in this secondary sense).  Related: <i>Quaintly</i>; <i>quaintness</i>.</dd>

- Real: 178ms User: 110ms System: 30ms Percent: 78% Cmd: ./sdcv -02 data/dict quaint MajFault: 21 VolContSw: 0 InvContSw: 231 -
I only have gcide, etymonline & the French XMLLittré installed.

----

I have no idea how the dict selection works in the GUI (but I'm guessing it doesn't really do anything for performance, since the cost is likely still I/O involved in traversing/enumerating the data dir).

Last edited by NiLuJe; 04-16-2020 at 03:52 PM.
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:05 PM   #6
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There might be some minor delay from drawing selection first but it's definitely mostly sdcv lookup.
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenzie View Post
There might be some minor delay from drawing selection first but it's definitely mostly sdcv lookup.
My point is that koreader doesn't seem to affect lookup speed based on me informing it via the GUI to ignore installed dictionaries. I seem to have to physically remove them from the koreader directory to get faster lookup speeds.
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:57 PM   #8
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It could be that sdcv loads all dictionaries even if you tell it to look in a specific one but that seems like an odd bug if so. But possible if it normally all happens in under 1-2 seconds.

Do these dictionaries have many files/folders that could slow things down even just to traverse?
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Old 04-16-2020, 05:11 PM   #9
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I think I tracked the problem down to Oxford Advanced Learner's Dictionary. When I move that into the dict directory look up times become untenable. Doesn't seem to matter whether it's enabled or not via the GUI in koreader.

What's crazy is the Oxford Advanced English directory is twice as large (200mb compressed) and doesn't seem to have slow lookup times.

Code:
Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.dict.dz  Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.idx.oft  res
[root@kindle stardict-Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary-2.4.2]# ls -lh
total 22048
-rwxrwxrwx    1 root     root        3.8K Jul 29  2015 Oxford Advanced Learner's Dictionary.txt
-rwxrwxrwx    1 root     root       18.7M May 18  2011 Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.dict.dz
-rwxrwxrwx    1 root     root        1.6M May 18  2011 Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.idx
-rwxrwxrwx    1 root     root        9.6K Jan 30  2019 Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.idx.oft
-rwxrwxrwx    1 root     root         164 May 18  2011 Oxford_Advanced_Learner_s_Dictionary.ifo
drwxrwxrwx    2 root     root        1.2M Jan 30  2019 res
In other news, i'm *very* happy about nearly instantaneous dictionary lookups!!! This was always pestering me and now I have got it working great! Many thanks for everyone's help (and moreover, thank you for koreader which has made daily reading easier and more enjoyable)!

fun fact; i used to use the small 'quickview' version of dictionary lookup because it took so long that i could fling it around the page and keep reading and abandon it if i gave up waiting. no longer! i can enjoy the full screen for defintions. yay!

also multi page highlighting never worked that well for me before, but you've gone and fixed it with https://github.com/koreader/koreader/pull/5984 .. i really have no idea how you can improve this app anymore but you folks keep finding ways!

Last edited by arooni; 04-16-2020 at 05:27 PM.
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