Where did the Entourage Edge and Pocket Edge go wrong?

Hey guys.

I am writing an article on why educational tablets fail in the market place and am writing a piece on Entourage. Although I have both devices I am a little bit unsure of a few key points and hopefully you guys can help out. If anything, it will help provide a case study.

It seems to me entourage tried really hard getting into schools in the USA and Canada, but it did not pan out the way they wanted. From research they formed partnerships with The Douglas Stewart Company, Blackboard Alliance and the Creative Career Academy (any other major ones) but it was not that successful. (Anyone know how many schools entourage is in?)

With their student store focusing on textbooks as being the first major thing they did, they seemed to do a 180 and focus more on bestsellers and other fiction works and then open their app store.

It seems to me, that entourage initially tried to get in bed with the schools, it did not work out, so they tried to market directly to normal customers to pick up the device. Combined with an outdated version of Android and little to no support and a high price tag facilitated the demise of the Edge Product line, the app store and many other things.

What do you guys have to say? Why do you think the Edge and Pocket Edge failed to capture market attention, why did it fail in schools?

There are a few threads discussing this topic. I'll try to gather them for you. I know they also went to a school in Egypt (from a news item that probably is no longer posted). I would like to know what happened with that project. Maybe you can find out??

Will be interested to read what you write! Please post a link here when you're done.

Awesome if you can compile some additional info that would be cool!! I will amend by article, right now it is fairly concise.

The title of the Article is

Are Dual-Screen Tablets Cursed? A case study of Entourage and Kno

http://goodereader.com/blog/electron...urage-and-kno/

Re Egypt: http://www.eschoolnews.com/2010/10/1...e-transport-2/

Some early reactions: https://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76900

Threads from this forum: http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...-your-eDGe-for, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...e-this-product, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...screen-devices, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...ourage-Systems, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...-and-Marketing, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...at-s-Your-eDGe, http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...-Brainstorming..., http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...hat-Went-Wrong.

That should give you an idea of our discussions! There's more, but if you get through the links above you will be doing well!

I only went back to March of this year. Anybody know of anything Goodereader should know about before that??

Er, third paragraph in: "It featured a 6 inch e-ink touchscreen display and a 5 inch Android . . . ." That should be 6 and 7 inches.

I wouldn't say the App store was a "tremendous disappointment". I found it very helpful -- all the apps were free (some trial versions) and they all worked on the eDGe, which is not true for other app stores. I'm sure people were disappointed that it wasn't the equivalent of the Google Market, but how could it be?? Would have been nice if Google had let enTourage into their Market . . .

Was the original cost "$700-$450?" enTourage was selling the EE for $599 when I was deciding to buy, and the PE might have been $450, but I'm not sure.

Interesting article! I will reread it later. Thanks for sharing!

Thanks guys, I made some adjustments : )

Filark, you really have to teach me your 'search techniques' for this forum !!

As borisb has noted more than once, the EE and PE are not *dual screen* devices, but rather are *dual book* devices. It's salient that one side is eink and the other is a tablet; this makes it fundamentally different from something like the Kno.

The Pocket Edge was originally priced at $399, but sold through Amazon right out of the gate for $340.

Having done a lot of messing with the PE for the last two weeks I have found several flaws that probably contributed to the early demise of the PE and probably the biggun, too.
1) lack of app support- though the apps in the entourage store were OK, they weren't what people were used to on their Android phones. Lack of access to the Google apps market was a big problem. I suspect the reason that Google didn't let Entourage get in there (assuming it was Google's decision) was because many apps would not have worked due to the differences in the Entourage hardware. Nonworking apps might be blamed on the apps, not the hardware, so to prevent such confusion, don't let the "offending" hardware access the app market. I have found a few ways to get around this limitation, but it requires far more messing around than most people are willing to do. I am a geek and I am not sure I want to mess around that much considering the alternatives that are available.
2) OS not fully developed- Android 1.6 was too far behind and Android 2.2 beta still has too many kinks. My device frequently thinks it is connected to USB even after disconnecting it. It won't hibernate unless I use the power switch to force it. These little annoyances add up to a less than stellar user experience.
3) The documentation is really weak. The user guide tells you how to connect to a computer via USB but not what to do after you have connected. It looks like the Library app allows you to add to the device's library, but there is no apparent way to remove stuff from the library if you don't want it on the device any longer. There is nothing in the user guide (that I have been able to find) that tells you where to put files that you will want added to the library or how to remove them from the library once you have. Playing with the library app doesn't yield any clues either- removing items from the library seems to have been forgotten in the programming.
4) The response to pen input on the e-ink screen is just a little too slow. It captures all hand written/drawn stuff just fine, but the display responds too slowly- It gives you the impression that the thing is running a old, memory starved processor even though the Android side is very snappy. The ruler and shape recognition modes are fantastic, but just a little too slow to be useful. The annotation features are useful for the education crowd but for everyone else, not so much.
5) The mechanical design is great but the device is just a little too thick and heavy. It looks nice and has a tremendous amount of functionality but once you pick it up it feels like you're lugging a laptop.

These are the main issues I have found. There are a ton of things that make it a great device, but unfortunately you really have to be a geek to get the most out of this thing.

#1: I agree that this is an issue.

#2: I haven't yet had issues like this with mine; mine hibernates fine.

#3: Yes, the documentation is sketchy. I think this is somewhat common, IME. But either way, it makes for a hard sell to consumers if they don't understand what the device can do. The features should be clearer to consumers.

#4: I must write slowly; the annotations are working fine for me.

#5: I actually think this is a feature for me; I don't enjoy devices that are small and thin. We have a kindle and it doesn't feel sturdy to me. To me, the PE feels both solid and highly portable. It's not a "pocket" device to me (I think the name was a mistake... but then I think "edge" was a mistake, too. Not at all a name that conveys the virtues of the product.) To me, it's something more than a tiny device and less robust than a netbook in most ways.

#6: I think the marketing was just not clear enough. This was a device that was innovative in several keys ways. It allows me to interact with my web browser and with files to read (and websites to read offline) in ways I love, that are distinctly different from the ways I interact with a desktop. The reviews and marketing I've read make it clear that people reviewing it mostly didn't "get it."

I also think the screen size is lovely; you're getting that mainly-ad-free mobile web joy but large enough to really see the text.

Originally Posted by mark.r

Having done a lot of messing with the PE for the last two weeks I have found several flaws that probably contributed to the early demise of the PE and probably the biggun, too.
1) lack of app support- though the apps in the entourage store were OK, they weren't what people were used to on their Android phones. Lack of access to the Google apps market was a big problem. I suspect the reason that Google didn't let Entourage get in there (assuming it was Google's decision) was because many apps would not have worked due to the differences in the Entourage hardware. Nonworking apps might be blamed on the apps, not the hardware, so to prevent such confusion, don't let the "offending" hardware access the app market. I have found a few ways to get around this limitation, but it requires far more messing around than most people are willing to do. I am a geek and I am not sure I want to mess around that much considering the alternatives that are available.
2) OS not fully developed- Android 1.6 was too far behind and Android 2.2 beta still has too many kinks. My device frequently thinks it is connected to USB even after disconnecting it. It won't hibernate unless I use the power switch to force it. These little annoyances add up to a less than stellar user experience.
3) The documentation is really weak. The user guide tells you how to connect to a computer via USB but not what to do after you have connected. It looks like the Library app allows you to add to the device's library, but there is no apparent way to remove stuff from the library if you don't want it on the device any longer. There is nothing in the user guide (that I have been able to find) that tells you where to put files that you will want added to the library or how to remove them from the library once you have. Playing with the library app doesn't yield any clues either- removing items from the library seems to have been forgotten in the programming.
4) The response to pen input on the e-ink screen is just a little too slow. It captures all hand written/drawn stuff just fine, but the display responds too slowly- It gives you the impression that the thing is running a old, memory starved processor even though the Android side is very snappy. The ruler and shape recognition modes are fantastic, but just a little too slow to be useful. The annotation features are useful for the education crowd but for everyone else, not so much.
5) The mechanical design is great but the device is just a little too thick and heavy. It looks nice and has a tremendous amount of functionality but once you pick it up it feels like you're lugging a laptop.

These are the main issues I have found. There are a ton of things that make it a great device, but unfortunately you really have to be a geek to get the most out of this thing.

The documentation and user guide are really not complete, you are right there - but you can remove items from the library, it's just not intuitive. At the top of your library page put a check in the box, now you will see a box appear in front of each library item. Check one and at the bottom you have the option to delete. As far as adding files to the library, it does not matter where they are. If it is a file capable of being added it will offer you the choice after you tap it. I prefer to keep the original file on my external SD, the library puts a duplicate on the internal storage.

Originally Posted by mark.r

Having done a lot of messing with the PE for the last two weeks I have found several flaws that probably contributed to the early demise of the PE and probably the biggun, too.
1) lack of app support- though the apps in the entourage store were OK, they weren't what people were used to on their Android phones. Lack of access to the Google apps market was a big problem. I suspect the reason that Google didn't let Entourage get in there (assuming it was Google's decision) was because many apps would not have worked due to the differences in the Entourage hardware. Nonworking apps might be blamed on the apps, not the hardware, so to prevent such confusion, don't let the "offending" hardware access the app market. I have found a few ways to get around this limitation, but it requires far more messing around than most people are willing to do. I am a geek and I am not sure I want to mess around that much considering the alternatives that are available.
2) OS not fully developed- Android 1.6 was too far behind and Android 2.2 beta still has too many kinks. My device frequently thinks it is connected to USB even after disconnecting it. It won't hibernate unless I use the power switch to force it. These little annoyances add up to a less than stellar user experience.
3) The documentation is really weak. The user guide tells you how to connect to a computer via USB but not what to do after you have connected. It looks like the Library app allows you to add to the device's library, but there is no apparent way to remove stuff from the library if you don't want it on the device any longer. There is nothing in the user guide (that I have been able to find) that tells you where to put files that you will want added to the library or how to remove them from the library once you have. Playing with the library app doesn't yield any clues either- removing items from the library seems to have been forgotten in the programming.
4) The response to pen input on the e-ink screen is just a little too slow. It captures all hand written/drawn stuff just fine, but the display responds too slowly- It gives you the impression that the thing is running a old, memory starved processor even though the Android side is very snappy. The ruler and shape recognition modes are fantastic, but just a little too slow to be useful. The annotation features are useful for the education crowd but for everyone else, not so much.
5) The mechanical design is great but the device is just a little too thick and heavy. It looks nice and has a tremendous amount of functionality but once you pick it up it feels like you're lugging a laptop.

These are the main issues I have found. There are a ton of things that make it a great device, but unfortunately you really have to be a geek to get the most out of this thing.

1) Lack of Apps? There are many excellent Apps that work with the PE (http://www.entourageedge.com/forums/...et-Edge-Owners) and plenty of off market sites (Amazon, SlideMe, Handango, Freeware Lovers just to name a few).

2) While I agree that 1.6 is antiquated, the 2.2 beta on the PE is HIGHLY polished. I own a PE and my son owns one and we have not experienced hibernation problems and never heard of the USB problem you describe until mentioned on this thread. If there is one thing Entourage could have added to the beta it should be Flash support. Plus, the ability to store Apps on the SD Card would be a huge plus. On the e-ink side the ability to view documents in landscape is good but incomplete. One of my biggest complaints with this is that when you scroll to the bottom of a page and then turn the page you are at the bottom of the next page and have to manually go back to the top. This is a little annoying. Better zooming on PDFs would also be a nice feature. Right now some PDFs are just unreadable on the e-ink unless you are Superman. Other than that, the 2.2 beta on the PE is almost ready for prime time.

3) In my opinion there is plenty of information on page 48 of the User Guide that tells you exactly how to connect the PE to a computer. Page 49 (Deleting Content from your Library) of the User Guide tells you how to delete a file from the library.

4) I agree that the the e-ink journal is a tad slow but not so bad that it is unusable. I think this is in part due to the stock stylus. When using a full sized stylus like the Motion Computing LE1600 the Journal App is actually pretty impressive. A bigger complaint would be the screen size. It's too small for the average person. For people my son, who write small, it's not a problem. I can actually write on it quite well but I get less characters per page because my handwriting is big.

5) I think the size is OK but you are right, it is nothing to brag about. That's the price you pay for two screens.

You are dead on when you say that the Edge is not geared towards the casual user. It takes some time and work to get the most out of it. Unfortunately, this does not appeal to the casual user who want things to work as advertised when they buy the. Who can blame them? I think a bigger problem is the way Entourage marketed (or didn't market) the Edge. Two months ago I never heard of the Edge. I stumbled upon it on Amazon. Plus the competition is fierce: iPad, Kindle, Nook etc. While these can't quite match what the Edge does, each does what it does and does it well. In other words, maybe Entourage should have concentrated on a single device (an e-reader with all the capabilities it has now plus Internet access, 3G etc. and skipped the tablet).

The release of the iPad probably helped contribute to the device's demise. Originally, the Edge was a unique product, and I almost considered buying it instead of my Asus T91MT. However, after Apple entered the tablet market, the Edge started to seem ridiculously overpriced. When the PE came out at the end of 2010, you could purchase a brand new iPad for $499. The original price for the Pocket Edge was $399. Basically, you would need to convince consumers to choose this tablet over the iPad when it had a resistive touchscreen, no access to an app marketplace, no multi-touch gestures, no accelerometer, and no built-in Kindle or Nook bookstore. Personally, I never would have paid $399. Similarly, the larger Edge still sells for about the same price as the cheapest iPad. How could you justify the purchase when it is obviously missing the features that we come to expect from a quality tablet? If I'm going to spend $500, I want to have a capacitive touchscreen, a processor capable of playing games, and a quality app marketplace. The Edge has none of these things.

For $150, I'm perfectly fine with having to turn off the background in Angry Birds. This is completely unacceptable for a $399+ device.

The e-ink screen is excellent. Due to the additional LCD tablet, it is certainly more versatile than a Kindle. However, after having a chance to play around with it, I must confess that I still don't fully understand the appeal of e-ink. The technology just doesn't seem ready for consumer use. Back at the time the Edge was released, the industry absolutely was convinced that people would never want to read on an LCD screen. At CES 2010, almost every company in existence had announced an e-ink reader. However, after the introduction of the iPad, it became increasingly obvious that people were fine reading on a LCD screen, and they appreciated the increased functionality offered by such devices. Of course, I certainly like having an e-ink screen, and it's great for reading certain kinds of books. In addition, I like the fact that I now have an option for reading outdoors. But if I were going to spend more than $300, I'd much rather have a single screen with increased functionality. Right now, the book companies have already started to abandon e-ink for cheap color tablets. By all accounts, the Nook Color has sold extremely well, and Amazon is getting read to release a set of Android devices. Until fast, color e-ink displays become more affordable, I'm afraid that the "age of e-ink" is probably gone.

So, I'd say the Edge suffered from a combination of factors: the release of the iPad, Google's decision to restrict access to the Android market, and the slow demise of e-ink devices. In reality, Entourage could not have anticipated any of these things, although they could have perhaps done a better job of integrating smartphone features (like multitouch and an accelerometer).

Originally Posted by kennyminot

How could you justify the purchase when it is obviously missing the features that we come to expect from a quality tablet? If I'm going to spend $500, I want to have a capacitive touchscreen, a processor capable of playing games, and a quality app marketplace. The Edge has none of these things.

I think this is the issue right here--the fact that Entourage didn't recognize that they couldn't--and shouldn't--go head to head with the ipad or other straight-up tablets. Some of us really don't care about playing games, or streaming netflix, or shooting video with our reading/productivity devices. The fact is, you have a certain set of expectations as a consumer, and I have a completely different set. The ipad never appealed to me, is not a product I considered buying, and does not form the baseline for what I believe a tablet-like device should do. Nor did the Kindle define ink reading for me. What got me into both the world of tablets *and* eink was the dualbook. For what it's worth, I completely disagree about the utility and preferability of eink to LCD. I will NEVER read on an LCD screen. Perhaps I am in the minority on this, and others are more than happy to do so, but I think that even as a minority there are enough people like me who feel similarly attached to eink. And there are enough academics, professionals, doctors, whatever, out there that we are a viable consumer market. Perhaps not on the scale of Apple consumers, but enough to keep a company going.

I am actually quite tired of people telling me over and over again that the PE was somehow lacking. I bought mine in December 2010 for $340 and I *still* feel it was money well-spent. So much so that I bought a used EE 2 months later (for less than $400--I agree that the retail price of the EE was prohibitive).

In my opinion, the Edge suffered from poor branding and bad marketing, and not from any inherent mechanical or design flaws.

I would have to agree with kenny...but I'll even go a step further - I believe it was ONLY the Google restriction to the Android market. The reason I come to this conclusion is because of the numerous other tablets which have fared miserably due to the lack of using the genuine "Google Android Market". This has been the downfall of most, if not all, tablets. People like to say that Apple is too proprietary for their liking, but Google has recently become quite similar (before you all have your heads pop off - I said similar). I guess when you get that large you have to watch every Tom, **** and Harry that come along which may ruin your reputation.