Suggestion on karma

[desertgrandma]

Originally Posted by desertgrandma

Karma to you!!

[Jcas]

Originally Posted by Nyssa

I'm not sure I understand the problem? For all intents and purposes it is "just" a Thank You" button - Thank you for your help, thank you for the link, thank you for understanding what I'm saying, thank you for the suggestion, thank you for commenting...etc.

What exactly is it that you don't like?

I have never liked Karma, friends bumping friends numbers up, it becomes a popularity contest and makes newbs feel very much on the outer , when i get replies like "because we like it that way" i can see that other peoples opinions are not even in the race which i find rather disappointing.

[Nyssa]

Originally Posted by Jcas

I have never liked Karma, friends bumping friends numbers up, it becomes a popularity contest and makes newbs feel very much on the outer , when i get replies like "because we like it that way" i can see that other peoples opinions are not even in the race which i find rather disappointing.

I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm new here as well, and it's never even really crossed my mind to look at other peoples Karma points. Like I said, to me they are a "Thank You" for whatever reason you feel like giving thanks - I accept them that way as well - it means I helped someone in some way, even if its "just putting" a smile on their face.

[kindlekitten]

Originally Posted by Jcas

I have never liked Karma, friends bumping friends numbers up, it becomes a popularity contest and makes newbs feel very much on the outer , when i get replies like "because we like it that way" i can see that other peoples opinions are not even in the race which i find rather disappointing.

I'm really sorry you feel that way as well. the last person that came in here with a smiley face and relatively no karma left here with over 7000 karma points. I did not go out of my way to get karma, I know I don't deserve most of it, but I do give it where it is due.

[Worldwalker]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

I'm really sorry you feel that way as well. the last person that came in here with a smiley face and relatively no karma left here with over 7000 karma points.

And I think that's a big part of the problem.

Did that person contribute more to MobileRead than a dozen other people? Doubtful. I quit paying much attention to karma a long time ago because I realized that most of the time, it symbolizes either pity (as in that case) or cynical manipulation (in the case of the karmic circle-jerks) and very rarely reflects any actual appreciation of posters for services rendered.

Mind you, I'm not saying I would reject the kind opinions of people who give me karma because of my opinions or their expression. As the system stands now, that's how it works. But when I see sets of people who have been here only a short time, who post mostly or entirely in opinion-type discussions (especially in P&R), and who hold similar views, getting hundreds of thousands of points of karma together, I have to think it's less of a thank-you and more of a "you give me yours and I'll give you mine" repeated ad nauseum. That's not how it's supposed to work.

I don't know if there is a solution. I don't know if there can be a solution. I doubt if it's possible to implement one that doesn't involve enormous amounts of programming. But the system we have, as much fun as it is to watch my karma gain skyrocket when I post a detailed opinion on something, is primarily rewarding the abusers and manipulators, not the people who really should be being highlighted for the good they bring to MobileRead.

Perhaps an interim solution would involve tighter limits on when someone can give karma to someone else (no more than once a week, perhaps?) or on the amount that could be given to any one person per unit time, or something like that. Maybe there should be two types of karma, "opinion" karma and "technical" karma (preferably with much better names), with the former the only option in certain forums, and the mods more willing to switch karma between the two as needed. Most likely there's some much better solution I haven't thought of. But I really do think it's gotten out of hand in all the wrong directions, to the point of being useless for most of the things it's meant for and primarily useful for small groups of friends (or sock puppets?) to boost their apparent standing at the expense of those who really are benefiting the forums.

[sakura-panda]

I don't understand why people get worked up over karma numbers. I'm more interested in the comments that come with the karma (although they don't always come with comments, but even seeing what post prompted the karma is fun.)

I'm embarrassed to admit that I don't even notice what total karma people have until I open up one of these discussions. Even then, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get worked up over.

Would it be feasible to make it a user option whether or not to display karma? On another forum I have the option to turn off sigs, avatars, and images -- but I suppose you would have to turn off that whole block, not just the one line, and that probably wouldn't work for people that are annoyed by karma and also reference the location and post count as much as I do.

[Billi]

Worldwalker, thank you and karma for you!!!

I wouldn’t care too much about karma. If we look at some of the most active and most helpful posters here as crutledge, HarryT, Jellby, mgmueller or wallcraft, to name just a few, it’s clear, that karma is not a just reward for their efforts. Otherwise, making an entertaining or funny or silly remark in the lounge can earn you a lot of karma. But that’s okay, we are in a forum and a forum is about socialising.

But this thread shows that some users are not satisfied with the way karma works now. So perhaps we can propose and discuss some improvements, as Worldwarker already begun. And perhaps the moderators like to think about it, too. I would have these two ideas:

(1) The karma field should show the sum of all karma points (as now) plus the number of rated post.

For instance, in my example this would mean 6056 (9) and would give a far better reflection of my contributions here (I am well aware that nine rated posts “normally” would sum up to something like 200 points and in this case I would have been as surprised and thankful about every single point, too, as I’m now).

(2) Let us pay for karma.

If you give someone let’s say 100 points, your own karma will be reduced by 50 or 100 (or ?) points. This would, to a certain degree, limit the "friend-karma".

[DaleDe]

One way to get Karma back to its origin might be to separate it out. Karma in the lounge would be totaled separately from karma in other groups although a dedicated group of people might circumvent this.

[GraceKrispy]

Whatever happens to Karma is fine with me. Carry on.

[obs20]

I enjoy being appreciated as much as the next person but I don't see why appreciation from one person should count more than appreciation from another. If you want to keep score, fine, count up thank yous. But it doesn't seem fair to have Karma awarded from one member count as much a thank you 20 or more newbies.

[thrawn_aj]

Originally Posted by obs20

I enjoy being appreciated as much as the next person but I don't see why appreciation from one person should count more than appreciation from another. If you want to keep score, fine, count up thank yous. But it doesn't seem fair to have Karma awarded from one member count as much a thank you 20 or more newbies.

A defense against sock-puppet accounts no doubt .
Yes, yes, I know it's truly sad but it's a fact of life on the intertubes .

[Iphinome]

Originally Posted by thrawn_aj

A defense against sock-puppet accounts no doubt .
Yes, yes, I know it's truly sad but it's a fact of life on the intertubes .

And yes a small dedicated group who've been feeding each other karma can also quickly prop up a sock puppet and with karma make it appear legitimate.

[happy_terd]

What is a sock puppet?

I hear that term once in a while. I was a bit scared to ask about it because I didnt want to look uncool in front of the other kids.

What is it?

[Exer]

If people take positive Karma so seriously, can you even imagine what would happen if we had negative Karma? MR might implode.

I played a game once that had a plus/minus "Reputation" system. If you did something nice for someone, they'd give you a "Rep +". If you were an idiot on the other hand, you might get a "Rep -". If you reached a certain amount of negative Rep, your account would suffer repercussions ... such as being "silenced", which was not being able to use public chat.

It worked pretty well, although there were people who tried to game the system of course. I could see why people took it seriously THERE, where there was a discernible effect from getting or losing Rep "aka Karma" ... but here, where it doesn't really make any difference, I don't see why it is such a big deal.

[astra]

Originally Posted by Exer

If people take positive Karma so seriously, can you even imagine what would happen if we had negative Karma? MR might implode.

On a certain fantasy forum, in a lounge I used to express my feelings about political situation in certain topics. As a result I had negative rep. The lowest one in fact.
I warned them 7 years ago, that aliens will bring Europe to her knees in 20-30 years, because Europe is a bloody coward. I think they didn't like it They neg repped me for years after that

Later, when mods made it possible to see who repped you, I realised that some of them were aliens themselves