Microsoft is taking back ebooks

[Fiat_Lux]

Originally Posted by ekbell

Or if you're me, you resort to an internet search using your vague memories of content to find the relevant metadata and then Calibre to find where you've stored that book.

First translation of the Gospel of Judas into English. Thin paperback with a pink cover. I don't remember the correct title, author, publisher, or year of publication.
Pink covers were pirated copies. More copies of that book were pirated, than the publisher ever dreamed would be distributed, much less printed by them.

Searching on the Internet, how long will it take you to find the correct bibliographic data for that book?

[BilboBaggins]

Originally Posted by rcentros

Yep. Isn't DRM wonderful? About a year ago I think someone mentioned that Microsoft was selling eBooks, so I looked into it. I think the reason I didn't pursue it any further (besides the fact I'm not a big Microsoft fan) is that reading the options were pretty limited, especially for a Linux user.

Yes, DRM is wonderful if you are an author, a librarian and an editor. I mean, if you want to protect your work, you have to use DRM for it.

But DRM is not so wonderful in this kind of cases. I understand that you are very disapponted and me too I would feel this way if (crossing my fingers) in the future Kobo or Amazon would stop their digital bookstores: which future my ebooks would have ?
Kobo's mission is selling ereaders (and so ebooks), but beeing now part of Rakuten, if Rakuten decides to "kiil" Kobo what will be happening ?
Amazon's mission is ecommercing anything, today also ebooks, and tomorrow ?

Would DRM have to be unlocked in the future from where we bought our ebooks ?

[Josieb1]

My introduction into ebooks/e-readers was via fan fiction. Since I was responsible for getting said fiction onto a word document and on my e-reader I became used to the responsibility of looking after my ebooks. That never changed when I got my first kindle and started to buy ebooks from Amazon. I have never bought an ebook I couldn’t liberate and back up. I’ve bought from over 20 organisations/publishers who have closed down, some quite suddenly leaving no time for retrieval. I haven’t lost a book yet.

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by BilboBaggins

Yes, DRM is wonderful if you are an author, a librarian and an editor. I mean, if you want to protect your work, you have to use DRM for it.

But DRM is not so wonderful in this kind of cases.

That was sarcasm. @rcentros doesn't like DRM either.

[ekbell]

Originally Posted by Fiat_Lux

First translation of the Gospel of Judas into English. Thin paperback with a pink cover. I don't remember the correct title, author, publisher, or year of publication.
Pink covers were pirated copies. More copies of that book were pirated, than the publisher ever dreamed would be distributed, much less printed by them.

Searching on the Internet, how long will it take you to find the correct bibliographic data for that book?

Given that I don't care about specific edition data?

The length of time it took to copy paste "Gospel of Judas" into a search engine and click the wiki page.

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by Sarmat89

Cory Doctorow is a clown. If you want to have a personal book, buy it in a store in paper. The cheap licenses to read the text of a book on your computing devices do not entitle you for a life-long ownership.

And if you don't have room to store all your paper books? That was one of the reasons I swapped to eReading.

And, as others have pointed out, eBooks are (often) not cheap!

The moral of this story is not that DRMed eBooks are "cheap", it is that they are inferior, and in fact damaged goods -- 'broken by design'.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

And if you don't have room to store all your paper books? That was one of the reasons I swapped to eReading.

And, as others have pointed out, eBooks are (often) not cheap!

The moral of this story is not that eBooks are "cheap", it is that they are inferior, and in fact damaged goods -- 'broken by design'.

I got lost in your statement somewhere. If ebooks are inferior, broken by design damaged goods, why switch from paper books?

I will say, given patience, ebooks are cheaper than paper books. It is common to find ebooks priced at $2.99 or less. Granted, The Once And Future King may not be $2.99 'on demand', but if you watch for a sale, it will be. At least, that's been my experience.

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I got lost in your statement somewhere. If ebooks are inferior, broken by design damaged goods, why switch from paper books?

Sorry, I forgot to include the "DRMed" qualifier to "eBooks" in my final sentence (now corrected).

I will say, given patience, ebooks are cheaper than paper books. It is common to find ebooks priced at $2.99 or less. Granted, The Once And Future King may not be $2.99 'on demand', but if you watch for a sale, it will be. At least, that's been my experience.

Yes, but the amount of waiting and searching involved would probably be considered prohibitive by most people, particularly if the books involved are part of an ongoing series (meaning you'd want to read them in order and before sufficient time has passed that you start to forget elements of the previous book).

Also I'd suggest that "common to find eBooks priced at $2.99 or less" does not necessarily equate to there being a good probability that a specific book will eventually become available in that price range.

I would also note that paper books in this price range are even more common -- they're called "second hand books".

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Yes, but the amount of waiting and searching involved would probably be considered prohibitive by most people, particularly if the books involved are part of an ongoing series (meaning you'd want to read them in order and before sufficient time has passed that you start to forget elements of the previous book).

The latest book in a series may not be on sale, but I'd say that the amount of ebooks that cost more than their paper counterparts is very small.

Can you give me three examples of a current (less than three months old) book that is part of a series and sells in e-version for more than it sells in paper format?

(I tend to avoid series, so hey, maybe I'm off base. But I haven't seen that.)

Also I'd suggest that "common to find eBooks priced at $2.99 or less" does not necessarily equate to there being a good probability that a specific book will eventually become available in that price range.

I suppose so. But I will say that my experience has been that on the whole, ebooks have been a LOT cheaper than when I was buying paper books.

There are things that I miss about paper books. But being able to carry more books on a thumb drive than I could have reasonably fit in my house is a real benefit.

[Hrafn]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

Can you give me three examples of a current (less than three months old) book that is part of a series and sells in e-version for more than it sells in paper format?

Three months is a very narrow window -- many ongoing series would have their last book published longer ago than that. Of the four books from my Fantastic Fiction "New books by your authors/'Kindle'" which also turn out to be from this time window (for some reason the 'All formats' option also included many more, but also much older books), one had a Kindle price above its Print price: example

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Hrafn

Three months is a very narrow window -- many ongoing series would have their last book published longer ago than that. Of the four books from my Fantastic Fiction "New books by your authors/'Kindle'" which also turn out to be from this time window (for some reason the 'All formats' option also included many more, but also much older books), one had a Kindle price above its Print price: example

I don't follow series. I was thinking of books that had recently been published in hardback when I gave a three month window.

That particular example looks like it's a victim of agency pricing. The ebook and the paperback are priced the same, $7.99. Amazon can offer a discount on the paperback, but they aren't allowed to offer discounts on ebooks. That's why the ebook price has the little 'Price set by seller' comment.

I'm more familiar with examples like Elevation by Stephen King. Hardback (with discount) is $13.96. The ebook is $9.99. The Reckoning by John Grisham is $15.69 in hardback and $9.99 in ebook. The Three Body Problem by Cixin Liu is $13.66 in paperback and $9.99 as an ebook and was on sale yesterday for $2.99.

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

I don't follow series. I was thinking of books that had recently been published in hardback when I gave a three month window.

That particular example looks like it's a victim of agency pricing. The ebook and the paperback are priced the same, $7.99. Amazon can offer a discount on the paperback, but they aren't allowed to offer discounts on ebooks. That's why the ebook price has the little 'Price set by seller' comment.

I'm more familiar with examples like Elevation by Stephen King. Hardback (with discount) is $13.96. The ebook is $9.99. The Reckoning by John Grisham is $15.69 in hardback and $9.99 in ebook. The Three Body Problem by Cixin Liu is $13.66 in paperback and $9.99 as an ebook and was on sale yesterday for $2.99.

And then there are all the various editions in different countries. A book might be on sale in the US, but not elsewhere. I've rarely seen sales with the European editions, but then they often seem to be cheaper than the US editions in general.

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by Sirtel

And then there are all the various editions in different countries. A book might be on sale in the US, but not elsewhere. I've rarely seen sales with the European editions, but then they often seem to be cheaper than the US editions in general.

Yeah, I've noticed that a number of the Penguin Classics that typically sell for $9.99 in the US are 2 or 3 pounds at Amazon UK.

I'd be happier with less sales and overall lower prices, but then I don't run a publishing house.

[leebase]

Originally Posted by haertig

There are many good reasons for "buying a lifetime supply" of various items while you can. eBooks are one (assuming DRM removal). Ammunition is another. Incandescent light bulbs for your Easy Bake Oven. Probably lots of other examples too, but my brain is blank at the moment.

A counter lesson -- don't buy ebooks ahead of being able to read them. I know this still leaves re-readers in a lurch.

For myself, the number of books I reread is small. I've stopped preOrdering books. I've found that I'm paying "new release prices" when I might not get around to reading the book until the price has come down.

eBooks never go out of stock. eBooks never sell out their initial run. Instead, I put a reminder that a book I want to read goes on sales. On the day....I ask myself "am I ready to read that book now?"

Still...it's yet another example of why DRM removal is a must. And I admit that I haven't really done much of that for my own purchases. I was burned with Fictionwise when they closed down.

I may be burned quite a bit if Amazon ever gets out of the ebook business

[Sirtel]

Originally Posted by leebase

eBooks never go out of stock.

Yes they do, if the publisher goes out of business or the author decides to pull their books. It's happened to me many times. True, it happens mostly with small publishers and selfpubs, not the big five. But it happens.