iOS now subscription model?

[stumped]

Originally Posted by Stevex

I don‘t want any functionality except what I already had *and paid for*. It was fine how it was.
I‘m going to have to delete this program.

I am an android user myself, so no expert on how apple store works... but if its similar to google play store, you should be able to keep this (mostly bug fixed? ) version, with the unlimited skips, and block any updates. thus keeping what you paid for.

it was always my expectation ( maybe naive) that there would be a free "bugs fixed" release for people who had already bought it outright, then an enhanced subscription only version to follow, for anyone willing to pay.

( unless they can disable the unlimited skips , server side , and ride out any complaint to apple over breach of T&Cs )

its usually the case that when a company switches from selling a lifetime license to annual renewals only , that those fortunate enough to have bought the lifetime deal still get it. e.g. Malwarebytes is working like that for me, so is Mailbird ( I think they no longer sell lifetime )
Companies who try to renege ( e.g. roboform tried it ~v7) get crucified by user feedback and social media

[Deskisamess]

I am an android user myself, so no expert on how apple store works... but if its similar to google play store, you should be able to keep this (mostly bug fixed? ) version, with the unlimited skips, and block any updates. thus keeping what you paid for.

For iOS devices, you just need to make sure you don't have auto-updates enabled. I updated to this version, since we will be able to skip subscribing. I won't update any more though.

[pazos]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

I beta tested the program before they submitted it to Apple a week ago. The major issues have been fixed. There are one or two issues that I spotted, specifically with the sort by date, but didn't run into any problems other than that. I'm sure that it will take a few releases to fix all the issues, that's generally the way these things work.

I see that the new version fixed *some* of the issues introduced in 2.0, but they introduced zero inprovements over the 2017 1.x version. In fact the 1.x version works better (albeit network sync is a tad slower).

For a paid subscription I would expect:

- integration with Files API (iOS 11+)
- integration with new features of calibre content server
- a minimal reader based on readium/foliokit
- translated app in my language
- proper technical support here.

I'm sure they will deliver /s

[DanieleS]

@PMRev

I currently use an iPhone and and iPad with CC - i am not going to have to pay 2 subscriptions am I?

DS

[Stevex]

Originally Posted by pazos

I see that the new version fixed *some* of the issues introduced in 2.0, but they introduced zero inprovements over the 2017 1.x version. In fact the 1.x version works better (albeit network sync is a tad slower).

For a paid subscription I would expect:

- integration with Files API (iOS 11+)
- integration with new features of calibre content server
- a minimal reader based on readium/foliokit
- translated app in my language
- proper technical support here.

I'm sure they will deliver /s

Exactly. I was on 1.x before and it worked just fine. Why was I ever so stupid to update to this rubbish? Can‘t you just leave 1.x (which I paid for) how it was and make this into a new app for whoever wants it???

[Mims]

First impression of new update - not for me. I only downloaded 50 books to see how it looks and works- not wasting time again only to find that it’s not what I need.

Wireless connection quick - transfer quick.
Sorting seemed ok

What bothered me was the layout on my iPad. I liked my shelves and grid view in v1. I could see a whole page of books. When I am looking for a book I don’t want to scroll down one or two per screen. One of the reasons I like my iPad is that I don’t need to use my glasses to read anything but with the fonts used in list view my eyes screamed NO.

Another thing that bothers me is the connect button and settings icon always present at the bottom of the home page taking up space and too easy for me to
accidentally touch. To be fair, I will take another look later and try again to find settings that might let me deal with these issues. I will also see if it will work for me on my phone.

Update: On my iPhone 8 I have the same issue with the fonts. Also tried to connect wirelessly x3 with no success until I typed in IP address and port. Will probably keep on one of my phones - the other one (my go to phone that I grab when running out the door from floods, fires or hurricanes) still has old CC and it still works. This looks like a phone app not an iPad app.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by pazos

I see that the new version fixed *some* of the issues introduced in 2.0, but they introduced zero inprovements over the 2017 1.x version. In fact the 1.x version works better (albeit network sync is a tad slower).

For a paid subscription I would expect:

- integration with Files API (iOS 11+)
- integration with new features of calibre content server
- a minimal reader based on readium/foliokit
- translated app in my language
- proper technical support here.

I'm sure they will deliver /s

One of my favorite saying when problem solving and developing is "We don't have to solve world hunger", meaning, just focus on one thing at a time and no, it isn't rubbish because every little thing isn't solved at this very second.

A number of years ago, I was on a project that had lots of production issues. It was one of those "gold team" projects where the "gold team" cranks out a program in record time, appears to meet the deadlines, gets an award, tosses the software over the wall to someone else and says "see ya!" while moving on to the next project.

Another programmer and I took over the code, and went on a bug hunt. It took a year and we ended up rewriting large sections of it, but we eventually got from the point of daily production problems to months without issues. We did some enhancements along the way, but mostly it was stuff the customer never saw. Yea, it really does take that long some times.

I'm quite happy with a working program, and hopefully they finish stomping bugs before moving on to enhancements and wish lists. Keep in mind that the iOS version had basically been untouched since a few months after it was ported from the Android version. One thing at a time and a series of small releases that fix bugs is likely the best way to have a nice, stable program. Then add features.

Yea, I would love to have an integrated reader app that kept percentage read, last read and finished stats updated automatically. Way back when, before the big Mac OS change that broke the Marvin plug in, Marvin would sync up with Calibre and do all that. On the other hand, we have seen that what people want in a reader app tends to be very individual and a number of readers can be quite passionate, one might even say obsessive about what makes a good reader app. In addition, writing a good reading app is a pretty big undertaking by itself. As long as CC can hand off the book to the reader app of my choice, I'm good with that.

[stumped]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

... As long as CC can hand off the book to the reader app of my choice, I'm good with that.

yep, the developers have no track record of successfully coding a reader, (or any other IOS app)- even if they could herd enough cats/obsessive users into agreeing a spec for one

so unless there is one up for sale at a bargain price - like CC was? it would be utter folly, IMHO

the sane strategy is to address what they see as gaps in the end-to-end get-book-to-reader chain, not to re-invent the wheel one more time

also, isn't there a rather slick IOS only thing called Marvin, already - just need to hook into it ?

the obvious feedback question for them to ask is "what IOS reader apps and cloud storage would you like to see improved integration with"... maybe that's the added value that a subscription model needs

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by stumped

yep, the developers have no track record of successfully coding a reader, (or any other IOS app)- even if they could herd enough cats/obsessive users into agreeing a spec for one

so unless there is one up for sale at a bargain price - like CC was? it would be utter folly, IMHO

the sane strategy is to address what they see as gaps in the end-to-end get-book-to-reader chain, not to re-invent the wheel one more time

also, isn't there a rather slick IOS only thing called Marvin, already - just need to hook into it ?

the obvious feedback question for them to ask is "what IOS reader apps and cloud storage would you like to see improved integration with"... maybe that's the added value that a subscription model needs

Just to be clear, when it comes to software, I very much prefer the subscription model to be "with subscription, you get upgrades" rather than "when your subscription stops, the program no longer works". Eventually most software reaches the point you don't really want/need new features.

I agree, CC should focus on filling their niche. I'm pretty sure that they have a lot of little improvements they can make. Of course, given that Marvin seems to no longer be under active development, perhaps the developer would be willing to sell them the code, much like the developers of CC did. It seems to me that a family of programs that work together in some way would make a lot of sense, if that particular market niche is robust enough to support a development company. Maybe expand out into audiobook catalog as well.

[samcohen]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

Just to be clear, when it comes to software, I very much prefer the subscription model to be "with subscription, you get upgrades" rather than "when your subscription stops, the program no longer works". Eventually most software reaches the point you don't really want/need new features.

I agree, CC should focus on filling their niche. I'm pretty sure that they have a lot of little improvements they can make. Of course, given that Marvin seems to no longer be under active development, perhaps the developer would be willing to sell them the code, much like the developers of CC did. It seems to me that a family of programs that work together in some way would make a lot of sense, if that particular market niche is robust enough to support a development company. Maybe expand out into audiobook catalog as well.

I just messaged Marvin to see if they would be interested in selling. Great idea!

[ChaosForged]

Originally Posted by samcohen

I just messaged Marvin to see if they would be interested in selling. Great idea!

A few business suggestions if this ends up going through (or if you acquire additional apps):

• Release an initial version that is identical to the stable product except for contact info
• Branch the future version to Marvin 4 so that you can transition to a subscription without violating Apple’s terms of service
• Recruit beta users to get broader community testing through Testflight; it may be possible to incentivize this with some sort of promotional subscription rate

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by samcohen

I just messaged Marvin to see if they would be interested in selling. Great idea!

I hope you've learned from how badly the initial Calibre Companion release was handled.

I absolutely love Marvin and while I do hope for continued development (for bug fixes and support for devices with new resolutions), I'd rather keep using the old version as-is than have it degenerate into the same state as CC.

Originally Posted by ChaosForged

A few business suggestions if this ends up going through (or if you acquire additional apps):

• Release an initial version that is identical to the stable product except for contact info
• Branch the future version to Marvin 4 so that you can transition to a subscription without violating Apple’s terms of service
• Recruit beta users to get broader community testing through Testflight; it may be possible to incentivize this with some sort of promotional subscription rate

• I'd rather the old releases be left alone as they are bugs and all (including the paid Marvin Classic and iPad-only versions). If the apps are resubmitted, it may not be possible to keep them entirely identical depending on current App Store submission policies.
• YES!!!!!!!!!! (with extra emphasis). Consider how Infuse is doing it. I actually pay for both in-app Infuse Pro lifetime sub on the main Infuse app as well as the standalone major release Infuse Pro apps for Family Share purposes. Mind, I actually paid for both Marvin 3 (as in-app upgrade) and the paid Marvin sxs app.
• Yes, I agree.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by ilovejedd

I hope you've learned from how badly the initial Calibre Companion release was handled.

I absolutely love Marvin and while I do hope for continued development (for bug fixes and support for devices with new resolutions), I'd rather keep using the old version as-is than have it degenerate into the same state as CC.

• I'd rather the old releases be left alone as they are bugs and all (including the paid Marvin Classic and iPad-only versions). If the apps are resubmitted, it may not be possible to keep them entirely identical depending on current App Store submission policies.
• YES!!!!!!!!!! (with extra emphasis). Consider how Infuse is doing it. I actually pay for both in-app Infuse Pro lifetime sub on the main Infuse app as well as the standalone major release Infuse Pro apps for Family Share purposes. Mind, I actually paid for both Marvin 3 (as in-app upgrade) and the paid Marvin sxs app.
• Yes, I agree.

While as a consumer, I like buy once, use forever, that's not a model that is viable from a developer point of view. Thus all the abandonware one sees in the Apple app store.

[stumped]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

While as a consumer, I like buy once, use forever, that's not a model that is viable from a developer point of view. Thus all the abandonware one sees in the Apple app store.

thing is, that's how all books work, e & p, pay once, use forever, so its sort of expected that book handler apps should be the same.
e reader apps are all either free, or pay once... Moon, Aldiko ... and Calibre itself, as we know, is 100% free and will almost certainly remain so

also, a simple librarian app should not need constant enhancements & updates, code it once, get it right, leave it be....

we are probably both repeating ourselves but i don't thing the subscription model is going to be viable either, and that its' only a matter of time before a "good enough" open source , freeware solution appears

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by stumped

thing is, that's how all books work, e & p, pay once, use forever, so its sort of expected that book handler apps should be the same.
e reader apps are all either free, or pay once... Moon, Aldiko ... and Calibre itself, as we know, is 100% free and will almost certainly remain so

also, a simple librarian app should not need constant enhancements & updates, code it once, get it right, leave it be....

we are probably both repeating ourselves but i don't thing the subscription model is going to be viable either, and that its' only a matter of time before a "good enough" open source , freeware solution appears

I'm not sure that it follows that since books work that way, apps should work the same way. We don't expect authors to constantly revise the book, then give us a free copy of the revised book.

In the development community, there are a lot of open source/freeware solutions. The problem is that a lot of it fairly quickly becomes abandonware after a couple of years. Perhaps not a problem if the underlying operating system doesn't ever change, but that's not really the case. For example, Marvin appears to be abandonware at this point. It hasn't had any updates in two years and the developer hasn't posted for even longer than that. Eventually, there will be an iOS update that breaks it, much like there was a MacOS update that broke the Marvin plugin long ago. That's just the nature of modern operating systems. I have one mac mini that I keep at Sierra just because there are a few programs that I use that stopped working when High Sierra came out.

I don't know that one can point to Calibre as an example. I've been using Calibre since it was libprs500, way back when Govid first wrote it, and I've sent a fair amount of money his way via paypal donations, but it's pretty unique, plus I seem to recall him having deals with some companies. You have to have a pretty big base of users for that sort of thing to work, at least from the stand point of working well enough to support the developer.