Picture of New Bookeen Cybook

[Robert Marquard]

No, Mobipocket uses its own format. It is a layered format, i. e. The outer packaging is Palm .prc format, then each block is compressed and encrypted by a proprietary Mobipocket algorithm (both optional). The content is a HTML file with only minor proprietary additions by Mobipocket.

[delphidb96]

JSWolf,

Quick, tell me how many eInk-based ebook readers out there run under Windows. What's that? I can't quite hear you... That's right, none, zilch, nada, zero. Sure, there are far more PalmOS and WinMobile devices out there than there are Linux handhelds - maybe. But when it comes to eInk, Linux currently reigns supreme.

And supporting BBeB (LRF) is going to be almost as tough as LIT because it also is a proprietary format. I believe, but I don't know for sure, that it doesn't require Windows-specific DLLs, but do you really believe Sony will *want* to license the LRF format to its competitors?

Derek

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Mobipocket and eReader use the same format (if I am not mistaken). And yes we do need LIT format. Might as well go with BBeB (LRF) as well. But with the formats you can support on Linux, there is no need to pick on the formats you cannot. It's not Microsoft's fault you went with a lesser supported OS.

[NatCh]

Originally Posted by delphidb96

And supporting BBeB (LRF) is going to be almost as tough as LIT because it also is a proprietary format. I believe, but I don't know for sure, that it doesn't require Windows-specific DLLs, but do you really believe Sony will *want* to license the LRF format to its competitors?

I'll take a swing at those two, Derek.

I'm pretty sure that LRF support can be done without Windows specific anything since the Reader itself runs a variant of Linux as its OS, so that falls into the category of (I actually get to use this correctly!) Q.E.D.

I do believe (though let me be clear that it's my opinion, and even I recognize that it could be wrong, but don't tell my brothers I said any such thing!) that Sony would love to license the BBeB format to its competitors. I expect that everyone who has come up with a proprietary format has done so with the hope, however secret, that their format might become the 'standard' format. Otherwise, why not just use an existing one?

[HarryT]

The older CyBook (which I have) supported Mobipocket, so it would seem reasonable to hypothesise that this new machine will do so as well.

I wonder if they'll take the same approach as the old CyBook and provide a range of bookreading programs on it so you can choose which one to use? I really liked that approach! Especially because one of them was "uBook", which is my all-time favourite bookreader.

[JSWolf]

The problem though is not what the readers run for their OS, it's what the OS the manufacturers decide to Support. If it wasn't for third party software, there would be no MAC or Linux support at all for your laptop and/or desktop computers. This is a fact. Windows is where you will get support. Name me one reader that has never had Windows support?

[delphidb96]

Natch,

I'm pretty sure that LRF doesn't require Windows either. That wasn't my point. My point was that licensing LRF to other ebook readers *WON'T* sell more Sony ebook readers! After all, Sony isn't in the business of creating and marketing software solutions.

And you're missing my *other* point as well. The LIT format *REQUIRES* that litgen.dll be placed on the device which will be reading the LIT ebook. Guess what? Linux on the eInk devices won't run litgen! Oh sure, the PCs and Macs will be quite useful for downloading LIT ebooks, but the point is to be able to open and *READ* LIT ebooks on an eInk reader. That pretty much means LIT won't be available until someone releases an eInk reader that uses WinMobile or WinXP/Vista as its primary OS.

GAWD! I'd rather be forced to learn cuniform to read my books than have to experience an eInk reader running under WinVista!

Derek

Originally Posted by NatCh

I'll take a swing at those two, Derek.

I'm pretty sure that LRF support can be done without Windows specific anything since the Reader itself runs a variant of Linux as its OS, so that falls into the category of (I actually get to use this correctly!) Q.E.D.

I do believe (though let me be clear that it's my opinion, and even I recognize that it could be wrong, but don't tell my brothers I said any such thing!) that Sony would love to license the BBeB format to its competitors. I expect that everyone who has come up with a proprietary format has done so with the hope, however secret, that their format might become the 'standard' format. Otherwise, why not just use an existing one?

[delphidb96]

JSWolf,

Support? Sure, all the readers can interface with Windows systems. But what's the point of having an eInk reader if you *MUST* be tied into it, either via cable, Bluetooth or WiFi, in order to open and read the LIT ebook? Because you'd have to turn your eInk reader into a wired/wireless 'dumb terminal' in order to do so. Get this straight, *opening* a LIT ebook requires the use of litgen.dll. Litgen won't *run* under Linux.

Sure, we could all learn how to run ConvertLit on our primary systems and then take the resultant output over to our eInk readers but the *VAST MAJORITY* of ebook users aren't going to want to do that.

Derek

Originally Posted by JSWolf

The problem though is not what the readers run for their OS, it's what the OS the manufacturers decide to Support. If it wasn't for third party software, there would be no MAC or Linux support at all for your laptop and/or desktop computers. This is a fact. Windows is where you will get support. Name me one reader that has never had Windows support?

[Robert Marquard]

Huh? litgen.dll is for generating .lit ebooks. msreader.exe is for display of .lit ebooks. Both are Windows only though.
Linux seems to be the OS of the future for reader devices. Mainly because it is customizable for any hardware you cook up. You also find more experts to do the implementation.

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The older CyBook (which I have) supported Mobipocket, so it would seem reasonable to hypothesise that this new machine will do so as well.

I wonder if they'll take the same approach as the old CyBook and provide a range of bookreading programs on it so you can choose which one to use? I really liked that approach! Especially because one of them was "uBook", which is my all-time favourite bookreader.

The old CyBook ran Windows CE (right?), so there were multiple software e-book readers to choose from. For Linux there is really only FBReader, and the only DRMed reader is Sony's software currently tied to their hardware (Mobipocket requires Java to run under Linux). I, too, assume that the new CyBook will support Mobipocket, but I'm not sure how they will do this (add Java, or produce a native Linux reader, or switch to Windows CE). If the new CyBook supported MobiPocket DRM and FBReader it would be a killer device, well worth a small premium in cost over the Sony Reader. If they can get software vendors like uBook to produce Linux versions for the CyBook (and Asus Eee, etcetera) that would be even better.

[Robert Marquard]

Sorry, there is also Plucker. Where is the problem of needing Java for Mobipocket? Mobipocket simply has not yet released a general Linux reader.

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by Robert Marquard

Where is the problem of needing Java for Mobipocket? Mobipocket simply has not yet released a general Linux reader.

The problem is that Java probably won't already be available on a minimal hardware Linux handheld device, so someone has to implement it first. There may be a similar problem for FBReader, which needs GTK+ or QT libraries.

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by Robert Marquard

Sorry, there is also Plucker.

Is anyone using the Linux Plucker Viewer? I had high hopes for this when the Nokia 770 came out, but early versions did not work well and I switched to FBReader (which reads plucker format). Now the Plucker Viewer isn't even listed in the maemo.org applications list.

[NatCh]

Originally Posted by delphidb96

My point was that licensing LRF to other ebook readers *WON'T* sell more Sony ebook readers!

Quite right, it almost certainly wouldn't, but licensing the BBeB (LRF/LRX) format to other e-book vendors most likely would do just that.

Originally Posted by delphidb96

And you're missing my *other* point as well.

<snip>

Linux on the eInk devices won't run litgen!

Oh, I didn't actually miss that point so much as I didn't really feel that I needed to specifically express agreement with it, since it seemed obvious to me that it was true and accurate.

So I decided to move on to the points upon which I felt I had something useful to add.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

The old CyBook ran Windows CE (right?), so there were multiple software e-book readers to choose from. For Linux there is really only FBReader, and the only DRMed reader is Sony's software currently tied to their hardware (Mobipocket requires Java to run under Linux).

That's right - the old CyBook runs CE. CE 3, to be specific.

Is there any specific reason that an eInk device has to run Linux? It's just a display technology - would it not be possible to make a Windows CE machine with an eInk display?

The combination of the old CyBook's software with the battery life of the Sony Reader would make a pretty awesome combination!

[NatCh]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Is there any specific reason that an eInk device has to run Linux? It's just a display technology - would it not be possible to make a Windows CE machine with an eInk display?

I'd assume that it's more a licensing than a technical consideration, but that's more figurin' than knowin'.