Open Library -- have they changed borrowing policy?

[Phssthpok]

I wanted to borrow a book I'd borrowed from Open Library a couple of years ago to re-read it, but there no longer seems to be any way to download it -- you just have to read online in a browser. Have they changed their borrowing policy or something?

[jhowell]

These days Open Library is a front end to the lending library of the Internet Archive.

[Quoth]

And the Open Library violates copyright.

[ownedbycats]

Originally Posted by Phssthpok

Have they changed their borrowing policy or something?

A few months ago a few publishers sued Open Library for "copyright violation" (which I disagree with, but that's another subject) and a short time after that happened these changes went into effect.

[Uncle Robin]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

A few months ago a few publishers sued Open Library for "copyright violation" (which I disagree with, but that's another subject) and a short time after that happened these changes went into effect.

I was able to borrow a book from the Open Library over the weekend after noting that the Library Extension on Firefox listed it as available there.

[ownedbycats]

Yes, you can borrow, but if the only option is the shorter loan (1 hour loan i think, a bit useless) you are only able to view it in the browser. I think whether the 14-loan day is available depends on how many copies of the book OL has in circulation.

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

I think whether the 14-loan day is available depends on how many copies of the book OL has in circulation.

The Borrowing From The Lending Library page at the Internet Archive describes the restriction:

What is the loan duration for Internet Archive books?

Patrons now have a choice in selecting the loan period when they borrow a book. Patrons can choose a short-term access for 1 hour, or a longer 14-day loan. If we only have 1 copy of a book, it is only available for 1 hour loan. If we have more than one copy of a book, it can be checked out for either 1 hour or 14 days, depending on availability. If there are no copies available for 14-day loans, users can join a waitlist. There is no waitlist available for books that only offer 1-hour loans.

[ownedbycats]

Yes! I couldn't remember how to find that page.

[Quoth]

The Internet archive and others scan in copyright and current in print books with out buying a licence and then publishes them as PDFs with poor unproofed OCR. They have moved beyond saving websites.

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by jhowell

The Borrowing From The Lending Library page at the Internet Archive describes the restriction:

OK. Seems that many books that were available as 14-day loans are now only available for an hour at a time -- even when multiple copies appear to be available. Pity.

[jhowell]

Originally Posted by Phssthpok

OK. Seems that many books that were available as 14-day loans are now only available for an hour at a time -- even when multiple copies appear to be available. Pity.

I have seen that also. I don't know why. Perhaps copies must be of exactly the same edition in order to qualify.

I do think that lending a digital copy of a scan of a sequestered paper book is a questionable concept.

[ownedbycats]

Originally Posted by jhowell

I do think that lending a digital copy of a scan of a sequestered paper book is a questionable concept.

The issue is that a decent chunk of these books are out-of-print and not available digitally, and authors/publishers have no interest in re-publishing them as an eBook.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

The issue is that a decent chunk of these books are out-of-print and not available digitally, and authors/publishers have no interest in re-publishing them as an eBook.

Which is their right.

The same issue came up with "orphan" books during tbe Google/AG landgrab and the court shut it down. The French tried forced licensing and got serious pushback. Not sure where their opt-out system ended up.

Wanting does not justify taking.
And the essence of copyright is choosing when and how to publish or not publish and how.

Many authors and publisher are terrified of digital because they see piracy under every rock. It took years for Sony and Scholastic to convince Rowling ebooks were actually safe. Many others still refuse.

Places like the Internet Archive's self-licensing "library" only reinforce those (normally unfounded) fears.

They.Are.Not.Helping.

Instead, they are delaying the legal availability.

[ownedbycats]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Many authors and publisher are terrified of digital because they see piracy under every rock. It took years for Sony and Scholastic to convince Rowling ebooks were actually safe. Many others still refuse.

The "lack of interest" I was referring to is apathy rather than fear. If a book didn't sell well, or the author is dead and their family doesn't really care, some of the books simply will not get digitized until they become out of copyright, which runs the (admittedly tiny, but still there) risk of losing the work entirely.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by ownedbycats

The "lack of interest" I was referring to is apathy rather than fear. If a book didn't sell well, or the author is dead and their family doesn't really care, some of the books simply will not get digitized until they become out of copyright, which runs the (admittedly tiny, but still there) risk of losing the work entirely.

Some seem to feel that letting works get lost over time advances the arts, or they are simply indifferent to the primary purpose of copyright in the US.