Why is there no e-ink innovation in the USA?

[ZodWallop]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Because as a relatively unknown brand, they would have a hard time competing against Amazon, B&N, and Kobo. It would cost quite a lot to get their name's known in the USA.

My question was rhetorical I was just trying to point out an error in the OPs logic.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by howyoudoin

Shipping was 30 bucks. What if you needed to make use of the warranty? What if you needed to return it?

It's the little things that add up and make Amazon such an attractive fail-safe proposition.

These days transpacific shipping cost is much lower.
Unless you choose air freight.

[kacir]

Originally Posted by patrickt

I wonder what innovation people want.

- 5 inch front-lit device with thin bezel, so it fits to my shirt pocket (for reading on the road [and at work])
- 7 inch brother of the smaller device for reading in bed ;-)
- with flexible screen - not flexible device, but a screen that doesn't have thin glass plane inside
- with lid that fits over the screen or on the back of the device and doesn't add bulk to the device
- with buttons under my thumb when I am holding the device
- waterproof and rugged
- with large number of user configuration options, so everybody can configure the device exactly the way they want (with reasonable and simple defaults, with detailed options hidden somewhere in "experts" menu or in configuration files)
- with support for hierarchical directories and option to display either metadata or filename
- with real working typography
- with high enough screen resolution so it could display delicate fonts without said fonts having been optimized and/or heavily hinted
- with large number of supported file formats
- with support for third-party apps, so that we tinkerers can focus on improving the device instead of pissing against the wind trying to hack or root the device
- with device body that doesn't have to be pried apart when disassembling for battery change or repair.

my beloved PocketBook 360 had many of the above features, with notable exception of front-lit hi-res screen or waterproofing.

[shalym]

Originally Posted by Rizla

You've made this point before, and I believe it to be erroneous.

It is an expensive and costly business to ship an Onyx e-reader from to the USA. The shipping is high. And what if there is a problem with the device? Then you ship it back. You might have to pay shipping. Either way, it will take time and money.

And as you have stated, you are "price-insensitive." The risk of losing money on a faulty device shipped from abroad may not bother your budget, but that is not the case for most users.

Shipping from abroad is prohibitive for most people and effectively bars the product for them. I have seen a number of comments to this effect on these forums made by users in America.

So no. The average American user has great difficulty accessing the Onyx device. If you are in Europe, the problem is greatly lessened. Once again, we see a lack of innovation in the American market.

I actually bought my Onyx T68 from Amazon. Free 2 day shipping with Prime. The T68 is no longer available, but the M96 is. http://www.amazon.com/Onyx-M96-Unive...6543639&sr=8-1

Shari

[DiapDealer]

If enough people in the US ordered these "innovative" devices from overseas, perhaps that would prompt US companies to make/sell them (or at least encourage those overseas sellers to have an american presence). Prove there's a demand.

I find it a little silly to blame a lack of innovation in the US eink device market on US consumers wanting everything they want at the cheapest possible prices -- and then balking at possibly having to pay high prices to get the exact device you want from an overseas supplier.

If you don't put your money where your heart is, you're part of the "problem."

[cvkemp]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

If you don't put your money where your heart is, you're part of the "problem."

I could not agree more. I have always said if it is what you want then be prepared to pay for it.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by cvkemp

I could not agree more. I have always said if it is what you want then be prepared to pay for it.

Yep. That's why I paid the equivalent of about US$650 to import a Sony PRS-500 from the US to the UK, pay import taxes and VAT on it, etc. For me it was worth it.

[howyoudoin]

Originally Posted by DiapDealer

If enough people in the US ordered these "innovative" devices from overseas, perhaps that would prompt US companies to make/sell them (or at least encourage those overseas sellers to have an american presence). Prove there's a demand.

I find it a little silly to blame a lack of innovation in the US eink device market on US consumers wanting everything they want at the cheapest possible prices -- and then balking at possibly having to pay high prices to get the exact device you want from an overseas supplier.

If you don't put your money where your heart is, you're part of the "problem."

It's not as simple as just the price. It's a combination of price and ecosystem lockdown. A natural consequence of a company leveraging it's uniquely dominant ebook store.

I buy my books from Amazon, and am also capable of putting in the time and effort of using calibre. Hence I've gone to great lengths to procure a Kobo model that isn't even available in my country. I've voted with my wallet.

However If I were to recommend an e-reader to my parents or friends, I'd suggest the kindle every time to spare them the effort, even though I do not consider it the best* e-reading device. I simply do not want to recommend a kobo to them and be that guy whose poor advice resulted in them either buying books from the more expenive kobo store or forced them to be tethered to a computer with calibre to convert all their Amazon store purchases. I will recommend the kobo to my computer savvy friends, but they're not typically representative of the book lovers in my circle. The net result is a plus for Amazon and their kindles.

If my Kobo conks out now, I'll have to cut my losses instead of returning the kobo under warranty because the shipping and customs and lost time would not be worth it. I'd just buy a kindle locally to replace it. That's a risk i've taken. Most people won't accept that risk. It's just safer to buy a kindle here.

I do not blame the US market for the dominance of the kindle. The combination of device and ecosystem that Amazon offers is hard to beat by just making better devices, which is what makes it tougher for other companies even if we assume that they are more innovative device-wise.

India is the third largest market world-wide for English books, and considering how Amazon is quickly settling into the marketplace here while the other companies drag their feet, I have no doubt that we will see an almost exact replication of the US market share here too over the next few years. First mover advantage is a huge thing in the context of ecosystem lockdown as well as brand recognition (person sees me reading on my Kobo and decides to buy himself "one of those kindle devices" because kindles are synonymous with e-readers now and most easily visible and available at the nearest electronics store).

The American market might be sown up by Amazon and the other companies could be excused for not moving in fast enough, but those other companies do not seem to have taken that lesson to heart in emerging markets for whatever reasons. Maybe it's management myopia or just a plain lack of funds to compete at Amazon's scale.

At the pace Amazon are growing, they do not need to innovate drastically. All they need to do is innovate just enough to not lag far too behind the competition. If the e-reader marketshare were less dominated by Amazon, they might perhaps have been more innovative, of course subject to the pace of developments in the technology (which is also an important factor and possibly more restrictive than the other factors combined to be fair).

Sorry if it seems I've rambled on.

* personal opinion, not meant to be an absolute statement of fact.

[fjtorres]

Amazon didn't leverage its bookstore to build Kindle.
That would've been illegal. And has been repeatedly investigated.

Kindles don't *have* to get their books from Amazon nor do Kindle ebook buyers have to buy Kindle readers. The famous lockdown, isn't.

Consumers buy Kindles because the features and the price satisfy.
For years, Kindles were the only readers that didn't need a PC or online access. For a year, they were the only source of Pearl screens you could *buy*. They always get the new eink screen tech first. Look at the Voyage, is there still anything really like it out there? No.

Amazon has been very careful *not* to break any competition laws and tying is illegal.
Walled gardens are not but even there Amazon has been careful to leave enough of a gap to avoid legal challenges.

The primary reason for Amazon's dominance is the same it's always been: they do a good enough job at everything and the opposition doesn't. They have been gifted with singularly inept enemies who help them every time they try to hurt them.

[cvkemp]

Sounds like you need to look for a ebook reader that is not dedicated to any one company or ebook format then you calibre to load your ebooks to the device. And you would need to have a computer and the hacks to Remove the DRM. Other than that you are stuck with one of the companies that does the ebooks and devices and live with what they have to offer.

[Fbone]

I wouldn't mind wireless charging and data transfer.

[howyoudoin]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Amazon didn't leverage its bookstore to build Kindle.
That would've been illegal. And has been repeatedly investigated.

Kindles don't *have* to get their books from Amazon nor do Kindle ebook buyers have to buy Kindle readers. The famous lockdown, isn't.

Consumers buy Kindles because the features and the price satisfy.
For years, Kindles were the only readers that didn't need a PC or online access. For a year, they were the only source of Pearl screens you could *buy*. They always get the new eink screen tech first. Look at the Voyage, is there still anything really like it out there? No.

Amazon has been very careful *not* to break any competition laws and tying is illegal.
Walled gardens are not but even there Amazon has been careful to leave enough of a gap to avoid legal challenges.

The primary reason for Amazon's dominance is the same it's always been: they do a good enough job at everything and the opposition doesn't. They have been gifted with singularly inept enemies who help them every time they try to hurt them.

I didn't say it was illegal.

The prime reason I bought a kindle for my first e-reader was the Amazon bookstore. That's what I mean by leverage.

We're talking about innovation in devices, which necessitates the removal of confounding factors. Therefore to make a straightforward comparison of devices, we need to decouple the device itself from the bookstore integration and difficulty of the average reader accessing their Amazon books on other e-readers. The kindle might still end up as the best selling e-reader in this situation, but it is not unreasonable to suggest that the margin of dominance would be reduced.

[fjtorres]

Originally Posted by howyoudoin

I didn't say it was illegal.

The prime reason I bought a kindle for my first e-reader was the Amazon bookstore. That's what I mean by leverage.

We're talking about innovation in devices, which necessitates the removal of confounding factors. Therefore to make a straightforward comparison of devices, we need to decouple the device itself from the bookstore integration and difficulty of the average reader accessing their Amazon books on other e-readers. The kindle might still end up as the best selling e-reader in this situation, but it is not unreasonable to suggest that the margin of dominance would be reduced.

Or increased if you do away with epub religion.

Do you really think that the Voyage wouldn't be universally hailed as a great ereader if it didn't have the Amazon name?

[howyoudoin]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Or increased if you do away with epub religion.

That's a good point.

Do you really think that the Voyage wouldn't be universally hailed as a great ereader if it didn't have the Amazon name?

Of course it would still be a great e-reader. Never claimed otherwise. But I don't think kindles would be as dominant as they are in market share.

[Phogg]

Originally Posted by fjtorres

Or increased if you do away with epub religion.

Do you really think that the Voyage wouldn't be universally hailed as a great ereader if it didn't have the Amazon name?

Is there any other six inch e-ink reader out there with as small a form factor and a gorilla glass screen?

Yes it's a top tier device.

Albeit the weather resistance of the Kobo H2O appeals to me more for my use, the Voyage earned it's accolades honestly.