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Old 03-10-2021, 07:58 AM   #1
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Exclamation Turn one page, Pages in chapter increases by 1, Pages in book increases by 2

Hi there, I got my Kobo Forma for over two years and I'm quite happy with it.

But there is one problem, I don't know when I noticed this but it was a long time ago that when I turn one page, the number in the header of the screen which is the Pages in chapter increases by 1 which is normal, but the problem is, the number in the footer of the screen which is the Pages in book increases by 2 (sometimes 1, sometimes 3, but most of the time just 2), it doesn't happen in just specific books, but basically every book I read.

So how can I make the number in the footer of the screen which is the Pages in the book increase by 1 like the numbers in the header when I turn one page?

Sorry about that I didn't mention all my ebooks are kepub.epub.

Last edited by codychan; 03-12-2021 at 05:07 AM.
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Old 03-10-2021, 11:32 AM   #2
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What format? AFAIK this is normal with ePubs.
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Old 03-10-2021, 12:21 PM   #3
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What format? AFAIK this is normal with ePubs.
All my ebooks are kepub.epub.
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Old 03-10-2021, 12:32 PM   #4
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The page count by chapter is an exact calculation of how many screens you have to 'turn' for that chapter. The page count by book is an estimation. (though in my experience, a reasonably accurate one,, most page turns for me come out to 1 page,)

This is necessary, otherwise, the kobo would have to render the entire book every time any of the formatting options are changed to re-calculate pages. (And with no limit on the size of books, that could quickly become a *very* demanding task.)
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Old 03-10-2021, 12:45 PM   #5
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The page count by chapter is an exact calculation of how many screens you have to 'turn' for that chapter. The page count by book is an estimation. (though in my experience, a reasonably accurate one,, most page turns for me come out to 1 page,)

This is necessary, otherwise, the kobo would have to render the entire book every time any of the formatting options are changed to re-calculate pages. (And with no limit on the size of books, that could quickly become a *very* demanding task.)
So, you mean this is normal, and there is nothing we can do about it?
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Old 03-10-2021, 01:01 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by codychan View Post
Hi there, I got my Kobo Forma for over two years and I'm quite happy with it.

But there is one problem, I don't know when I noticed this but it was a long time ago that when I turn one page, the number in the header of the screen which is the Pages in chapter increases 1 which is normal, but the problem is, the number in the footer of the screen which is the Pages in book increases 2 (sometimes 1, sometimes 3, but most of the time just 2), it doesn't happen in just specific books, but basically every book I read.

So how can I make the number in the footer of the screen which is the Pages in the book increases 1 like the numbers in the header when I turn one page?
The numbers in the header do not always change by 1. Sometimes they don't change and sometimes they change by 2. When reading ePub, the header/footer use ADE page numbers. ADE page numbers are 1024 compress bytes = 1 page. So you can get no page number change or a multiple page number change.
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Old 03-10-2021, 01:24 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
The numbers in the header do not always change by 1. Sometimes they don't change and sometimes they change by 2. When reading ePub, the header/footer use ADE page numbers. ADE page numbers are 1024 compress bytes = 1 page. So you can get no page number change or a multiple page number change.
Yeah, I heard that people are confused about how the page number is calculated, but don't know it affects the page turns too. Since the Page in chapter increases by 1 (from my personal experience, it always increases by 1), I thought this should work for the Pages in book too.

If there is no solution or this is what it is, maybe I would just change it to "Percent of book read" or "Time remaining in book" since it is quite annoying.

Last edited by codychan; 03-10-2021 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 03-10-2021, 02:32 PM   #8
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So how can I make the number in the footer of the screen which is the Pages in the book increase by 1 like the numbers in the header when I turn one page?
The 'whole book page count' has been a problem for kepubs for quite a long time. There was detailed discussion about it elsewhere on MR a few months ago. I remember participating.

As for correcting the problem ... enough users reporting it directly to Kobo is probably the only option likely to have any effect.
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Old 03-10-2021, 06:28 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by JSWolf View Post
The numbers in the header do not always change by 1. Sometimes they don't change and sometimes they change by 2. When reading ePub, the header/footer use ADE page numbers. ADE page numbers are 1024 compress bytes = 1 page. So you can get no page number change or a multiple page number change.
Jon: Please read the thread. @codychan stated they are using kepubs. Hence a completely different page numbering system with different idiosyncrasies.
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Old 03-10-2021, 06:54 PM   #10
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Yeah, I heard that people are confused about how the page number is calculated, but don't know it affects the page turns too. Since the Page in chapter increases by 1 (from my personal experience, it always increases by 1), I thought this should work for the Pages in book too.
As sort of mentioned there are several page counting methods used depending on the format. PDF is simple as it will be a page per screen. For CBR/CBZ, each image will be separate on a screen.

Epubs use the method that @JSWolf mention. That means that the number of screens per page depend on the font size and other settings. The larger the font, the more screens it will be before the page number changes. And a really small font can mean more than one page per screen. This method also doesn't take into account formatting or images. This is used for both the per-chapter numbering and the full-book numbering. The two numbers should be in sync.

Kepubs use a method that is supposed to be one page per screen. With this, the number of pages changes depending on font size and the other settings. It also means that images are included and the formatting affects the numbering. It seems that the per-chapter numbering is always correct, but, there are problems with the full-book numbering. Most reports are of a page being duplicated. I don't remember reports of them being skipped like you are saying. For this, I am sure that the text formatting and things like images affects the numbering. But, I haven't worked out how. I'm fairly sure that the more complicated it is, the more it is out. And it is probably affected by how long each chapter is. The longer the chapter, the more likely there is a problem. For simple layout in novels, I see a duplicated page number every eight or so pages.
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If there is no solution or this is what it is, maybe I would just change it to "Percent of book read" or "Time remaining in book" since it is quite annoying.
Just go with what works best for you. I tend to like the page numbers, but, I do use the percentage at the bottom sometimes.

Edit:

And if you do want to discuss the pros and cons of the different page numbering methods, I would suggest doing a search first and seeing what always happens. If you start a new thread, I won't be participating, but I will be watching with , lots of and frequent and . Though, starting a betting pool on how long it takes for certain people and opinions to pop up might be fun.

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Old 03-11-2021, 03:28 PM   #11
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Yeah, I heard that people are confused about how the page number is calculated, but don't know it affects the page turns too. Since the Page in chapter increases by 1 (from my personal experience, it always increases by 1), I thought this should work for the Pages in book too.

If there is no solution or this is what it is, maybe I would just change it to "Percent of book read" or "Time remaining in book" since it is quite annoying.
Time remaining does not work properly. It goes by one page = 1 minute no matter how fast you read. It does work that way for ePub. I'm not sure f that is the way it works for KePub. I hope someone who knows will say.

KePub's page numbers are supposed to be 1 screen = 1 page but that doesn't work properly and we don't know what really is going on. With ePub page numbers, we do know what's going on.

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Old 03-11-2021, 03:31 PM   #12
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Jon: Please read the thread. @codychan stated they are using kepubs. Hence a completely different page numbering system with different idiosyncrasies.
I read the first post and then replied to that. The information about the format should have been in the first post. So I didn't see where he said KePub when I replied.
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Old 03-11-2021, 06:33 PM   #13
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Time remaining does not work properly. It goes by one page = 1 minute no matter how fast you read. It does work that way for ePub. I'm not sure f that is the way it works for KePub. I hope someone who knows will say.
Interesting, this is the first time I can remember hearing a claim that Kobo uses one page per minute as the reading rate. And it isn't the case here. It might be the starting point, but, it does change as I read. And I have seen rates much faster, and much slower. The much higher usually happen when I read a purchased kepub on more than one device. Especially if I read mostly on one and open it on another and just read a page. That can give a ridiculously low time-to-finish. But, overall, my impression is that it is close. Not to the second accurate, but, a good estimate for how I am read.
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KePub's page numbers are supposed to be 1 screen = 1 page but that doesn't work properly and we don't know what really is going on. With ePub page numbers, we do know what's going on.
You know that every time you say something like that, I get close to . And that's because I do know what is going on and that means I know how bad the RMSDK page counting algorithm actually is. Yes, it is consistent across devices/apps for exactly the same book, but, that is about all.

Edit: Bugger, I've broken the rule: "Never get into a discussion about how to calculate pages." Vizzini would be most upset with me.

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Old 03-14-2021, 06:42 PM   #14
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Interesting, this is the first time I can remember hearing a claim that Kobo uses one page per minute as the reading rate. And it isn't the case here. It might be the starting point, but, it does change as I read. And I have seen rates much faster, and much slower. The much higher usually happen when I read a purchased kepub on more than one device. Especially if I read mostly on one and open it on another and just read a page. That can give a ridiculously low time-to-finish. But, overall, my impression is that it is close. Not to the second accurate, but, a good estimate for how I am read.
I have 26 ePub pages left. I turned on time left for the eBook and it shows I have 26 minutes left. As I turn the pages, the time changes (in minutes) to match the page numbers. Doesn't matter if I flip the pages fast or go really slow.
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Old 03-14-2021, 08:12 PM   #15
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I have 26 ePub pages left. I turned on time left for the eBook and it shows I have 26 minutes left. As I turn the pages, the time changes (in minutes) to match the page numbers. Doesn't matter if I flip the pages fast or go really slow.
As I said, I do not remember seeing that claim before. And I find that strange. If it so inaccurate and doesn't adjust to the reading speed of the user, then I would have expected it to be discussed. The time left has been discussed and commented on about accuracy. Having it for epubs is relatively new, so most of the discussion has been for kepubs. But, if the epub time left uses such a simplistic I would have expected it to be noticed. I'll have to turn it on the next time I am reading an epub and see what happens.
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