02-27-2010, 03:56 PM | #16 | |||
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Very good summary, and only some additional points.
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- Just a point of clarity between Eneloop/LSD (low self-discharge) and higher capacity non-lsd NiMh. It's not so much that the traditional cell is better suited to devices that require more juice (read: high drain), because the LSD cells, especially Eneloop, can sustain high amperage draws (up to 10A). It's that the higher capacity non-lsd cells are just that, higher capacity. With something like the Maha 2700's, that will translate into more runtime than the Eneloop, all else being equal, and both being hot off the charger. - Alkaline batteries, either primary or rechargeable, have one huge and serious disadvantage for me. They LEAK! I've had new ones leak, not so new that leaked, and old ones that leaked (understandable). Regardless of the age, leaking alkaline and the possibility of it happening just isn't worth it to me. I have some Stabila electronic levels (expensive level with a digital module) that came with some high end Duracell alkaline. Upon receiving the levels, I replaced the alkaline with Eneloop's. |
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02-27-2010, 06:36 PM | #17 |
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I too like enloops the best. I also bought a couple of packs of Ray-O-Vac 1000mha NiMH batteries. i consider them bottom of the barrel, but I get a week+ out of a set. I average reading my JBL about 2 hours a day. I rotate them every weekend regardless. So, while I'll probably only buy enloops in the future, just about any quality battery will do for the JBL.
I did a bunch of research before buying a charger from Thompsons. It seems that slow charging the NiMH batteries significantly increases the number of times that they will recharge compared to fast charge-type chargers. |
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02-28-2010, 02:47 PM | #18 | |
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OK; so do the 2000mAh Enloops last twice as long in the JBL as the Ray-O-Vac 1000mAh? Do you see any real difference/improvements as a result of the "low discharge" feature, with regard to use in the JBL? How has it shown up in use? Is there a noticeable difference between the Enloop and the Ray-O-vac, in this regard? -------------------- I have ordered some batteries and a charger from Thomas Distributing and will be comparing their performance, in the JBL, with the grocery store Energizer rechargeables, over the next few months. Would this charger meet your description of a slow charger? Maha MH-C204W White World Battery Charger The batteries I will be using for this test: ANSMANN 2500 AA LOW DISCHARGE NIMH Luck; Ken Last edited by Ken Maltby; 02-28-2010 at 02:53 PM. |
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02-28-2010, 08:46 PM | #19 |
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This will be interesting. I want to stop using the standard (non-rechargables) akalines.
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02-28-2010, 09:33 PM | #20 | |||
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1. Done on a dumb charger, as in timed, not with smart termination. 2. At a rate no greater than C/10 for 14-16 hours. C being capacity of the cell divided by 10. Take the Eneloop AA 2000 mAh, for example. 2000 mAh divided by 10 gives 200 mA for a slow charge lasting 14-16 hours. The 204 though, is generally regarded as a good choice of charger. Very complete, as in thorough, charge. Quote:
And one more link. Last edited by chainring; 02-28-2010 at 09:37 PM. Reason: Added link |
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03-02-2010, 06:38 PM | #21 |
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Sorry for not responding sooner; haven't been on for a couple of days.
I was wrong about the Ray-O-Vacs; they are 1800mAh AA batteries. It is in such small print that it sure looks like 1000 to my old eyes. I just dug out a magnifying glass to check. Sorry!! I bought a LaCross BC-900 charger about a year ago. It lets you set the charging rate. Default is 200mA charging, but can be bumped up 1800mA. I always use the 200mA setting. Charging a dead set takes a while on this setting. The enloops do last longer. I should actually time how long each lasts. The Ray-O-Vacs go from 4 to 3 marks on the battery indicatory after a couple of hours and the enloops go much longer. At the end of a week my normal reading both still read 3 marks on the indicator, which is "good enough". |
03-03-2010, 07:35 PM | #22 | |
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03-05-2010, 10:38 AM | #23 | ||
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And thanks for the 200 mA advice. I think it's the heat during charging that lessens the number of cycles. Some fast (15- or 30-min.) chargers, like my Duracell Accu 30-min., have a fan right in the charger bay blowing air at the cells to keep the temperatures down. Sometimes worth it for the time savings. |
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03-05-2010, 08:28 PM | #24 |
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OK; the MH-C204W charger came today, so I have the components for the testing.
Don't expect any quick result, the nature of what I am trying to measure makes it a lengthy process. As soon as my current set of Energizers runs out I will start the testing and record keeping. The first run will be of the Ansmann maxE+ 2500mAh, on their factory charge. ( If their claim of "more than 1 year standby" means anything, I guess they really are "Low self discharge".) Luck; Ken |
03-05-2010, 09:54 PM | #25 | |||
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You're correct about the BC-700 not being a known offender. The BC-900 and the BC-9009 are the potential culprits. FWIW, I have a BC-900 as well, and it's been good, but not used much since I received the Maha C-9000's. Quote:
Basic terminology: C = capacity C/10 = capacity divided by 10 0.5C = Say you have an Eneloop AA at 2000 mAh. 0.5C would be 1000 mA. Easy, right? 1.0C is the industry recognized standard fast charge rate. It's how long a fully depleted cell will take to be charged in one hour. Regarding the super fast chargers (15 - 30 min), especially the 15 min versions, those will reduce the total life if used continually. There was an extensive test that concluded with cells put through the abuse of an Energizer 15 min charger would get around 150 cycles vs. more than twice that number at 1C or less rates. Like you said, the 15 min is really good for convenience and the "I need it now" type of situation. |
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03-06-2010, 11:45 AM | #26 | |
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Thanks again. This is terrific info you've given us in this thread. Quite glad that I shouldn't be charging at 200 mA, since using the BC-900's "Refresh" cycle at 200 mA is an overnight experience with the worry of an exploding cell. And really, losing 200 cycles because you fast charge? Is that really such a big deal for the average consumer, who might only go through 50 - 100 cycles/year? That's still 3 - 6 years (instead of 5 - 10). |
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03-06-2010, 05:18 PM | #27 | ||||
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03-08-2010, 07:32 PM | #28 |
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Sanyo today announced their new Eneloop Lite rechargeable NiMH batteries. They can be charged 2,000 times.
They will go on sale in Japan June 22. http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/08/s...re-cheap-less/ |
03-10-2010, 05:47 PM | #29 | |
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2,000 charges! Pass them down several generations. If they power a clock and last 6 months on a charge, that's 1,000 years! |
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03-14-2010, 12:13 AM | #30 |
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OK the Energizers finaly ran out and I installed the Ansmann 2500mAh.
They are showing as 3/4 full on the factory charge, in the JBL. I will go ahead and charge them instead of starting the test on the factory charge as I had planned. Luck; Ken |
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