Backlinks arrrrrrgh! - Page 2

exaltedwombat · 06-03-2019, 07:45 PM

I don't have ANY linking yet. I have text with superscript references in the main section, then a Notes section with numbered paragraphs.

I propose initially to link all the [1] references forward to paragraph 1, link back to just the first one. Same for [2] etc. Should be able to cobble together a bit of regex to do this easily enough. Then I'll submit to the client, without comment.

DaleDe · 06-03-2019, 07:53 PM

Another choice would be to have no links whatsoever. Instead, the first time 1 is reached place the note in the next paragraph indented as a block. Then add a statement to the end of the note stating that all item 1's in this book reference this note.

And then similarly for the 2's etc.

Then if the reader wants to reread a reference he can mark it with a tab.

Dale

Hitch · 06-03-2019, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

I don't have ANY linking yet. I have text with superscript references in the main section, then a Notes section with numbered paragraphs.

That's seems to be sane, but I suspect that your client, like most of mine, will go bonkers when they can't get BACK in the 2nd->nth references to paragraph 1.

I suppose you've tried to convince her to nuke the n instances of 1, after the fist one, right?

Hitch

Notjohn · 06-06-2019, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

There are 72 instances of <sup>1</sup>, 92 instances of <sup>2</sup> etc. etc. in the main body of text. What would you suggest? :-)

Since I make my living by writing, not formatting, I would suggest telling him/her/it to take his/her/its business elsewhere. Ninety-two instances? That's madness.

exaltedwombat · 06-06-2019, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Notjohn

Since I make my living by writing, not formatting, I would suggest telling him/her/it to take his/her/its business elsewhere. Ninety-two instances? That's madness.

Constructive advice as always!

theducks · 06-08-2019, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

Constructive advice as always!

The usual purpose of a footnote is to explain (cite) or expand on something

If they didn't get it the first time (the note appeared), are they going to 'get it' any of the 91 other times?

jhowell · 06-08-2019, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theducks

The usual purpose of a footnote is to explain (cite) or expand on something

If they didn't get it the first time (the note appeared), are they going to 'get it' any of the 91 other times?

Yeah. It seems to me that anything important enough to be cited 92 times should probably have been in the main flow of the book instead of a footnote.

exaltedwombat · 06-08-2019, 03:19 PM

I think we all accepted from the outset that this book is perversely constructed. And that there is little point in reiterating this fact!

j.p.s · 06-08-2019, 07:23 PM

Well, any ereader software that doesn't have a back function is broken. Just how many broken (in this regard) ereaders are out there?

Hitch · 06-09-2019, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Well, any ereader software that doesn't have a back function is broken. Just how many broken (in this regard) ereaders are out there?

Are you serious? You must have come to eReaders later, because early Kindles certainly didn't have it and I've had others and tried others that didn't. To you it may seem broken, but they simply weren't designed that way. Trust me, most of us would cheerfully NOT design for that issue if it didn't exist.

Hitch

theducks · 06-09-2019, 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j.p.s

Well, any ereader software that doesn't have a back function is broken. Just how many broken (in this regard) ereaders are out there?

Listen to Hitch. She deals with the real world limitations every day.

My first reader did not have a 'back'. I am not sure about either the K4nt or my Kobo. Most of what I read

does not have (or need), footnotes.
My problem is touchscreens. I have large hands, and now issues with my eyes are making the touch of a precise place, near impossible.

j.p.s · 06-09-2019, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitch

Are you serious? You must have come to eReaders later, because early Kindles certainly didn't have it and I've had others and tried others that didn't. To you it may seem broken, but they simply weren't designed that way. Trust me, most of us would cheerfully NOT design for that issue if it didn't exist.

Hitch

OK, I'm busted as an ereading newbie, since I got my first reader, a K2, a little over 10 years ago. I had a Palm V, but never even considered using it to read books.

Not only does the K4NT have a back button, the K2 does as well. Although the K2 is not a K1, I'm pretty sure that in 2019 it qualifies as an early Kindle.

FWIW, I think it is fine to provide a backlink for footnotes, but demanding that the book itself know how to get back to one of many references is a bit absurd.

Hitch · 06-09-2019, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j.p.s

OK, I'm busted as an ereading newbie, since I got my first reader, a K2, a little over 10 years ago. I had a Palm V, but never even considered using it to read books.

Not only does the K4NT have a back button, the K2 does as well. Although the K2 is not a K1, I'm pretty sure that in 2019 it qualifies as an early Kindle.

FWIW, I think it is fine to provide a backlink for footnotes, but demanding that the book itself know how to get back to one of many references is a bit absurd.

There were LOTS of early eReaders besides the Kindles (K and K2). If you're going to ask for a list of all the eReaders that don't have back functionality, hell, I can't remember. I do recall issues with at LEAST two Kobos, for sure. And there's something noodling around inside my head about the K2's back functionality, too. I still have one but I'll have to power it up to see if I can jostle those brain cells into what it was that didn't work so great with the "back" button on the k2. I fully agree that by the K4, they certainly all had them.

I wish that they all had back functionality, because, brother, it would make my life dramatically easier. The many-to-one issue with eBooks is real and it's a major pita to explain to clients as to why it can't be done, or has to be done this way or that. I end up wasting at LEAST an hour of time with every client that INSISTS that they gotta have fully-linked, two-way indices with multiple outbound (from the index) links going to the same pages, articles/sections/whatever. It's a damn nightmare.

Hitch

exaltedwombat · 06-15-2019, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitch

I end up wasting at LEAST an hour of time with every client that INSISTS that they gotta have fully-linked, two-way indices with multiple outbound (from the index) links going to the same pages, articles/sections/whatever. It's a damn nightmare.

Hitch

Goodness! What can be explained in an hour that can't be in a few minutes?

Anyway, the job's been delivered. Either the author's happy, or he's spent the last week preparing an exhaustive list of errata. Fingers crossed...

Hitch · 06-15-2019, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exaltedwombat

Goodness! What can be explained in an hour that can't be in a few minutes?

Anyway, the job's been delivered. Either the author's happy, or he's spent the last week preparing an exhaustive list of errata. Fingers crossed...

First I send them a detailed email (most of that is canned, thank GOD), explaining the issues with many-to-one. When you're largely dealing with right-brainers...well.

THEN, of course, they send back a crapload of questions, because they mostly don't get the explanation.

THEN, I send back more answers and finally, after about 4 emails, they decide one way or the other.

If your comms with your clients are easier, I envy you, I really do.

Hitch

06-03-2019, 07:53 PM	#17
DaleDe Grand Sorcerer Posts: 11,470 Karma: 13095790 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Grass Valley, CA Device: EB 1150, EZ Reader, Literati, iPad 2 & Air 2, iPhone 7	Another choice would be to have no links whatsoever. Instead, the first time 1 is reached place the note in the next paragraph indented as a block. Then add a statement to the end of the note stating that all item 1's in this book reference this note. And then similarly for the 2's etc. Then if the reader wants to reread a reference he can mark it with a tab. Dale Last edited by DaleDe; 06-03-2019 at 07:55 PM.

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06-03-2019, 07:45 PM	#16
exaltedwombat Guru Posts: 878 Karma: 2457540 Join Date: Nov 2011 Device: none	I don't have ANY linking yet. I have text with superscript references in the main section, then a Notes section with numbered paragraphs. I propose initially to link all the [1] references forward to paragraph 1, link back to just the first one. Same for [2] etc. Should be able to cobble together a bit of regex to do this easily enough. Then I'll submit to the client, without comment.

06-08-2019, 03:19 PM	#23
exaltedwombat Guru Posts: 878 Karma: 2457540 Join Date: Nov 2011 Device: none	I think we all accepted from the outset that this book is perversely constructed. And that there is little point in reiterating this fact!

06-08-2019, 07:23 PM	#24
j.p.s Grand Sorcerer Posts: 5,278 Karma: 98804578 Join Date: Apr 2011 Device: pb360	Well, any ereader software that doesn't have a back function is broken. Just how many broken (in this regard) ereaders are out there?

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