Is Amazon Blackmailing POD Publishers?

[Halk]

Originally Posted by HarryT

No, you misunderstand me. I mean that Kindle books actually are MobiPocket books - they are books in MobiPocket format, which use MobiPocket DRM. They are encoded for the MobiPocket ID of the Kindle, just as you'd encode books for any other MobiPocket device at any other MobiPocket bookstore.

Yeah. You were right. I actually thought Kindle was a new format which was almost identical to Mobipocket. However the point was as I said, Amazon has decided to make some books only available on Kindle, which could be seen as a sort of vertical monopoly.

[dodgyville]

I know there's a law in Australia against uncompetitive "third-line forcing", where a company refuses to sell you a service or product unless you buy another service or product. I don't think third-line forcing law passes judgement on the business aspects of it, other than that it is clearly uncompetitive.

It sounds to me like this would definitely break that law here.

[Aurora W]

Is it blackmail? For any existing POD publishers on Amazon, it probably is.

Not just the idea of having to use their service (which is simply galling IMHO) - but the expense of having to move existing files from another service to one which you really don't want to use just so you can stay on their service cannot be underestimated. I'm in the middle of helping set up a new database at my current employer - and the cost of having to find, upload and update old information is nothing minor. There's the hours of reloading info, the hoping that said info is even accepted by the new service... I could go on.

Not to mention the fees they are going to charge on top of all this.

Going to make me think twice about where I order my next book online.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by delphidb96

And I DIS-disagree! Look, the Kindle format is closely derived from Mobipocket, so there's no 'super-secret' procedure there. Also, the printer does nothing to ensure that the ebooks are properly formatted. Further, Amazon *has* sold ebooks in the past (other than Kindle) and has not demanded that those ebooks be from titles printed by their BookSurge printers.

And with the eBooks Amazon previously sold, they screwed over a LOT of customers. What's to say they won't do so again?

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

And with the eBooks Amazon previously sold, they screwed over a LOT of customers. What's to say they won't do so again?

Exactly!

[DaleDe]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Originally Posted by delphidb96 View Post
And I DIS-disagree! Look, the Kindle format is closely derived from Mobipocket, so there's no 'super-secret' procedure there. Also, the printer does nothing to ensure that the ebooks are properly formatted. Further, Amazon *has* sold ebooks in the past (other than Kindle) and has not demanded that those ebooks be from titles printed by their BookSurge printers.
And with the eBooks Amazon previously sold, they screwed over a LOT of customers. What's to say they won't do so again?

This is apples and oranges. There is nothing that this Amazon decision has to do with eBooks at all. It is POD, print on demand books, not ebooks. It is bad enough without getting the details totally wrong.

Dale

[IreneDelse]

Amazon: another company who was happy with interoperability as long as they didn't have their own proprietary format. *sigh*

You know, these days, when I'm looking for books online, I'm beginning to favor non-Amazon sellers. Fictionwise for ebooks, Abebooks for used books, Lulu for POD, etc. Recently I happily discovered The Book Depository, a UK based seller of new books at very good prices.

Too much economic weight in a single basket: not a good thing, ultimately.

[zelda_pinwheel]

Originally Posted by IreneDelse

Amazon: another company who was happy with interoperability as long as they didn't have their own proprietary format. *sigh*

You know, these days, when I'm looking for books online, I'm beginning to favor non-Amazon sellers. Fictionwise for ebooks, Abebooks for used books, Lulu for POD, etc. Recently I happily discovered The Book Depository, a UK based seller of new books at very good prices.

Too much economic weight in a single basket: not a good thing, ultimately.

yes, i agree. i get worried when i see someone who wants to make the ultra-mega-giga-of-the-universe *anything*. i use amazon for browsing (i like the "search inside" feature) and for keeping track of things with my wishlist, but i don't buy from them anymore...

[JSWolf]

I don't buy books from Amazon. The problem is that they want me to spend $25 to get free shipping. Otherwise, the price jumps to be too high because of the shipping. I have purchased eBooks from Amazon in the past. But now I can't. So basically, Amazon doesn't really have anything I want at a price I'll pay.

[Taylor514ce]

Warning: The following message contains a Pot, calling Kettles black. Please turn your irony sensors to their lowest settting.

This thread sure went off-topic quickly! The subject isn't ebook publishing, but Print On Demand Publishing. This includes, but isn't limited to, Vanity Publishing. It's also a business model used for keeping technical publications in circulation by printing them in very small runs. What Amazon has done is informed those in the Print On Demand publishing industry that they must use an Amazon-owned printer to print their books if they want to sell their books on Amazon.

My first knee-jerk reaction was "Monopoly! Boycott Amazon!". I'm biased, as I earn my living, in part, in helping POD printers become more efficient through custom ERP and RIP systems...

Points to ponder, though: how is this different from Amazon getting into the ebook business, but only selling ebooks in "their" format, for their device?

What we're seeing is Amazon is not content to be a distributor. They want a piece of the manufacturing process, as well. That leads to some interesting conflict-of-interest scenarios, I think.

But if Amazon wants to say "we'll only sell POD books we manufacture", I suppose they have that right, however short-sighted that decision appears to observers like me.

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by DaleDe

This is apples and oranges. There is nothing that this Amazon decision has to do with eBooks at all. It is POD, print on demand books, not ebooks. It is bad enough without getting the details totally wrong.

Apples and oranges are both fruit. There is valid reason for concern (IMHO) about how Amazon is using its market power and what it may mean for eBooks as well.

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by Taylor514ce

But if Amazon wants to say "we'll only sell POD books we manufacture", I suppose they have that right, however short-sighted that decision appears to observers like me.

Yes, certainly they do.

[Halk]

Originally Posted by DaleDe

This is apples and oranges. There is nothing that this Amazon decision has to do with eBooks at all. It is POD, print on demand books, not ebooks. It is bad enough without getting the details totally wrong.

Dale

If your grocer sells you rotten apples, you're not going to buy oranges from him.

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by bwaldron

Yes, certainly they do.

Not necessarily. It depends on how powerful Amazon is in whatever the defined market is. If Amazon dominates the bookselling market, and if the US Department of Justice and the courts define that as the relevant market, then Amazon may not have that right.

The one thing Amazon's latest step has done is confirm my decision of years ago to buy any place but Amazon. I rarely even search Amazon for anything and haven't bought a book from Amazon in years.

[bwaldron]

Originally Posted by rhadin

Not necessarily. It depends on how powerful Amazon is in whatever the defined market is. If Amazon dominates the bookselling market, and if the US Department of Justice and the courts define that as the relevant market, then Amazon may not have that right.

Sure, but I don't think we're at the monopoly stage ... and I am not one to push for government intervention in markets except where absolutely necessary.