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Old 10-09-2012, 11:40 AM   #16
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If you do not like M92 buy something else. You have a wide choice: Pocket Book 912 and Kindle DX. ;-)

I know from my personal experience that Onyx (via Booxstor) listens to customers and things are being fixed and improved. Everyone would desire that the changes are implemented faster, but further sw development might become very tricky at some point of sw 'age'... At that point, it is the best to throw most of sw away and start from the scratch.
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Old 10-19-2012, 09:22 PM   #17
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Hi Naravive- I too live in the states and have been right on the edge of buying a M 92 from Booxtor. But do I understand you right..that you can not annotate or highlight on doc files? That is a bummer. I pray they fix this. Why not include .pages (mac) as well? That is what I use. I'm tired of converting to .doc. The new pdf reader will be nice- but need to annotate my notes as well.
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Old 10-21-2012, 05:20 PM   #18
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I am not sure they will fix it. There is nothing to fix. :-)

Doc and txt do not allow scribles and text does not allow highlight. To be stored in the file. Anyway even doc is not probably always diplayed correctly for more complex files. Even Word from Microsoft has/used to have problems to do so...

Txt and doc funkcionality is suplementar (for case one ocasionaly needs it) and not intended for serious utilization.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:53 PM   #19
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Hi Mono,

You seem to speak on behalf of all of us with a lot confidence! As a matter of fact, you're completely wrong: txt and doc functionality is of *basic* importance and not supplementary, for me, and for celtic girl and for probably many others-- as an editor and academic, I receive and have to annotate several hundred pages of doc files each month for my work, and I'd like to do that on an e-ink screen because the lcd hurts my eyes and printing is expensive.

Moreover, .doc and .txt is advertised as one of the main advantages of the m92, that it can handle those files, and the advertisement has raised my expectations and that of others. If boox thinks doc and txt capability is irrelevant, or somehow less important, then it should not claim to be able to handle those files properly.

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Originally Posted by Mono View Post
I am not sure they will fix it. There is nothing to fix. :-)

Doc and txt do not allow scribles and text does not allow highlight. To be stored in the file. Anyway even doc is not probably always diplayed correctly for more complex files. Even Word from Microsoft has/used to have problems to do so...

Txt and doc funkcionality is suplementar (for case one ocasionaly needs it) and not intended for serious utilization.
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Old 10-22-2012, 12:56 PM   #20
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Hi celtic girl,

I understand from Booxtor (via PM) that proper doc handling is next on the agenda, after the new pdf reader has been perfected-- which should be any day now? As for .pages, that I'm not sure about, as this is not one of the files that M92 literature claims to be able to handle. Perhaps Booxtor can weigh in on this.


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Originally Posted by celticgirl View Post
Hi Naravive- I too live in the states and have been right on the edge of buying a M 92 from Booxtor. But do I understand you right..that you can not annotate or highlight on doc files? That is a bummer. I pray they fix this. Why not include .pages (mac) as well? That is what I use. I'm tired of converting to .doc. The new pdf reader will be nice- but need to annotate my notes as well.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:30 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naravive View Post
Hi Mono,
You seem to speak on behalf of all of us with a lot confidence! As a matter of fact, you're completely wrong: txt and doc functionality is of *basic* importance and not supplementary, for me, and for celtic girl and for probably many others-- as an editor and academic, I receive and have to annotate several hundred pages of doc files each month for my work, and I'd like to do that on an e-ink screen because the lcd hurts my eyes and printing is expensive.
Hi Narative,
I understand it is important for you, celticgirl and others. And it is your right. If Onyx implements some annotation features in those formats, good for you. Why not?

I just wanted to point out, that it is technically impossible to implement certain annotation features in those formats despite good will of Onyx. It simply cannot be implemented by anyone in any reader or software, because those formats do not make it possible. That's all.

I do not know, what you need to do with those docs, but maybe the solution would be to convert txt/doc files to pdf and do the work in this format.

I do it that way. One may use virtual pdf printer (there are free ones for Win, so I expect there should be also ones for Linux, etc.) I "print" doc/txt file using this "printer" and so create a pdf. It's easy and versatile. Less work than to print it on paper.

My experience with doc format is that even Microsoft is not quite often able to display the same file in the same Word version on two different computers the same. Not speaking of different Word versions on different computers. Also 3rd party SW like OpenOffice does not many times show Word doc, like it was created in Word. Knowing that, I seriously doubt Onyx or anyone in the Universe is able to make SW which always displays the doc document exactly as it was created. For example the text might "float" between pages, the pictures jump to different places or disapear and so on.

If one wants to use all the annotation features that are available for pdf one must avoid txt/doc formats. Therefore I consider those formats supplementary, as I know they will never be able satisfy my and many other's needs (scrible in text and export scribles with text).

Those issues have nothing to do with M92 or any other Onyx's device ability or disability. Those issues are 'features' of doc and txt formats.

Onyx may implement some annotation features, but you cannot expect full M92's "pdf like" functionality, as it is just impossible.
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Old 10-22-2012, 02:50 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mono View Post
Those issues have nothing to do with M92 or any other Onyx's device ability or disability. Those issues are 'features' of doc and txt formats.

Onyx may implement some annotation features, but you cannot expect full M92's "pdf like" functionality, as it is just impossible.
For .txt a simple decent editor would be enough. Actually an editor
exists but it is restricted to "notes" and one has to manipulate (copy)
the files in order to use it.
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Old 10-22-2012, 03:29 PM   #23
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Mono,

I don't think anyone's expecting a display of the document "exactly" the way it's created, or anything else that, as you point out, even MS Word cannot deliver. All one wants is to be able to highlight and annotate word documents, rtf and txt files as well, without the tedious extra step of having to print to pdf each time, which, among other things, leaves 2 copies of each text in my laptop.

Now, as I understand it, we'll never be able to scribble on Epubs either, right? Because these things also morph based on different factors? So why not we just say, "give doc, rtf and txt the same functionality we want for Epubs"?

My point was not to ask the Boox developing team to work miracles, change water to wine etc, but just the opposite: annotation/highlighting/editing of doc files seems already within the reach of open office writer and other open source programs-- so why not just do it to the extent possible, to make Onyx's boast of being able to handle all these formats a meaningful one?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mono View Post
My experience with doc format is that even Microsoft is not quite often able to display the same file in the same Word version on two different computers the same. Not speaking of different Word versions on different computers. Also 3rd party SW like OpenOffice does not many times show Word doc, like it was created in Word. Knowing that, I seriously doubt Onyx or anyone in the Universe is able to make SW which always displays the doc document exactly as it was created. For example the text might "float" between pages, the pictures jump to different places or disapear and so on.
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Old 10-22-2012, 06:25 PM   #24
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@naravive, try a little experiment. Using a simple text editor on your PC, try to highlight and annotate one of your text files. Then, try reading it as a text file afterwards.
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:21 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naravive View Post
Mono,

I don't think anyone's expecting a display of the document "exactly" the way it's created, or anything else that, as you point out, even MS Word cannot deliver. All one wants is to be able to highlight and annotate word documents, rtf and txt files as well, without the tedious extra step of having to print to pdf each time, which, among other things, leaves 2 copies of each text in my laptop.
Naravive,
I do not know how to explain it to you. Please, try to find any sw that allows you to anotate txt file. It is possible to edit it, but not anotate (and save anotations within the txt file). It will not be possible to anotate it ever on any device and in any software.

TXT file contains just plain text, nothing more. There is no information about font size, typeface, colour of text, colour of background...

RTF file is also plain text, but it has ways to describe font size, etc. and many more. It is sort of "better" TXT file. RTF means Rich Text Format.

Concerning the pdf print. You do not have to print to PC (and have 2 copies of 1 doc in PC). Instead you may print to connected M92 or to memory card which you later insert in M92.

Edit.
I do not know anything about epub, so I cannot comment on possibility to anotate it....

Last edited by Mono; 10-23-2012 at 06:03 AM.
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:23 PM   #26
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I think you could make comments on doc files through tracking. I know you can on Mac's and I saw some people doing it on Word. It work okay. I guess I would just export my .pages or .doc files as PDF's so I could mark them up or highlight if I had the onyxboox.
Booxtor said they were improving the PDF reader- am I right about that?
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Old 10-22-2012, 09:40 PM   #27
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There will be a new firmware probably this week, with a brand new pdf reader. Let's wait for a while.

You may already make anotations, mark text and make freehand scribles in pdf and save it in pdf, in current "old" pdf reader. There are issues with some types of pdfs, but generaly it works.
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Old 10-23-2012, 01:52 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mono View Post
...

Onyx may implement some annotation features, but you cannot expect full M92's "pdf like" functionality, as it is just impossible.
M92 is far away from a "full 'pdf like' functionality" respective to the annotation tools. Sorry for this off topic comment - but I'm still frustrated.

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...=187509&page=3
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Old 10-23-2012, 04:12 PM   #29
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I meant full M92 pdf functionality, not full pdf functionality.

In other words. txt, rtf and doc formats cannot have at least as much annotation & scribling features as pdf in current firmware of M92. Some features are do-able sooner or later, some never.

Of course, many people would wish M92 has more annotation & scribling features than in in current firmware. So most probably it will be improved and so the gap between txt/rtf/doc will be even bigger...

That is why I consider, txt/rtf/doc as "suplementary" formats. At least from annotation&scribling point of view.

The solution might be if M92 has txt/rtf/doc to pdf converter. One would not need PC to do the conversion from those formats to pdf...
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Old 10-23-2012, 08:31 PM   #30
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My dear Mono, You do make such fervent use of that bold case! As far as I know, the kindle is perfectly able to highlight a txt file and add a note, which is what I'm talking about. Let me go and check. And Open Office Writer, if ported to the M92, would be able to do a track changes function that would work with a wide variety of formats. I could be wrong.
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