This is the new Kindle Paperwhite 4

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by stuartjmz

Then I guess it's just me. As posted above, flawless navigation on both devices in both orientations.

Which version of the menu did it use? The menu icon in the top-left corner? Or the separate options under the search bar? In any case, it appears to be affected by the window/screen width. As I stated, when I tried it on my PC at work (Linux with Firefox), at my usual browser window size, it used the second version with the menu below the search bar. As I made the window narrower, it reached a point were it changed. Trying this now at home on my Windows laptop, it works the same with both Firefox and Chrome.

It is obviously dependent on the setup. It might also depend on the browser and OS. I reported what happens with an Android phone, but I don't have an Android device with a large enough screen to see if it how it behaves.

[lkmiller]

Hmmm, no problems for me on my Android phone with Chrome browser in the US. I do have to wait for the entire page to load before I can tap open the menu. But after that, it behaves as expected in both portrait and landscape.

ETA: Just tried on my iPad with Chrome. Works fine in portrait from the upper-left menu icon. In landscape, I get the dropdown menus under the search bar that disappear too quickly to use.

Yet another edit to avoid more OT posts:
Looks like the horizontal menus are expecting a mouse hover to stay open...which, of course, you never have on an iPad and very seldom on Android. Even trying to tap with an Apple pencil doesn't work on iPad. But works with a mouse on my 10" Android tablet.

[stumped]

Originally Posted by davidfor

It is obviously dependent on the setup. It might also depend on the browser and OS. I reported what happens with an Android phone, but I don't have an Android device with a large enough screen to see if it how it behaves.

could be that the problem is limited to larger android tablets then, mine is 10 inch and i use it in landscape.

it is still poor QA though

in particular, the "widescreen version" of the home page, with the horizontal row of menu tabs is using some clever overlay/pop up/floating menu code, too smart for its own good.
I did not bother to test searching for a specific book title or author, it could be that suffers from over clever presentation also.

all I was looking for , on visit 1, was the UK price and availabilty of the Forma, to compare with amazon options ( which is what this thread used to be about ), and also stuff on Kobo's returns and refund options - but failed on both counts

Originally Posted by davidfor

Which version of the menu did it use? The menu icon in the top-left corner? Or the separate options under the search bar? In any case, it appears to be affected by the window/screen width. As I stated, when I tried it on my PC at work (Linux with Firefox), at my usual browser window size, it used the second version with the menu below the search bar.

On my monile devices, the menu icon in the left-hand corner. On my browser (PaleMoon Win10), the same behaviour as you report. separate options under the search bar until I shrink the screen to a certain point, In all cases, no vaigation issues, no problems with options disappearing too quickly to be selected.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by stumped

could be that the problem is limited to larger android tablets then, mine is 10 inch and i use it in landscape.

This. It most likely uses the desktop layout (which assumes mouse support) once you reach a certain viewport size.

[soulfuldog]

Originally Posted by DuckieTigger

PW4 is a Voyage with a smaller profit margin. Hardware wise the missing buttons and light sensor probably save enough money to add waterproofing. Realistically it should be more expensive. Add in the plastic screen substrate, and you have Kobo Forma top end model feature in an entry level lighted reader. That is also an upgrade from the Voyage with glass substrate.

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Are you saying that the PW4 has a plastic display substrate?

Where is that documented? Unless waterproofing added significant weight the PW4 seems a bit heavy for plastic substrate.

Originally Posted by tomsem

The briefing included one-on-one sessions with Amazon reps following the presentation. Perhaps it was something the reporter specifically asked about in his. He seems more knowledgeable than most of the initial reporting (at least knows there is something called ‘Mobius’). Of course he could have misunderstood what the rep told him, or the rep may have misrepresented the facts. At any rate, I would give it the benefit of doubt for now. "

I think people are getting mixed up between the substrate and the screen. Up until the Kobo Forma, all the main ereaders have had a glass substrate that sits behind a plastic screen - except the Voyage, which has a glass screen, which at the time of release was an 'upgrade' & a selling point, it appears to make the text on the Voyage sharper & clearer. Even though the new Paperwhite has a flush screen and looks similar to the Voyage, it might not be quite so good because of this.

The plastic substrate of the Kobo Forma is obviously a selling point, so if the new Paperwhite had the same, why on earth would the only mention of it be in a random news article?

FWIW, the respective pages for the Kobo Forma & Kindle Paperwhite state:

"with a sturdy 8.0” HD Mobius Carta E Ink screen"

"with E Ink Carta, built-in light, 300 ppi"

[rcentros]

Originally Posted by davidfor

Just tried this on my iPad. Very ugly and not what should be expected.

But, I get different behaviour depending on whether I have the iPad in landscape or portrait orientation. In landscape, the menu behaves as you described. In portrait, the menu works completely differently. The menu is in the top left corner. And it works properly. It's probably actually a screen size/resolution thing. ...

I can confirm the same results on my Amazon Fire. Works fine in portrait mode. Since I almost always use the tablet in landscape mode (for browsing) I didn't realize the behavior would be different in portrait. Something to remember.

(Same results in all three browsers on this Fire — Chrome, Silk and Firefox.)

[harriska2]

Originally Posted by stuartjmz

Not all of them, but because the initial complaint mentioned being unable to access the hardware section, I navigated through the menu to apps and devices and then to readers. Both sections worked fine


EDIT: I just tried again. All menu subsections - ebooks, audiobooks, apps and devices, super points. Both devices, 8.4 in and 5.7 in, portrait and landscape. All worked flawlessly in Chrome.

Chrome on my ipad did not work. Even in landscape. I have a 12.9 ipad.

Originally Posted by harriska2

Chrome on my ipad did not work. Even in landscape. I have a 12.9 ipad.

Yep, it seems the problem is that the site assumes anything with a screen size over 10 inches (maybe 9?) as a desktop.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by stuartjmz

Yep, it seems the problem is that the site assumes anything with a screen size over 10 inches (maybe 9?) as a desktop.

Most dynamic layouts work based on the device's reported viewport size/width. My guess, anything that reports width of ~1000px gets the desktop layout.

Note, resolution of iPad 12.9 is 2732*2048 and even in portrait mode, its viewport is 1024*1366.

[harriska2]

Originally Posted by stuartjmz

Yep, it seems the problem is that the site assumes anything with a screen size over 10 inches (maybe 9?) as a desktop.

I always use desktop w/o a problem. Even facebook (don’t use app).

[mkberg]

Me: Can you please tell me if there are plans to release a kindle paper white with a comfort light (Change color temperature) in the works? I noticed the new one does not have it. Why no include it? I will never buy another kindle with out this feature. Please tell someone.
You are now connected to Dalli Ravi Teja from Amazon.com

Dalli Ravi Teja: Hello, my name is Dalli Ravi Teja. I'm here to help you today.
The new one has a color invert option.

Me: so white on black?

Dalli Ravi Teja: Yes.

Me: that info should be on the description page
Thats fine but its still blue light?

Dalli Ravi Teja: It would be available for all the compatible model s once an update is rolled out.

Me: I have a kobo and I use that at night because the blue light from the kindle bothers me

Dalli Ravi Teja: Yes, I understand what you are asking.
You would like a reading mode on the device,
I am updating this to the feedback team. They collate all the feedback that we receive and work on it to develop a feature in the upcoming software update.

Me: Can I ask specifically why Amazon has not released a model with the ability the change the color temperature? It seems absurd to me they haven't done it. Many of the competitor devices have it. The Kindle would be the best in my opinion if it had that feature and relaxed on the kindle only books and those advertisements.

Dalli Ravi Teja: I am from the support team. I do not have that information.
I can remove the ads from your device free of charge.

Me: Im sure they have received tons of requests about the color temperature change feature, because I know I am not the only one. How and who do I contact on the Kindle engineering department directly to get a real answer?
Really? Removing the ads would be awesome. I know I can go to Amazon to buy stuff.

Dalli Ravi Teja: Sure, I can do that for you.

Me: Cool

Dalli Ravi Teja: Shall I go ahead and remove the ads now?

Me: Sure, on the 3G that'd be appreciated.

Dalli Ravi Teja: Okay, just a moment.
This device has successfully unsubscribed from Special Offers.
Please check now.

Me: Also, the inverted colors are good, but suppose Amazon came out with its own gels to change the color temperature? This option would obviously not be ideal, but why release a new kindle without the temp change. I don't get it. Behind the times
I'll check... thank s

Dalli Ravi Teja: Sure, I agree with you.

Me: Thats great to hear

Dalli Ravi Teja: I respect your point of view. But those matters are out of my purview.

Me: Weird marketing in my opinion

Dalli Ravi Teja: I can update this to the concerned team.

Me: Just give the people what they want, make it well from the start and sell it forever
Incrementally releasing 'new' features is ridiculous

Dalli Ravi Teja: As there is no direct chat with the engineering team. We are the support team so we face the customers.

Me: In my opinion

Dalli Ravi Teja: Okay, sure.

Me: The offers are gone, appreciate it

Dalli Ravi Teja: Thank you

Me: Thats all I got at the moment thank you.

[davidfor]

Originally Posted by stuartjmz

On my monile devices, the menu icon in the left-hand corner. On my browser (PaleMoon Win10), the same behaviour as you report. separate options under the search bar until I shrink the screen to a certain point, In all cases, no vaigation issues, no problems with options disappearing too quickly to be selected.

The difference is that on the PC, the menu reacts and expands when you put the cursor over it, but doesn't trigger the link. You can then select the sub-item you want. On a touch-only device, you have to tap the menu item to have it expand the menu. But, tapping the menu item also triggers the link it points to and once that happens, the sub-items cannot tapped.

Overall, not a great design. And it is also something that I can understand being missed during testing. They probably do most of the widescreen version testing on a PC and concentrate on the portrait version on the devices.

Originally Posted by davidfor

The difference is that on the PC, the menu reacts and expands when you put the cursor over it, but doesn't trigger the link. You can then select the sub-item you want. On a touch-only device, you have to tap the menu item to have it expand the menu. But, tapping the menu item also triggers the link it points to and once that happens, the sub-items cannot tapped.

Overall, not a great design. And it is also something that I can understand being missed during testing. They probably do most of the widescreen version testing on a PC and concentrate on the portrait version on the devices.

Yes, it's clear that the reason I couldn't replicate the problem is that my devices are not big enough in terms of screen resolution.

[stumped]

Originally Posted by davidfor

The difference is that on the PC, the menu reacts and expands when you put the cursor over it, but doesn't trigger the link. You can then select the sub-item you want. On a touch-only device, you have to tap the menu item to have it expand the menu. But, tapping the menu item also triggers the link it points to and once that happens, the sub-items cannot tapped.

....

thanks for posting such a clear explanation of what I was trying to describe