PRS-600 Screen Washed Out - Page 3

kennyc · 02-23-2010, 04:35 PM

I would try it anyway. It could be that there is a display initialization routing in the reset startup and it shouldn't hurt anything.

I wouldn't expect it to work any more than you though.

Mike_73 · 02-25-2010, 07:19 AM

I just tried my reader under direct sunlight. As the sun is low (but at least it shines), I did several page turns to really make sure. I got lucky. My reader works the same as inside a building.
Sony probably incorporates the manufacturing date within the serial number. Maybe all could compare device serials to see if there is some kind of similarity within the reader numbers having bad screens and the ones that haven't???

What do you all think about that?

Edit: I was thinking about this issue on my way home from work. What do you all think if I were to set up a blog, take all the serials and put them there. We could also post all other issues there too. I mean why can the reader look up words only in english. The programming is there and I wouldn't mind paying for an additional dictionary. But if the offer the User interface in different languages I think they should at least support the languages included. It just looks unfinished. Once enough serials would be there, I could point Sony service directly to the blog instead of hoping that they read all the posts here.

Xochipilli2012 · 02-26-2010, 02:11 PM

I will probably bite the bullet and try a hard reset the next time we get some sun around here (could be weeks! hahaha...). I bought my PRS-600 from New Egg with 1-year replacement protection, so I'm hoping there's no rush to work this out. I really don't find having to shade the screen during page turns in the sun to be terribly inconvenient, so if it turns out that there's no reliable "fix" for this, I won't be too bummed. But if it is a "problem" with the screen, I'm concerned it may indicate a vulnerability for other "fails" down the road. So I'm mildly motivated to address this. I've ordered an EZ Reader Pocket Pro as a "backup" in case I do wind up replacing the Sony. I'll keep y'all apprised of further developments with this.

Peace.

igorsk · 02-26-2010, 08:38 PM

This has been mentioned several times on these forums. It is caused by a batch of bad screens by LG-Philips. People who have PVI screens do not suffer from it. As far as I can tell the screen is perfectly normal except that it fades in the direct sunlight, and the effect is completely reversible in the shadow.

Mike_73 · 02-27-2010, 07:17 AM

I don't want to sound boring, but no one answered to whether we should collect serials. Sony must have some manufacturing documentation where they easily can find out which readers may have the stated problem. I think if we would forward a list of working and non/badly working units, they could easily drill down on that.

SCION · 02-28-2010, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike_73

I don't want to sound boring, but no one answered to whether we should collect serials. Sony must have some manufacturing documentation where they easily can find out which readers may have the stated problem. I think if we would forward a list of working and non/badly working units, they could easily drill down on that.

Perhaps you should start a new thread with the title Collecting Serial Numbers - Screen Washed Out (or something similar to grab new attention to this).

Xochipilli2012 · 02-28-2010, 10:43 AM

Hey Guys...

I just read your three responses and I have follow-ups for each of you.

Igorsk:

Quote:

This has been mentioned several times on these forums. It is caused by a batch of bad screens by LG-Philips.

I missed that thread when I did my initial research into my own problem here, so thanks for mentioning it. In the other thread you suggested removing screws to allow access to the screen to check the manufacturer ID. I haven't read the warranty, but it sounds like something that could void it. I am probably wrong, but if I am I suspect you won't hold back in telling me.

Mike: I wonder how much good that would do? Sony (appears) to be disconnected from its Reader customers. I can't imagine why a website with this information would receive any more attention than the users who have been reporting this problem all along, and being told that this fading is "normal" when there is evidence to the contrary. On a more paranoid note, I'm not sure posting serial numbers publicly is a great idea. I don't know why--it just seems like the information could be put to uses other than intended. I'm probably being paranoid here, but the idea gives me pause.

SCION, you wrote:

Quote:

Perhaps you should start a new thread with the title Collecting Serial Numbers - Screen Washed Out (or something similar to grab new attention to this).

Excellent suggestion. This will at least give Mike's idea more direct attention than being swallowed in this thread.

Now...I'm in a place where I could probably "limp along" with things as they are. My PRS-600 is very usable under most circumstances. On the other hand, it sounds like it is "defective" and I would probably enjoy it more if the problem were rectified. But, Sony is not known for its great customer service, at least not here. And we have no Sony reps (that I know of) to advocate for us the way Astak users do with Robertb (whose presence here, along with a very enthusiastic group of Astak uses in this forum, largely contributed to my decision to purchase a PocketPro as a back-up to my Sony).

I am open to changing my mind about the serial number idea. But if Sony isn't going to do anything about it, it would only serve to provide a little "comfort food" to those having the problem--that is, assuming we can properly decipher meaningful digits in the serials to indicate dates of manufacture or lot numbers. Seems like that might require confirmation from Sony as well.

Cheers!

Mike_73 · 03-01-2010, 01:25 AM

I allready thought about the serial posting stuff and privacy. It was just a thought to maybe contact Sony as a group of users as I think that they don't care much about individuals.

Xochipilli2012 · 03-01-2010, 01:01 PM

As my PRS-600 is still within the 90 days parts & labor warranty, it qualifies for the "Advanced Exchange" program where they send you a replacement (with your credit card # as security) before you send in the defective unit.

Whereas I was told I would get a "new" unit as a replacement, I had already read somewhere that it would, in fact, be a "refurbished" model. This gives me some pause. Maybe it doesn't matter. The main thing is that I should have an opportunity to compare the two units before sending one back. I confirmed this with a Sony rep at Sony's fulfillment center in Laredo on the phone. Hopefully we'll have some sun here once it arrives so I can test the new unit in a timely fashion.

My experience with Sony customer service on the phone was not too bad, although both reps I connected with spoke English as a second language, which probably contributed to the communication challenges. The fact that I know some Spanish eased the mood on the second call, which was quite pleasant under the circumstances.

The two reps seemed to be working with different information as one was unaware that there was an email address for submitting proof of purchase documentation. He initially indicated it had to be faxed, until I challenged him on it as I had already heard otherwise. And as for being told I would be sent a "new" unit--that might just mean that I wouldn't have to wait for the malfunctioning one I currently own to be repaired and sent back to me. But to me, "new" and "refurbished" are different.

There are all sorts of "worst case scenarios" my Monkey Mind can spit out over all of this. I guess I just need to focus on resolving it...one....step...

...at...a....time.

lilac_jive · 03-01-2010, 02:42 PM

I'd just like to repeat that it's not a Sony problem, it's an eink problem. This has been reported on most of the eink devices over a period of several years, with varying degrees of fading.

Xochipilli2012 · 03-02-2010, 02:54 AM

Hey there LJ,

Well...apart from what has been mentioned on MobileRead, there isn't a whole lot about eInk fading out there in Google land. And from the threads I've read here, including a few where you have posted about your 505, some people are much more affected than others.

Perhaps it's the "luck of the draw" that my PRS-600 becomes unusable in bright sunlight (unless I do as you and others have suggested, turn the device away from the sun while turning pages). And honestly, I'm just about ready to do that. But when I hear so many people say "My PRS-600 doesn't have that problem" then I feel there may be some value in pursuing a solution.

The way I've chosen to do this is to work with Sony customer service. Their first recommendation was to reset the device. Including a "hard" reset if necessary. Well, I tried that and it made no difference. What the did not do was tell me that "This is just the nature of E Ink. It fades in bright sunlight." Now, they may know this to be as "true" as you do. But it doesn't seem to be "true enough" to warrant making a disclaimer about the problem. If this was truly "the nature of E Ink" then it would be more universally known--you know, like how difficult it is to use an LCD screen in bright sunlight. No one is surprised by that because it's a well-established fact. But E Ink's ability to be used in direct sunlight is one of its "selling points".

Therefore, it doesn't seem unreasonable to pursue an E Ink screen that works in the sun, as some apparently do.

Now--Sony happens to be the manufacturer of the PRS-600. And they apparently make devices in this line that do not have this problem, or at least not to the degree that I and others have encountered. Therefore, with respect, I suggest that this is, indeed, a "Sony problem." I'm not going to go to LG and demand they fix my screen (assuming they were the supplier for it--I don't actually know in my case.) I'm going to work with Sony.

And so far, they appear amenable to work with me. They will send me a replacement. If it performs well, I will send them my original unit and enjoy a better functioning device. If it does not, I will keep my current unit and send the replacement back--and ponder whether it is worth pursuing any further.

Others may be experiencing similar questions: Should I bother to try replacing this, in the hope of having a better result? or... Should I just make do with what I have? These are fair questions. I can only hope that by being so public about my own process, someone else will have the information they need to make their own decision.

If you are correct that this is just the nature of E Ink...then I think it behooves us all to get the word out so that people's expectations will be better managed. The words "can be used in direct sunlight" should no longer appear in reviews and marketing copy, if this is, indeed, true.

And I gotta say, I'm a little envious of your 505. From what I hear and have seen in pictures, that is a rocking little machine.

Peace.

lilac_jive · 03-02-2010, 07:58 AM

Prem, my point was looking for serial numbers probably won't help much, since it's been happening over a period of time with several devices. If it really bothers you, I would replace it. Mine does it but I work around it easily (not enough to go through the effort of being without my 505 for a period of time). It is a Sony problem in the sense that you will need to get a replacement from them.

It isn't the nature of eink, either. You are supposed to be able to read in direct sunlight.

Xochipilli2012 · 03-02-2010, 11:33 AM

Our new friend and forum co-conspirator lilac_jive wrote:

Quote:

Prem, my point was looking for serial numbers probably won't help much, since it's been happening over a period of time with several devices.

Ah! Thanks for clarifying LJ! I appreciate your experience and input with these matters.

Cheers!

lilac_jive · 03-02-2010, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xochipilli2012

Our new friend and forum co-conspirator lilac_jive wrote:

Ah! Thanks for clarifying LJ! I appreciate your experience and input with these matters.

Cheers!

No problem

Sorry, I was too lazy to find the original comment to quote

emonti8384 · 03-03-2010, 03:22 PM

I called Sony and they said the same thing-try a soft, then hard reset. I qualified for the advanced exchange program so they are sending me another reader. I hope there's some sort of sunshine in the next week or so, that way I can compare the one they are sending me with the one I have.

02-25-2010, 07:19 AM	#32
Mike_73 Guru Posts: 750 Karma: 1323 Join Date: Dec 2009 Device: PRS-505, PRS-600, iPad 16GB Wifi, Kindle Voyage, Nexus 6, Razr HD	I just tried my reader under direct sunlight. As the sun is low (but at least it shines), I did several page turns to really make sure. I got lucky. My reader works the same as inside a building. Sony probably incorporates the manufacturing date within the serial number. Maybe all could compare device serials to see if there is some kind of similarity within the reader numbers having bad screens and the ones that haven't??? What do you all think about that? Edit: I was thinking about this issue on my way home from work. What do you all think if I were to set up a blog, take all the serials and put them there. We could also post all other issues there too. I mean why can the reader look up words only in english. The programming is there and I wouldn't mind paying for an additional dictionary. But if the offer the User interface in different languages I think they should at least support the languages included. It just looks unfinished. Once enough serials would be there, I could point Sony service directly to the blog instead of hoping that they read all the posts here. Last edited by Mike_73; 02-25-2010 at 10:38 AM.

03-01-2010, 01:01 PM	#39
Xochipilli2012 Zealot Posts: 101 Karma: 38 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Device: Red PRS-600, Slate Blue Astak EZReader Pocket Pro	The Plot Thickens As my PRS-600 is still within the 90 days parts & labor warranty, it qualifies for the "Advanced Exchange" program where they send you a replacement (with your credit card # as security) before you send in the defective unit. Whereas I was told I would get a "new" unit as a replacement, I had already read somewhere that it would, in fact, be a "refurbished" model. This gives me some pause. Maybe it doesn't matter. The main thing is that I should have an opportunity to compare the two units before sending one back. I confirmed this with a Sony rep at Sony's fulfillment center in Laredo on the phone. Hopefully we'll have some sun here once it arrives so I can test the new unit in a timely fashion. My experience with Sony customer service on the phone was not too bad, although both reps I connected with spoke English as a second language, which probably contributed to the communication challenges. The fact that I know some Spanish eased the mood on the second call, which was quite pleasant under the circumstances. The two reps seemed to be working with different information as one was unaware that there was an email address for submitting proof of purchase documentation. He initially indicated it had to be faxed, until I challenged him on it as I had already heard otherwise. And as for being told I would be sent a "new" unit--that might just mean that I wouldn't have to wait for the malfunctioning one I currently own to be repaired and sent back to me. But to me, "new" and "refurbished" are different. There are all sorts of "worst case scenarios" my Monkey Mind can spit out over all of this. I guess I just need to focus on resolving it...one....step... ...at...a....time.

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02-23-2010, 04:35 PM	#31
kennyc The Dank Side of the Moon Posts: 35,872 Karma: 118716293 Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Denver, CO Device: Kindle2; Kindle Fire	I would try it anyway. It could be that there is a display initialization routing in the reset startup and it shouldn't hurt anything. I wouldn't expect it to work any more than you though.

02-26-2010, 02:11 PM	#33
Xochipilli2012 Zealot Posts: 101 Karma: 38 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Device: Red PRS-600, Slate Blue Astak EZReader Pocket Pro	I will probably bite the bullet and try a hard reset the next time we get some sun around here (could be weeks! hahaha...). I bought my PRS-600 from New Egg with 1-year replacement protection, so I'm hoping there's no rush to work this out. I really don't find having to shade the screen during page turns in the sun to be terribly inconvenient, so if it turns out that there's no reliable "fix" for this, I won't be too bummed. But if it is a "problem" with the screen, I'm concerned it may indicate a vulnerability for other "fails" down the road. So I'm mildly motivated to address this. I've ordered an EZ Reader Pocket Pro as a "backup" in case I do wind up replacing the Sony. I'll keep y'all apprised of further developments with this. Peace.

02-26-2010, 08:38 PM	#34
igorsk Wizard Posts: 3,442 Karma: 300001 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Belgium Device: PRS-500/505/700, Kindle, Cybook Gen3, Words Gear	This has been mentioned several times on these forums. It is caused by a batch of bad screens by LG-Philips. People who have PVI screens do not suffer from it. As far as I can tell the screen is perfectly normal except that it fades in the direct sunlight, and the effect is completely reversible in the shadow.

02-27-2010, 07:17 AM	#35
Mike_73 Guru Posts: 750 Karma: 1323 Join Date: Dec 2009 Device: PRS-505, PRS-600, iPad 16GB Wifi, Kindle Voyage, Nexus 6, Razr HD	I don't want to sound boring, but no one answered to whether we should collect serials. Sony must have some manufacturing documentation where they easily can find out which readers may have the stated problem. I think if we would forward a list of working and non/badly working units, they could easily drill down on that.

03-01-2010, 01:25 AM	#38
Mike_73 Guru Posts: 750 Karma: 1323 Join Date: Dec 2009 Device: PRS-505, PRS-600, iPad 16GB Wifi, Kindle Voyage, Nexus 6, Razr HD	I allready thought about the serial posting stuff and privacy. It was just a thought to maybe contact Sony as a group of users as I think that they don't care much about individuals.

03-01-2010, 02:42 PM	#40
lilac_jive Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,870 Karma: 27376 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Device: PRS-505	I'd just like to repeat that it's not a Sony problem, it's an eink problem. This has been reported on most of the eink devices over a period of several years, with varying degrees of fading.

03-02-2010, 02:54 AM	#41
Xochipilli2012 Zealot Posts: 101 Karma: 38 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Seattle Device: Red PRS-600, Slate Blue Astak EZReader Pocket Pro	Hey there LJ, Well...apart from what has been mentioned on MobileRead, there isn't a whole lot about eInk fading out there in Google land. And from the threads I've read here, including a few where you have posted about your 505, some people are much more affected than others. Perhaps it's the "luck of the draw" that my PRS-600 becomes unusable in bright sunlight (unless I do as you and others have suggested, turn the device away from the sun while turning pages). And honestly, I'm just about ready to do that. But when I hear so many people say "My PRS-600 doesn't have that problem" then I feel there may be some value in pursuing a solution. The way I've chosen to do this is to work with Sony customer service. Their first recommendation was to reset the device. Including a "hard" reset if necessary. Well, I tried that and it made no difference. What the did not do was tell me that "This is just the nature of E Ink. It fades in bright sunlight." Now, they may know this to be as "true" as you do. But it doesn't seem to be "true enough" to warrant making a disclaimer about the problem. If this was truly "the nature of E Ink" then it would be more universally known--you know, like how difficult it is to use an LCD screen in bright sunlight. No one is surprised by that because it's a well-established fact. But E Ink's ability to be used in direct sunlight is one of its "selling points". Therefore, it doesn't seem unreasonable to pursue an E Ink screen that works in the sun, as some apparently do. Now--Sony happens to be the manufacturer of the PRS-600. And they apparently make devices in this line that do not have this problem, or at least not to the degree that I and others have encountered. Therefore, with respect, I suggest that this is, indeed, a "Sony problem." I'm not going to go to LG and demand they fix my screen (assuming they were the supplier for it--I don't actually know in my case.) I'm going to work with Sony. And so far, they appear amenable to work with me. They will send me a replacement. If it performs well, I will send them my original unit and enjoy a better functioning device. If it does not, I will keep my current unit and send the replacement back--and ponder whether it is worth pursuing any further. Others may be experiencing similar questions: Should I bother to try replacing this, in the hope of having a better result? or... Should I just make do with what I have? These are fair questions. I can only hope that by being so public about my own process, someone else will have the information they need to make their own decision. If you are correct that this is just the nature of E Ink...then I think it behooves us all to get the word out so that people's expectations will be better managed. The words "can be used in direct sunlight" should no longer appear in reviews and marketing copy, if this is, indeed, true. And I gotta say, I'm a little envious of your 505. From what I hear and have seen in pictures, that is a rocking little machine. Peace.

03-02-2010, 07:58 AM	#42
lilac_jive Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,870 Karma: 27376 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pennsylvania Device: PRS-505	Prem, my point was looking for serial numbers probably won't help much, since it's been happening over a period of time with several devices. If it really bothers you, I would replace it. Mine does it but I work around it easily (not enough to go through the effort of being without my 505 for a period of time). It is a Sony problem in the sense that you will need to get a replacement from them. It isn't the nature of eink, either. You are supposed to be able to read in direct sunlight.

03-03-2010, 03:22 PM	#45
emonti8384 browneyedgurl Posts: 523 Karma: 356470 Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Warren, OH Device: PRS-505/950x2, PRS-600 silver, Galaxy III purple, T2 black	I called Sony and they said the same thing-try a soft, then hard reset. I qualified for the advanced exchange program so they are sending me another reader. I hope there's some sort of sunshine in the next week or so, that way I can compare the one they are sending me with the one I have.

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