04-04-2009, 02:52 PM | #61 | ||
zeldinha zippy zeldissima
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04-04-2009, 02:53 PM | #62 | |
Shade
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We could just as well get slavery back and be done with it... Think of it like this(and here I'm going on the assumption of NOT committing the act): You are ACCUSED of stealing apples from a merchant. The merchant says: I SUSPECT you stole something from me so to pay me back you will work for me for the next year without pay. end of story this is what the law proposes. Now consider this in a proper legal state: You are ACCUSED of stealing apples from a merchant. The merchant says: I SUSPECT you stole something from me but I can't prove it I will report you to the police Police conduct an investigation and find out you did not commit this and in the process they find that someone else MIGHT have done it. That someone else is brought in and the police question him then based on the information bring in the attorney and he does the paper work an the ASSUMPTION that the person did it. The person is brought infront of a JUDGE and hears all sides of the story. He then decides based on the information presented if the person is GUILTY or NOT. And even on that decision both parties may appeal. See where this is heading? a) two step process vs b) multi step process... |
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04-04-2009, 02:57 PM | #63 | |
Wizard
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If IP address is such a perfect proof of who you are why are there so many internet related frauds, scams, stolen (and abused) credit card numbers? As a network specialist I tell you, the IP address proves ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. You can use it as a starting point for further investigation, but not as an iron-clad proof! Disconnecting somebody is too serious thing to base on such flimsy "evidence". A log file from a computer can only be considered as a proof only when you adhere to a very rigorous procedures, and very special technical means to make sure that the evidence was not tampered with. Implementing even simple time stamp that is 100% reliable across all ISPs and "evidence" collecting "autorities" is complicated and expensive. Very expensive. And I doubt that MAFIAA will invest that kind of money when they have been collecting "evidence" with complete disregard to such things for courts. I can produce hundreds of log files with YOUR IP address using plain text editor, I can produce very interesting screen shots showing YOUR IP address using a most primitive bitmap editor. And the best thing is, even if they catch me cheating, they can not do anything to me, because this is no court. |
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04-04-2009, 03:00 PM | #64 | |
WWHALD
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OK, so I'm not exactly enthralled with how copyright and IP(*) stand right now, but if we're assuming a world in which your law could work, then the issues around copyright etc could also be resolved. (* Intellectual Property - clarification for geeks like me who automatically translate Ip as Internet Protocol ) |
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04-04-2009, 03:01 PM | #65 |
Wizard
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What happens with downloads through wi-fi hotspots in cafes, libraries etc that the public uses?
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04-04-2009, 03:03 PM | #66 |
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I followed that (I'm french) and the worsts point of that law are:
- Forcing ISPs to install black boxes between the user and the net to help pinpoint illegal activities. - Private companies (copyright owners like Sony or Universal) are given the right to access those black boxes logs to find offenders. - As "it would no be feasible to go to trial for those kind of cases", the offending user can't be explained what is the offending file. Those private companies (copyright owners like Sony or Universal) doesn't have to disclose that to anyone. (Including government) One implication is that there is no recouse possible. (As there is nothing to judge) - As it may not be possible for citizen to know how to secure their computer, they will be given the option to install a self-updating commercial "security software" that will monitor computer usage to try to block delinquent acts. My understanding of computer networking is that: - Those "black boxes" can (will) intercept any non encypted flow. - Any recent filesharing protocol use or can use an encrypted protocol. (It's not that complicated) - All there left is mail, IM, and internet surf. - A work group will define how search engines and portals will have to alter their indexes to "get legal sites up" and "dig illegal content down" Fun fact of that sad story: Head of ministry of culture claimed that the governement uses OpenOffice as its content filtering proxy and security firewall. (twice) |
04-04-2009, 03:05 PM | #67 | |
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They actually tried to force open hotspot owners to use a whitelist of a thousand sites that are "of utmost importance of this nation culture". |
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04-04-2009, 03:05 PM | #68 | ||
zeldinha zippy zeldissima
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04-04-2009, 03:05 PM | #69 | |
WWHALD
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And then there's things like IP address and MAC address spoofing... |
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04-04-2009, 03:08 PM | #70 |
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Certainly, but the ISP has a record of what IP address was allocated to what user at a particular time, so the combination of IP address and a "timestamp" provides a unique identification of the user.
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04-04-2009, 03:09 PM | #71 |
zeldinha zippy zeldissima
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04-04-2009, 03:13 PM | #72 |
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Depends where you're doing your detection, doesn't it? I was under the impression that the law is going to require monitoring by the ISPs themselves. If they are monitoring the traffic within their own systems, is spoofing an issue? They know which user an IP packet is being delivered to, don't they? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that spoofing only affected logging at the "transmission" end of the connection as to which IP address it "thinks" it's talking to.
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04-04-2009, 03:19 PM | #73 | |
WWHALD
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04-04-2009, 03:20 PM | #74 | |
Wizard
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The point of MAFIAA taking somebody to court is in USA to bankrupt him financially through attorney fees. They need to bully another tens of thousands people to "settle" (**) out of court. (**) understand pay racketeering $5000. |
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04-04-2009, 03:22 PM | #75 |
Wizard
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Looks like France is going to become a nation of hackers, as people acquire the skills they need to defend themselves from potentially false accusations.
I'm surprised their government think that's a good idea. |
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