Would you try episodic fiction if it had a clear end point?

[E.M.DuBois]

I think I’m missing quite a bit of the conversation because I don’t understand the difference between “Episodic” fiction and a “series.” I know it’s probably a pain to do, but could someone point out the definitions/differences to me? With the exception of comic books, it seems like everyone’s talking about the same thing. Because I see people talking about combining and others comparing that to complete series, like the Dark Tower, which would be way too long to combine into a single novel (physically, I mean, but completely doable as an e-book.) Is “Episodic” fiction like when someone publishes installments that could better be labelled as “Chapters” and combined into a book?

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by E.M.DuBois

I think I’m missing quite a bit of the conversation because I don’t understand the difference between “Episodic” fiction and a “series.” I know it’s probably a pain to do, but could someone point out the definitions/differences to me? With the exception of comic books, it seems like everyone’s talking about the same thing. Because I seem people talking about combining and others comparing that to complete series, like the Dark Tower, which would be way too long to combine into a single novel (physically, I mean, but completely doable as an e-book.) Is “Episodic” fiction like when someone publishes installments that could better be labelled as “Chapters” and combined into a book?

Perry Mason, Miss Marple, Stephanie Plum, Nancy Drew, The Hardy Boys, Jack Daniels, Jet, Black, and dozens of others are series. Full books that can be read alone with no tune in next week to see if the giant clam really ate Robin. Now it may have a sub story that goes on through several books like who will Stephanie wind up with this month but that is not the main story line. Those are series.

Serials or episodes are where the author leaves the main plot open for the next part of his book. You pretty much have to buy the next book to find out what happens.
The good ones will be like NCIS (except the season enders) where they do resolve something but leave the reader wanting more.
The bad ones will just leave you tied to the railroad track with no resolution of any kind and the train is coming at 70 mph.
The awful ones will not only not resolve anything but throw up more problems in the final chapter.
If I see a part one or an episode one, I am very skeptical. Especially if the "book" is 100 pages or less.

Now if it was a full length book that is part one of say 6 or 8 I can understand it because it would cost 3 arms and 4 legs to print the entire thing at once and would be too heavy to lift.
Think Game of Thrones here.

Hope that helps.

And the worst of the lot, do sell chapters individually. I have seen that a time or two.

[E.M.DuBois]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

...of any kind and the train is coming at 70 mph.
The awful ones will not only not resolve anything but throw up more problems in the final chapter...

..Now if it was a full length book that is part one of say 6 or 8 I can understand it because it would cost 3 arms and 4 legs to print the entire thing at once and would be too heavy to lift.
Think Game of Thrones here...

...And the worst of the lot, do sell chapters individually. I have seen that a time or two.

Alright, I think I'm getting it now.

I see the occasional benefit of a cliff-hanger, but only if it's before the final chapter, and that final chapter had BETTER BE GOOD! Not like the Starship Troopers animated series I watched as a kid, where the series left off on a cliff-hanger. (Still ticked about that all these years later.) So I agree that there are awful ones.

About length dictating the need to split into a series: Like my series. 8 parts altogether. Tried to write it as one, but more and more just kept developing and had to think about separating it and turning each part into its own novel with a definite ending and resolution to each one pretty early in my teenage years.

As far as Game of Throne: I feel like Martin had one long story going, chopped it up just after pivotal moments, and then left it like that. To me, it feel like the he made no real effort to differentiate the themes and all of each one, he just made a general title for each. Like I said, I just feel that way, I'm making NO claims that's what he actually did. It just READS that way to me.

And the worst of the lot: I see that A LOT on Smashwords, I admit.

[DiapDealer]

I think "serial" is a better term. Even an "episode" can be self-contained.

I personally prefer something a little longer than a chapter, but I generally don't consider the installment length all that relevant to the quality or "meritoriousness" (or lack thereof) of a serial work.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by E.M.DuBois

As far as Game of Throne: I feel like Martin had one long story going, chopped it up just after pivotal moments, and then left it like that. To me, it feel like the he made no real effort to differentiate the themes and all of each one, he just made a general title for each. Like I said, I just feel that way, I'm making NO claims that's what he actually did. It just READS that way to me.

Roger Zelazny did that with his first AMBER series.
(He wasn't the only one. The core of LENSMEN and LORD OF THE RINGS were also conceived as single stories. Lensmen was not only broken into three volumes--and extended with prequels and sequels--but also the first three were serialized for magazine publication. A necessity for the times.)

AMBER was really a single mega novel but in those days page count ruled. Again, different times.
One advantage of ebooks is a story can be as long or as short as it needs to be without contortions, padding, or trimming to make it fit a page count.

The driving force behind most serials is economic rather than creative. Stories that are inherently episodic (like The Grantville Saga) are few and far between.
Which isn't to say it's inherently bad to serialize but most of the really bad serials are too blatantly about milking the cow.

[E.M.DuBois]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Roger Zelazny did that with his first AMBER series.
(He wasn't the only one. The core of LENSMEN and LORD OF THE RINGS were also conceived as single stories. Lensmen was not only broken into three volumes--and extended with prequels and sequels--but also the first three were serialized for magazine publication. A necessity for the times.)

Yeah, known that little tidbit for The Lord of the Rings for years now. Hell, Tolkien didn't even like the title for The Return of the King (because it "told you what happened.") The price of paper would have made it unaffordable otherwise. Still, I think that did well for it, making it into a trilogy. Now I have the single volume on my phone.

[cfrizz]

If I was interested in episodic fiction, I would read fan fiction. The odd are just as likely that it would go unfinished.

[ekbell]

Originally Posted by cfrizz

If I was interested in episodic fiction, I would read fan fiction. The odd are just as likely that it would go unfinished.

I actually read a fair amount of serialized fanfiction but can't imagine paying for a equivalent experience even with a orginal setting and characters.

Probably partly because it would be directly competing with my favorite fanfic authors for the spare moments when I want to read just a bit of a story as opposed to the times when I want to read nonfiction or a complete tale with beginning, middle and end.

[Dusky Rose]

Originally Posted by ZodWallop

My question is, if the book otherwise sounded interesting, would you be more willing to try one of these books if there was a clearly announced end point? Say, "Episode 4 (of 6) in the such-and-such-cycle"?

No.

I don't mind some series that have an overall story-arc that's not finished. But not one story stretched out into multiple parts. Which to me, what this one sounds like.

I've already got a ton of things to read to bother getting invested in something that may never be finished. Or finished over such a length of time that by the time the next chapter comes out I don't remember and don't care.

For me, too much time can kill anything. It's like someone keeps pouring water in a good soup. It just gets so thin and diluted I don't care for it anymore.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Dusky Rose

No.

I don't mind some series that have an overall story-arc that's not finished. But not one story stretched out into multiple parts. Which to me, what this one sounds like.

I've already got a ton of things to read to bother getting invested in something that may never be finished. Or finished over such a length of time that by the time the next chapter comes out I don't remember and don't care.

For me, too much time can kill anything. It's like someone keeps pouring water in a good soup. It just gets so thin and diluted I don't care for it anymore.

Want some mushroom soup? I am still trying to tame those mushrooms.
Had to say it, though most people make their soups too thin for me too.

[Dusky Rose]

Originally Posted by Cinisajoy

Want some mushroom soup? I am still trying to tame those mushrooms.
Had to say it, though most people make their soups too thin for me too.

Oh, don't even kid about mushroom soup!

I looove mushrooms. I don't know how to make a good mushroom soup myself, but love a good one.

I had a seven mushroom soup in Japan that still haunts my dreams. I have no idea what all was in it, as I couldn't read Japanese or speak it enough to ask.

It was wonderful.

[Cinisajoy]

Originally Posted by Dusky Rose

Oh, don't even kid about mushroom soup!

I looove mushrooms. I don't know how to make a good mushroom soup myself, but love a good one.

I had a seven mushroom soup in Japan that still haunts my dreams. I have no idea what all was in it, as I couldn't read Japanese or speak it enough to ask.

It was wonderful.

I will message you.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by E.M.DuBois

Yeah, known that little tidbit for The Lord of the Rings for years now. Hell, Tolkien didn't even like the title for The Return of the King (because it "told you what happened.") The price of paper would have made it unaffordable otherwise. Still, I think that did well for it, making it into a trilogy. Now I have the single volume on my phone.

The first time I read Lord of the Rings was a single volume paperback edition borrowed from a library. A bit heavy but not all that bad weightwise though I hate thinking about how long ago that was.

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by Dusky Rose

Oh, don't even kid about mushroom soup!

I looove mushrooms. I don't know how to make a good mushroom soup myself, but love a good one.

I had a seven mushroom soup in Japan that still haunts my dreams. I have no idea what all was in it, as I couldn't read Japanese or speak it enough to ask.

It was wonderful.

You've never tried nine stone soup?

[Dusky Rose]

Originally Posted by DNSB

You've never tried nine stone soup?

Lol.

Maybe I have.