Kobo Bug thread - Page 71

John F · 02-03-2019, 05:55 PM

Anyone having problems coming out of sleep mode?

I hit the power button (in sleep mode), and nothing appears to happen. I then hit the power button again, and the device wakes up (shows the page with the light on), but than goes right back to sleep.

It is very intermittent. It happened twice today, but I have also gone several days without it happening.

Glo HD. 4.12.12111. Calibre generated kepubs.

compurandom · 02-04-2019, 07:26 AM

I've noticed in the latest firmware that occasionally there is a very long delay (1-3 seconds?) between when I hit the power button and when something happens. If not patient, and you hit the button more than once, you may end up waking it up and putting it back to sleep immediately (or vice versa). Sometimes the delay is much longer than 3 seconds. This might have something to do with the contents/structure of the current book being read.

Occasionally. I press the power button briefly at exactly the wrong moment, and the device thinks I was holding it down and turns itself off completely.

forster01 · 02-09-2019, 04:48 PM

Product: Kobo Aura 1
Firmware: 4.12.12111
File types:kepub
Sideloaded or from Kobobooks: both
Normal way of embedding fonts into epub doesn't work in kepubs.
For example: embedding font into h1 tag won't be recognised in kepub.
workaround:

Code:

<span class="font"> Text </span>

only workaround will work

petrchutny · 02-16-2019, 04:42 AM

Product: Kobo Clara HD
Firmware: 4.12.12111
Plugins: None
File types: –
Sideloaded or from Kobobooks: Kobobooks
On external SD:
Steps to reproduce:

Try connect to any wi-fi in China, that is behind the great Chinese firewall

Current result: I cannot connect to any Chinese wi-fi that doesn't have a built-in VPN, or that is simply not able to access the "http://www.kobo.com/buildinfo.xml." file to check if connection works. When I connect to wi-fi, it gets stuck for some seconds and then throws an error.
Workaround: Adding this to the KoboReader.conf file:

Code:

[FeatureSettings]
IgnoreCaptivePortal=true

Fixes the problem.

davidfor · 02-16-2019, 05:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrchutny

Product: Kobo Clara HD
Firmware: 4.12.12111
Plugins: None
File types: –
Sideloaded or from Kobobooks: Kobobooks
On external SD:
Steps to reproduce:

Try connect to any wi-fi in China, that is behind the great Chinese firewall

Current result: I cannot connect to any Chinese wi-fi that doesn't have a built-in VPN, or that is simply not able to access the "http://www.kobo.com/buildinfo.xml." file to check if connection works. When I connect to wi-fi, it gets stuck for some seconds and then throws an error.
Workaround: Adding this to the KoboReader.conf file:

Code:

[FeatureSettings]
IgnoreCaptivePortal=true

Fixes the problem.

This isn't a bug in the firmware. It is by design and works as intended. Maybe Kobo is being overly cautious in doing this check, but, the check and turning off WiFi when it fails is not a bug. The workaround has been in the firmware since 4.9.x.

maximus83 · 02-19-2019, 12:07 PM

Ran across a possible bug in how Kobo handles popup footnotes.

Background: there are typically 2 ways of handling in-book footnotes.

Navigate to a separate location. This goes to a separate page at the point of the specific note, but displays all the other notes on the page too. User has to use 'back' navigation to return to position in text.
Display a popup window in the current page. Contains only the content of the specific note, is in context, and does not require back navigation.

Most recent devices including Kindles and Kobos enable (2), and it works fine in most cases. But I've noticed a specific case where the Kobo software fails and falls back to (1). When there's a large set of end notes contained entirely on a separate HTML page, Kobo software tries to display everything from the content of the current note, to the end of the page (all the remaining notes as well). So whenever there's too much content for Kobo to display in a single footnote popup window (typically, when you're early in a chapter that has tons of footnotes :-) ), Kobo will fall back to approach (1). But as you get to the end of the chapter, say the last few footnotes and there isn't much content left on the "notes" page, Kobo will correctly go back to (2). I am not seeing this behavior on other devices on the same ebook content. For example, all the follow apps using the same epub file will handle footnotes just fine using approach (2): Calibre reader, FB Reader, KOReader.

Does this seem like a bug? If so, I have to think it should be straightforward to change that behavior, just display one note at a time versus "everything from that point to the end of the notes page."

ETA: Reported to Kobo. BTW, the email address for bugs/help in the OP of this thread no longer works. I had to navigate to this page to contact help:

https://rakutenkobo.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new

davidfor · 02-19-2019, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximus83

Ran across a possible bug in how Kobo handles popup footnotes.

Background: there are typically 2 ways of handling in-book footnotes.

Navigate to a separate location. This goes to a separate page at the point of the specific note, but displays all the other notes on the page too. User has to use 'back' navigation to return to position in text.
Display a popup window in the current page. Contains only the content of the specific note, is in context, and does not require back navigation.

Most recent devices including Kindles and Kobos enable (2), and it works fine in most cases. But I've noticed a specific case where the Kobo software fails and falls back to (1). When there's a large set of end notes contained entirely on a separate HTML page, Kobo software tries to display everything from the content of the current note, to the end of the page (all the remaining notes as well). So whenever there's too much content for Kobo to display in a single footnote popup window (typically, when you're early in a chapter that has tons of footnotes :-) ), Kobo will fall back to approach (1). But as you get to the end of the chapter, say the last few footnotes and there isn't much content left on the "notes" page, Kobo will correctly go back to (2). I am not seeing this behavior on other devices on the same ebook content. For example, all the follow apps using the same epub file will handle footnotes just fine using approach (2): Calibre reader, FB Reader, KOReader.

Does this seem like a bug? If so, I have to think it should be straightforward to change that behavior, just display one note at a time versus "everything from that point to the end of the notes page."

There is no real support for footnotes in epub2. Any reader that shows footnotes as a popup is using heuristics to guess whether the link is a footnote or a navigation link. The kepub renderer does this, as does the calibre viewer. Both will get it wrong sometimes. And it isn't hard to code the links and destination in such a way that they can't get it right.

epub 3 does have support for footnotes. The kepub renderer does handle these. It should get the popup correct if the code in the book is correct. But, again, it isn't hard to break. I don't think I have seen the footnote code outside test books. Because of this, the kepub renderer will apply the heuristics to the other links as well.

There has been discussion on this before. That included working out what some of the rules used for deciding if the link is a footnote.

For the last comment, when you do navigate to the full footnote from the popup, I don't think displaying the full page is a bad way to handle it. It does depend on how the footnote is coded. If it is in a separate file, it will be displayed by itself. But, that can cause other issues. There has been a lot of discussion on how to handle footnotes and endnotes in the Workshop forum. I don't remember that any of the alternatives were any better.

maximus83 · 02-19-2019, 07:35 PM

Book is epub 3, and the Kobo supports epub 3, and renders some of the footnotes as popups as indicated. And it works in most other books, except those where there's a very large set of foot/end notes to render all at one time. So I think epub version is not the issue here, everything is 3, every apps works (except Kobo, which only works part of the time).

This *may* be by-design behavior as you suggest rather than a bug. However other apps are rendering the specific note, including KOReader, Calibre's built-in reader, FBReader, Moon+, and even Amazon Kindle does similar for their KFX book. So I'd expect it's programmatically do-able, and at least there's some perception that some users would want that behavior. IMHO, it would make sense to enable this behavior to be configurable in device configuration or in user settings. I submitted a detailed bug/feature request to Kobo, will see how they respond.

davidfor · 02-19-2019, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximus83

Book is epub 3, and the Kobo supports epub 3, and renders some of the footnotes as popups as indicated. And it works in most other books, except those where there's a very large set of foot/end notes to render all at one time. So I think epub version is not the issue here, everything is 3, every apps works (except Kobo, which only works part of the time).

Just because it is an epub3 doesn't mean it has the footnote references coded properly. And from what you say, I would bet it doesn't. By that, I mean I bet it doesn't use the epub3 specific attributes to the tags to indicate the it a footnote reference and destination. It would be interesting to see how it is done.

Quote:

This *may* be by-design behavior as you suggest rather than a bug. However other apps are rendering the specific note, including KOReader, Calibre's built-in reader, FBReader, Moon+, and even Amazon Kindle does similar for their KFX book. So I'd expect it's programmatically do-able, and at least there's some perception that some users would want that behavior. IMHO, it would make sense to enable this behavior to be configurable in device configuration or in user settings. I submitted a detailed bug/feature request to Kobo, will see how they respond.

It's hard to know if it a bug or by design. Unless the footnote is using the epub3 coding, all of those are using some heuristic for deciding on whether it is a link or a footnote. And they are probably all using different rules. I know I have broken the calibre viewers method in the past with something the kepub renderer was OK with. Without seeing the code in the book and knowing what the rules are, it's hard to know. Reporting it as a bug is the best thing to do. They might come back with a "working as design", they might find a bug in the rules, or they might add a new rule to cover this.

DNSB · 02-20-2019, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maximus83

Book is epub 3, and the Kobo supports epub 3, and renders some of the footnotes as popups as indicated. And it works in most other books, except those where there's a very large set of foot/end notes to render all at one time. So I think epub version is not the issue here, everything is 3, every apps works (except Kobo, which only works part of the time).

Unless the person who created the book made correct use of the epub3 footnote structure, it is indeed going to be hit and miss. I have looked at ~50 "epub3" ebooks that have footnotes. I don't need to use more than a hand's worth of fingers to count the number where I saw the correct syntax for an epub3 footnote being used never mind being used correctly.

Open the epub in Sigil or calibre's editor and look for code similar to:

Code:

<a href="#footnote1" epub:type="noteref" >1</a>

and

Code:

<aside id="footnote1" epub:type="footnote" >
Footnote text
</aside>

and in the header for the epub file look for the <html> tag where you should see xmlns:epub="http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops"

Code:

<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xmlns:epub="http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops" >

You may want to check such site as the Daisy kb for items like Notes for more information including adding a return link.

And please note that nothing in the epub3 specs requires footnotes to be popups. I have looked through those specs several times and it appears that how to display footnotes is left as an exercise to the programmers of the rendering engine.

JSWolf · 02-20-2019, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNSB

Unless the person who created the book made correct use of the epub3 footnote structure, it is indeed going to be hit and miss. I have looked at ~50 "epub3" ebooks that have footnotes. I don't need to use more than a hand's worth of fingers to count the number where I saw the correct syntax for an epub3 footnote being used never mind being used correctly.

Open the epub in Sigil or calibre's editor and look for code similar to:

Code:

<a href="#footnote1" epub:type="noteref" >1</a>

and

Code:

<aside id="footnote1" epub:type="footnote" >
Footnote text
</aside>

and in the header for the epub file look for the <html> tag where you should see xmlns:epub="http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops"

Code:

<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xmlns:epub="http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops" >

You may want to check such site as the Daisy kb for items like Notes for more information including adding a return link.

And please note that nothing in the epub3 specs requires footnotes to be popups. I have looked through those specs several times and it appears that how to display footnotes is left as an exercise to the programmers of the rendering engine.

What is the correct way to do footnotes that works in epub 2 & as a popup in epub 3 on a Kobo? <aside> is not ePub 2 compatible and will not work if used in an ePub 2 viewer.

maximus83 · 02-20-2019, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DNSB

And please note that nothing in the epub3 specs requires footnotes to be popups. I have looked through those specs several times and it appears that how to display footnotes is left as an exercise to the programmers of the rendering engine.

Completely agree with you and David on these points:
(1) Almost nobody is coding popup footnotes to the Epub 3 spec in ebook source files (similar to the early days with HTML 'wild west' coding). For example, it's rare to see use of the epub:type attribute, the specified values of that attribute for note type content, and use of the <aside> tag.
(2) It is pretty much up to reader app developers to interpret how to render footnotes, endnotes, and other adjunct content. The processing requirements in the above spec doc are so wide-open, it seems like the sky's the limit. :-)

So I agree with all that, but whether ebooks are being coded to the spec is not my point in this particular thread. My focus here is really the desired user experience with footnotes. As I listed above, there some leading epub readers/apps that appear to use logic to infer the intent of a link, and render notes successfully as a popup (regardless whether the book's source code for linking is fully Epub 3 compliant). All of the apps I listed, they seem to be able to display the specific footnote content you clicked about 90% of the time, and when they fail for whatever reason (for instance, as with the Kobo example I gave), they fall back to navigating to where the note content is. Even Kobo handles this ok most of the time, but it especially chokes on books with a lot of end notes, and the others don't.

The 3 nicest implementations I've seen yet from a strictly user point of view are FB reader, Kindle, and KOReader. Also Calibre reader handles it well. KOReader just nails it, they render a single footnote quickly and smoothly, without excess page flashing and without needing multiple reloads (Kobo struggles badly with excess reloads, even when it successfully loads the popup). I have to wonder if maybe KOReader devs used a script to pre-load the related note content for each rendered page and dynamically render it when clicked. Kindle appears similar, with just a slightly longer delay and it appears to me, an extra page load. FB Reader has a beautiful implementation UI-wise. It's quick, attractive, and non-intrusive on the reading experience. It even allows you to customize in user settings some of the details about how the footnote is handled, styling, etc.

So I guess my takeaway point is I hope we can convince Kobo to improve the note handling (in my subjective opinion of what is the 'desirable behavior') similar to the other apps listed. I think a lot of readers would find that note-handling behavior desirable; the fact that the other readers are doing it is one evidence for that.

DNSB · 02-20-2019, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

What i the correct way to do footnotes that works in epub 2 & as a popup in epub 3 on a Kobo? <aside> is not ePub 2 compatible and will not work if used in an ePub 2 viewer.

There is no single solution that will work for all. The closest I came in one book was to put every bleeping footnote on it's own page with the forward and and return hrefs. This was a pain and was only done as a favour to the author whose original links were to a single footnote block and no return links.

davidfor · 02-20-2019, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

What i the correct way to do footnotes that works in epub 2 & as a popup in epub 3 on a Kobo? <aside> is not ePub 2 compatible and will not work if used in an ePub 2 viewer.

The official statement is https://github.com/kobolabs/epub-spe...kobo-platforms. From some testing I did a while ago, there is more to it than that. I don't remember exactly what, but, I think it was to do with exactly what tag the destination id was on and the coding of the back-link. I don't remember if I posted this or not, but, there has been some discussion on it.

maximus83 · 02-21-2019, 04:15 AM

Did a little more testing this evening, here's the results. From the book I mentioned (converted from AZW3 source to Epub3 in Calibre), here are examples of how the many thousands of endnotes are linked throughout the book. Nothing extraordinary in the HTML, but no epub:type attribute, and no <aside> element. You can see that readers handle this case (a large endnotes page) in various ways: some display the specific endnote, others just take you to the page. It would be awesome to make this user-configurable, as FB Reader and KOReader do.

An in-page, superscript link to an endnote:

EPUB version:
<a class="note_link" id="Ants757-1" href="part0029_split_000.html#Ants757-1a">1</a>

AZW3 version:
<a class="note_link" id="Ants757-1" href="part0029.html#Ants757-1a">1</a>

The endnote being linked to (this is contained on a full HTML page with end notes):

EPUB version:
<a class="line_link" id="Ants757-1a" href="part0028_split_003.html#Ants757-1">    1</a>    Adam name evocative of the biblical first man

AZW3 version:
<a class="line_link" id="Ants757-1a" href="part0028.html#Ants757-1">    1</a>    Adam name evocative of the biblical first man

Here's how each reader device handles this specific end note:

Kindle Oasis: popup window
Kindle (web): navigates to the notes page
Kindle (android): navigates to the notes page
Google books (android): popup window
Google books (web): navigates to notes page
FB Reader: popup window
Moon+: popup window
KOReader: popup window
Calibre: popup window
Kobo Forma: navigates to notes page

*Note: as mentioned earlier, only with the Kobo: if you go to a later note in the Act/Scene of this play, which would be near the end of the end notes HTML page, then the Kobo will display it as a popup. For example, I click note "109" in the same Act, and it displays as a popup along with the contents of notes 110, 111, 112, and 113.

02-16-2019, 04:42 AM	#1054
petrchutny Junior Member Posts: 2 Karma: 10 Join Date: Feb 2019 Device: Kobo Clara HD	Product: Kobo Clara HD Firmware: 4.12.12111 Plugins: None File types: – Sideloaded or from Kobobooks: Kobobooks On external SD: Steps to reproduce: Try connect to any wi-fi in China, that is behind the great Chinese firewall Current result: I cannot connect to any Chinese wi-fi that doesn't have a built-in VPN, or that is simply not able to access the "http://www.kobo.com/buildinfo.xml." file to check if connection works. When I connect to wi-fi, it gets stuck for some seconds and then throws an error. Workaround: Adding this to the KoboReader.conf file: Code: [FeatureSettings] IgnoreCaptivePortal=true Fixes the problem.

02-19-2019, 12:07 PM	#1056
maximus83 Nameless Being	Bug in Kobo popup footnotes Ran across a possible bug in how Kobo handles popup footnotes. Background: there are typically 2 ways of handling in-book footnotes. Navigate to a separate location. This goes to a separate page at the point of the specific note, but displays all the other notes on the page too. User has to use 'back' navigation to return to position in text. Display a popup window in the current page. Contains only the content of the specific note, is in context, and does not require back navigation. Most recent devices including Kindles and Kobos enable (2), and it works fine in most cases. But I've noticed a specific case where the Kobo software fails and falls back to (1). When there's a large set of end notes contained entirely on a separate HTML page, Kobo software tries to display everything from the content of the current note, to the end of the page (all the remaining notes as well). So whenever there's too much content for Kobo to display in a single footnote popup window (typically, when you're early in a chapter that has tons of footnotes :-) ), Kobo will fall back to approach (1). But as you get to the end of the chapter, say the last few footnotes and there isn't much content left on the "notes" page, Kobo will correctly go back to (2). I am not seeing this behavior on other devices on the same ebook content. For example, all the follow apps using the same epub file will handle footnotes just fine using approach (2): Calibre reader, FB Reader, KOReader. Does this seem like a bug? If so, I have to think it should be straightforward to change that behavior, just display one note at a time versus "everything from that point to the end of the notes page." ETA: Reported to Kobo. BTW, the email address for bugs/help in the OP of this thread no longer works. I had to navigate to this page to contact help: https://rakutenkobo.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new Last edited by maximus83; 02-19-2019 at 12:56 PM.

02-19-2019, 07:35 PM	#1058
maximus83 Nameless Being	Book is epub 3, and the Kobo supports epub 3, and renders some of the footnotes as popups as indicated. And it works in most other books, except those where there's a very large set of foot/end notes to render all at one time. So I think epub version is not the issue here, everything is 3, every apps works (except Kobo, which only works part of the time). This may be by-design behavior as you suggest rather than a bug. However other apps are rendering the specific note, including KOReader, Calibre's built-in reader, FBReader, Moon+, and even Amazon Kindle does similar for their KFX book. So I'd expect it's programmatically do-able, and at least there's some perception that some users would want that behavior. IMHO, it would make sense to enable this behavior to be configurable in device configuration or in user settings. I submitted a detailed bug/feature request to Kobo, will see how they respond. Last edited by maximus83; 02-19-2019 at 07:40 PM.

02-21-2019, 04:15 AM	#1065
maximus83 Nameless Being	Did a little more testing this evening, here's the results. From the book I mentioned (converted from AZW3 source to Epub3 in Calibre), here are examples of how the many thousands of endnotes are linked throughout the book. Nothing extraordinary in the HTML, but no epub:type attribute, and no <aside> element. You can see that readers handle this case (a large endnotes page) in various ways: some display the specific endnote, others just take you to the page. It would be awesome to make this user-configurable, as FB Reader and KOReader do. An in-page, superscript link to an endnote: EPUB version: <a class="note_link" id="Ants757-1" href="part0029_split_000.html#Ants757-1a"><sup class="frac">1</sup></a> AZW3 version: <a class="note_link" id="Ants757-1" href="part0029.html#Ants757-1a"><sup class="frac">1</sup></a> The endnote being linked to (this is contained on a full HTML page with end notes): EPUB version: <p class="note"><a class="line_link" id="Ants757-1a" href="part0028_split_003.html#Ants757-1">    1</a> <span class="text">   Adam</span> name evocative of the biblical first man</p> AZW3 version: <p class="note"><a class="line_link" id="Ants757-1a" href="part0028.html#Ants757-1">    1</a> <span class="text">   Adam</span> name evocative of the biblical first man</p> Here's how each reader device handles this specific end note: Kindle Oasis: popup window Kindle (web): navigates to the notes page Kindle (android): navigates to the notes page Google books (android): popup window Google books (web): navigates to notes page FB Reader: popup window Moon+: popup window KOReader: popup window Calibre: popup window Kobo Forma: navigates to notes page *Note: as mentioned earlier, only with the Kobo: if you go to a later note in the Act/Scene of this play, which would be near the end of the end notes HTML page, then the Kobo will display it as a popup. For example, I click note "109" in the same Act, and it displays as a popup along with the contents of notes 110, 111, 112, and 113.

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02-03-2019, 05:55 PM	#1051
John F Grand Sorcerer Posts: 7,172 Karma: 63764653 Join Date: Feb 2009 Device: Kobo Glo HD	Anyone having problems coming out of sleep mode? I hit the power button (in sleep mode), and nothing appears to happen. I then hit the power button again, and the device wakes up (shows the page with the light on), but than goes right back to sleep. It is very intermittent. It happened twice today, but I have also gone several days without it happening. Glo HD. 4.12.12111. Calibre generated kepubs.

02-04-2019, 07:26 AM	#1052
compurandom Guru Posts: 919 Karma: 417282 Join Date: Jun 2015 Device: kobo aura h2o, kobo forma	I've noticed in the latest firmware that occasionally there is a very long delay (1-3 seconds?) between when I hit the power button and when something happens. If not patient, and you hit the button more than once, you may end up waking it up and putting it back to sleep immediately (or vice versa). Sometimes the delay is much longer than 3 seconds. This might have something to do with the contents/structure of the current book being read. Occasionally. I press the power button briefly at exactly the wrong moment, and the device thinks I was holding it down and turns itself off completely.

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