Books you love that fit other's "hard no" criteria - Page 6

leebase · 08-31-2020, 11:35 AM

Oooh....timely topic for me. Asimov has long been my favorite Sci Fi writer...along with Herbert and OSC.

But, I've been rereading the Foundation Series...and I'm wondering why I ever thought they were so good...let alone...a contender for best ever sci fi series.

So, of COURSE, it matters WHEN a book was written. To Kill A Mockingbird would be a huge hit today just like when it was written. I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" would be anything special if released today.

But Classics - here comes personal opinion - are about forming a common societal foundation and language. So while I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" is a particularly well written book, and even it's subject matter has been handled far better by others....it's a classic. Everyone reads it in school...because it's a classic. There is a positive thing to having "some certain body of work" that is identified and acknowledged to be "books everyone should read".

This provides a common language and imagery for a shared society.

And, of course, over time, new books will become "Classics" and be added to the canon of what everyone should read. I don't think Harry Potter ever will meet such a standard. But I do think it will be popular and well love 100 years from now.

Thasaidon · 08-31-2020, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leebase

Oooh....timely topic for me. Asimov has long been my favorite Sci Fi writer...along with Herbert and OSC.

But, I've been rereading the Foundation Series...and I'm wondering why I ever thought they were so good...let alone...a contender for best ever sci fi series.

So, of COURSE, it matters WHEN a book was written. To Kill A Mockingbird would be a huge hit today just like when it was written. I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" would be anything special if released today.

But Classics - here comes personal opinion - are about forming a common societal foundation and language. So while I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" is a particularly well written book, and even it's subject matter has been handled far better by others....it's a classic. Everyone reads it in school...because it's a classic. There is a positive thing to having "some certain body of work" that is identified and acknowledged to be "books everyone should read".

This provides a common language and imagery for a shared society.

I think you have made a very pertinent point. I still like and enjoy the original Foundation Trilogy which was based on some short stories written circa 1941. These were collected into the Trilogy in 1951-1953.
They had a big impact at the time time because there was nothing like them, so they gained a huge reputation. If they had been written today they would probably be seen as fairly standard and run of the mill.

Their original impact is why they became part of "some certain body of work" that is identified and acknowledged to be "books everyone should read" and call classics. This is confirmed by the fact they are still in print and read todsy.

Uncle Robin · 08-31-2020, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leebase

"The Grapes of Wrath"...it's a classic. Everyone reads it in school...because it's a classic.

And that's 0 for 2 - although I was aware of Steinbeck's work, unlike Raisin in the Sun. There really IS no "everyone".

Sirtel · 08-31-2020, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Robin

And that's 0 for 2 - although I was aware of Steinbeck's work, unlike Raisin in the Sun. There really IS no "everyone".

Yeah. Everyone in the US, possibly. Not everyone everywhere. While The Grapes of Wrath was translated into Estonian before I was born and I think I may have read it once, long ago, it certainly is not mandatory reading in any school here.

Paperbackstash · 09-01-2020, 01:56 PM

KJ Charles is great, although I mainly enjoyed her earlier works --- Think of England is one of my top favorites ever, as is the Magpie trilogy, and I loved her series The Society of Gentlemen. Band Sinister was a fun standalone.

I'd have to see more examples of hard no's. I do read m/m romance obviously so that's not one I consider a hard no --- but it's a very popular genre as I see on GR, so I wouldn't put in a "usually no" category anyway. I can certainly see many not interested in that sub-genre, though

leebase · 09-01-2020, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirtel

Yeah. Everyone in the US, possibly. Not everyone everywhere. While The Grapes of Wrath was translated into Estonian before I was born and I think I may have read it once, long ago, it certainly is not mandatory reading in any school here.

Of course. I fall into "United States mindset" too often. Feel free to replace your own culture's "classic" literature.

Freeshadow · 09-05-2020, 01:27 AM

some people might want to burn me at a stake for that, to actually show what often is meant by the term "classic" I'd like to reach out into computer gaming, plainly because the genere and life cycles are shorter and faster and as such easier to observe (petri dish?)

Baldur's Gate RPG
Command & Conquer RTS
Wolfenstein3D FPS

Classic is either 1st or fundamental in building a genre. A new not reinvented "wheel"
many works thereafter are best case expanding the invention and worst case just regurgitating it.

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08-31-2020, 11:35 AM	#76
leebase Karma Kameleon Posts: 2,934 Karma: 26616647 Join Date: Aug 2009 Device: iPad Mini, iPhone X, Kindle Fire Tab HD 8, Walmart Onn	Oooh....timely topic for me. Asimov has long been my favorite Sci Fi writer...along with Herbert and OSC. But, I've been rereading the Foundation Series...and I'm wondering why I ever thought they were so good...let alone...a contender for best ever sci fi series. So, of COURSE, it matters WHEN a book was written. To Kill A Mockingbird would be a huge hit today just like when it was written. I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" would be anything special if released today. But Classics - here comes personal opinion - are about forming a common societal foundation and language. So while I don't think "The Grapes of Wrath" is a particularly well written book, and even it's subject matter has been handled far better by others....it's a classic. Everyone reads it in school...because it's a classic. There is a positive thing to having "some certain body of work" that is identified and acknowledged to be "books everyone should read". This provides a common language and imagery for a shared society. And, of course, over time, new books will become "Classics" and be added to the canon of what everyone should read. I don't think Harry Potter ever will meet such a standard. But I do think it will be popular and well love 100 years from now.

09-01-2020, 01:56 PM	#80
Paperbackstash Wizard Posts: 1,592 Karma: 20086276 Join Date: Aug 2018 Location: Central Florida Device: Oasis 3, PW 3, 4, 5, Fire HD 2012, Fire HD 8 (8th Gen)	KJ Charles is great, although I mainly enjoyed her earlier works --- Think of England is one of my top favorites ever, as is the Magpie trilogy, and I loved her series The Society of Gentlemen. Band Sinister was a fun standalone. I'd have to see more examples of hard no's. I do read m/m romance obviously so that's not one I consider a hard no --- but it's a very popular genre as I see on GR, so I wouldn't put in a "usually no" category anyway. I can certainly see many not interested in that sub-genre, though

09-05-2020, 01:27 AM	#82
Freeshadow temp. out of service Posts: 2,792 Karma: 24285242 Join Date: May 2010 Location: Duisburg (DE) Device: PB 623	some people might want to burn me at a stake for that, to actually show what often is meant by the term "classic" I'd like to reach out into computer gaming, plainly because the genere and life cycles are shorter and faster and as such easier to observe (petri dish?) Baldur's Gate RPG Command & Conquer RTS Wolfenstein3D FPS Classic is either 1st or fundamental in building a genre. A new not reinvented "wheel" many works thereafter are best case expanding the invention and worst case just regurgitating it.