Gregg's Nearly Interminable Adventures in Linux Land - Page 8

Gregg Bell · 04-21-2014, 06:25 PM

Hey, I keep hearing about the importance of backing up in Linux. It's a little daunting because it makes it seem like my computer's going to crash any second. (One guy said backup every five minutes.) Anyway, eschwartz, I did look at your backup link and it was just way too complicated for me. I just write books and need to back those up. However, people have said I need to back up "configurable" files, as well, and I don't know what configurable files (or folders) are. Some people have said 'Just save home/gregory.' But I saved just the Documents folder (and it wasn't that big) to Google Drive and it took 20 minutes. And I tried but couldn't save the home folder anyway. (Somebody said I needed to be root to do that.)

So:
1)what are configurable files/folders and do I need to back them up or can I just back up my writing?

2)I've heard a bunch of people say Grsync is perfect for my needs.

3) I have heard others say Grsync lulls you into a false sense of security that your stuff is being backed up and you're better off just saving to a flash drive.

4) Then there is the cloud drive backup scenario. As mentioned I already have Google Drive, but places like iDrive www.idrive.com/online-backup-features.htm has continuous backup and allows me to have several different computers on one account and allows me to sync the same files I will be working on in three different computers. And Cyphertite, www.cyphertite.com/plans.php which is pretty much the same thing but open source and supposedly has better encryption, but I don't think I can have all three computers on one account. (If I went cloud, I'm leaning toward iDrive.)

I know this is a blob of questions, but you guys are so expert at Linux I know you can figure it out easily.

Bonus question: Is Sourcefourge no longer reliable for downloading? I've ready nasty things about them bundling malware with their downloads.

Thanks guys.

twowheels · 04-21-2014, 07:16 PM

Linux is no worse in that regard than any other OS, it just happens to be run, in the most part, by people who are more technically savvy and more likely to actually back up their data. Windows & Mac users should also back up their data. These "every 5 minutes" comments are coming from people who have an automated backup system that uses something like rsync to only back up files that have actually changed -- probably not something you care to set up.

As for methods and scope, it really depends on your risk tolerance. I can reinstall a computer fairly quickly and actually like a nice clean install now and then so I don't bother backing up config files in general (with a few exceptions). I back up the files that I care about which are mostly stored in a few locations, mostly in my /home/<twowheels> folder. If you're OK with cloud storage (which it seems that you are), it might be sufficient just to save anything that you really care about in a folder that's automatically synced to a cloud storage service, such as Dropbox, Copy.com, etc.

My answer would be (and is) different for mission critical servers at work.

Gregg Bell · 04-21-2014, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twowheels

Linux is no worse in that regard than any other OS, it just happens to be run, in the most part, by people who are more technically savvy and more likely to actually back up their data. Windows & Mac users should also back up their data. These "every 5 minutes" comments are coming from people who have an automated backup system that uses something like rsync to only back up files that have actually changed -- probably not something you care to set up.

As for methods and scope, it really depends on your risk tolerance. I can reinstall a computer fairly quickly and actually like a nice clean install now and then so I don't bother backing up config files in general (with a few exceptions). I back up the files that I care about which are mostly stored in a few locations, mostly in my /home/<twowheels> folder. If you're OK with cloud storage (which it seems that you are), it might be sufficient just to save anything that you really care about in a folder that's automatically synced to a cloud storage service, such as Dropbox, Copy.com, etc.

My answer would be (and is) different for mission critical servers at work.

Thanks for the great advice, twowheels. You saved me from getting in deeper with this backup stuff than I need to be. I already have Google Drive, and I see that they have the automatic syncing so I'll start there. I still have some logistical things to work out. I use two computers (and a laptop) for work just about equally, one at home, one at work. So right now I have mostly the same files in the folders but there are some different files stored in the same folders, as well. An ideal situation would be like yours. For me: home/gregory. But say I'm working on the Documents folder (which would be in the home/gregory folder) at work and then that home/gregory folder is automatically synced on Google Drive. Then I go home and open the Documents folder on my home computer, and is that Documents folder exactly the same as it was on the work computer? It doesn't delete the additional files I might have in the home computer, does it?

Just can't get my head around how the synching works just yet. Will see what I can find.

Thanks again for the great advice.

Just researched Google Drive: no syncing for Linux

Gregg Bell · 04-21-2014, 09:07 PM

I'm getting the notices for the upgrade from Xubuntu 13.10 to 14.04 on my home and work desktops, but nothing on my Xubuntu laptop, which has 12.04. Should I just leave it as is? (I just use it for composing on Libreoffice.) Upgrade it? And if so, how?

twowheels · 04-21-2014, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregg Bell

I'm getting the notices for the upgrade from Xubuntu 13.10 to 14.04 on my home and work desktops, but nothing on my Xubuntu laptop, which has 12.04. Should I just leave it as is? (I just use it for composing on Libreoffice.) Upgrade it? And if so, how?

I would consider updating the 13.10 computer soon as support for 13.10 ends in July, whereas the 12.04 computer has until April 2017 as it's a LTS (long term support) release, so it's not so urgent.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases

Gregg Bell · 04-21-2014, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twowheels

I would consider updating the 13.10 computer soon as support for 13.10 ends in July, whereas the 12.04 computer has until April 2017 as it's a LTS (long term support) release, so it's not so urgent.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases

Thanks, twowheels. Good to know about the laptop, and I will update my desktops when I figure out this automatic syncing. Appreciate it.

Dngrsone · 04-21-2014, 10:19 PM

I wouldn't recommend syncing the entire home folder, because of differences in the three operating systems and such.

I'd back up each home folder, but only synchronize the /home/<user>/Documents folder and other data repositories you use.

PeterT · 04-21-2014, 11:57 PM

I will admit I feel a tad nervous about automated n-way synchronizing the contents of multiple systems.

I can just see some error occurring resulting in the overwriting of the current version of a masterpiece.

Gregg Bell · 04-22-2014, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dngrsone

I wouldn't recommend syncing the entire home folder, because of differences in the three operating systems and such.

I'd back up each home folder, but only synchronize the /home/<user>/Documents folder and other data repositories you use.

Thanks Dngrsone. Excellent suggestion. I never really saw the need for backing up the home folder on a super-regular basis anyway. The key things will be what's in the Documents folder. Appreciate it.

Gregg Bell · 04-22-2014, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterT

I will admit I feel a tad nervous about automated n-way synchronizing the contents of multiple systems.

I can just see some error occurring resulting in the overwriting of the current version of a masterpiece.

Yeah, how about it, I can't deny humanity another masterpiece, now can I?

I'm nervous about this syncing too. It sounds so cool, but yeah, there is the chance of an overwrite. As with all this technology, which tantalizes me, I probably won't be able to leave the syncing alone. I like Dngrsone's suggestion though about just syncing the Documents folder. And I think I'll always keep the novel I'm writing with me on a flash drive and save it on whatever computer I use. (Humanity deserves no less.) Thanks.

eschwartz · 04-22-2014, 10:34 PM

Dropbox is very careful to not overwrite stuff accidentally -- it will save two copies (name-of-pc's conflicted copy on date).

The techy way with personal rsync backups is to do an every-five-minutes snapshot so you can go back in time to any five-minute period. For added paranoia, save this on a remote hosted server, or private website, in addition to having your own computer using a RAID configuration.

Gregg Bell · 04-23-2014, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Dropbox is very careful to not overwrite stuff accidentally -- it will save two copies (name-of-pc's conflicted copy on date).

The techy way with personal rsync backups is to do an every-five-minutes snapshot so you can go back in time to any five-minute period. For added paranoia, save this on a remote hosted server, or private website, in addition to having your own computer using a RAID configuration.

I've read Dropbox is good about not making duplicate copies of stuff too. They just have so little storage and are so expensive if you need to buy more.

Thanks for the explanation about rsync.

It's funny but I've never lost any data just saving stuff to a flash drive (and now I'm becoming psycho about this back-up stuff!).

Oh well. It's good feeling like my stuff is safe too.

Dngrsone · 04-23-2014, 10:08 AM

Keep in mind that Flash drives have a limited number of writes in them-- they will wear out.

Gregg Bell · 04-24-2014, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dngrsone

Keep in mind that Flash drives have a limited number of writes in them-- they will wear out.

Good reminder. Thanks. (I just had one go bad on me not long ago.) Curious, though, what do you mean by a "limited number of writes." Like they will only hold data a certain amount of times?

Dngrsone · 04-24-2014, 12:10 AM

Meaning you can write to a location only so many times. Granted, that number is probably up in the five or six figures, now, but still...

I killed my first thumb drive by running Firefox portable on it with caching enabled-- lasted all of three months, I think. Lucky for me, those things still had lifetime warranties on 'em.

04-21-2014, 06:25 PM	#106
Gregg Bell Gregg Bell Posts: 2,266 Karma: 3917598 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Itasca, Illinois Device: Kindle Touch 7, Sony PRS300, Fire HD8 Tablet	back-up Hey, I keep hearing about the importance of backing up in Linux. It's a little daunting because it makes it seem like my computer's going to crash any second. (One guy said backup every five minutes.) Anyway, eschwartz, I did look at your backup link and it was just way too complicated for me. I just write books and need to back those up. However, people have said I need to back up "configurable" files, as well, and I don't know what configurable files (or folders) are. Some people have said 'Just save home/gregory.' But I saved just the Documents folder (and it wasn't that big) to Google Drive and it took 20 minutes. And I tried but couldn't save the home folder anyway. (Somebody said I needed to be root to do that.) So: 1)what are configurable files/folders and do I need to back them up or can I just back up my writing? 2)I've heard a bunch of people say Grsync is perfect for my needs. 3) I have heard others say Grsync lulls you into a false sense of security that your stuff is being backed up and you're better off just saving to a flash drive. 4) Then there is the cloud drive backup scenario. As mentioned I already have Google Drive, but places like iDrive www.idrive.com/online-backup-features.htm has continuous backup and allows me to have several different computers on one account and allows me to sync the same files I will be working on in three different computers. And Cyphertite, www.cyphertite.com/plans.php which is pretty much the same thing but open source and supposedly has better encryption, but I don't think I can have all three computers on one account. (If I went cloud, I'm leaning toward iDrive.) I know this is a blob of questions, but you guys are so expert at Linux I know you can figure it out easily. Bonus question: Is Sourcefourge no longer reliable for downloading? I've ready nasty things about them bundling malware with their downloads. Thanks guys.

04-21-2014, 09:07 PM	#109
Gregg Bell Gregg Bell Posts: 2,266 Karma: 3917598 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Itasca, Illinois Device: Kindle Touch 7, Sony PRS300, Fire HD8 Tablet	upgrade question I'm getting the notices for the upgrade from Xubuntu 13.10 to 14.04 on my home and work desktops, but nothing on my Xubuntu laptop, which has 12.04. Should I just leave it as is? (I just use it for composing on Libreoffice.) Upgrade it? And if so, how?

04-22-2014, 10:34 PM	#116
eschwartz Ex-Helpdesk Junkie Posts: 19,421 Karma: 85400180 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: The Beaten Path, USA, Roundworld, This Side of Infinity Device: Kindle Touch fw5.3.7 (Wifi only)	Dropbox is very careful to not overwrite stuff accidentally -- it will save two copies (name-of-pc's conflicted copy on date). The techy way with personal rsync backups is to do an every-five-minutes snapshot so you can go back in time to any five-minute period. For added paranoia, save this on a remote hosted server, or private website, in addition to having your own computer using a RAID configuration. Last edited by eschwartz; 04-22-2014 at 10:37 PM.

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04-21-2014, 07:16 PM	#107
twowheels Wizard Posts: 1,854 Karma: 13432974 Join Date: Nov 2010 Device: Kobo Clara HD, iPad Pro 10", iPhone 15 Pro, Boox Note Max	Linux is no worse in that regard than any other OS, it just happens to be run, in the most part, by people who are more technically savvy and more likely to actually back up their data. Windows & Mac users should also back up their data. These "every 5 minutes" comments are coming from people who have an automated backup system that uses something like rsync to only back up files that have actually changed -- probably not something you care to set up. As for methods and scope, it really depends on your risk tolerance. I can reinstall a computer fairly quickly and actually like a nice clean install now and then so I don't bother backing up config files in general (with a few exceptions). I back up the files that I care about which are mostly stored in a few locations, mostly in my /home/<twowheels> folder. If you're OK with cloud storage (which it seems that you are), it might be sufficient just to save anything that you really care about in a folder that's automatically synced to a cloud storage service, such as Dropbox, Copy.com, etc. My answer would be (and is) different for mission critical servers at work.

04-21-2014, 10:19 PM	#112
Dngrsone Almost legible Posts: 1,457 Karma: 4611110 Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: In a high desert, CA Device: Galaxy Note 9, Galaxy Tab A (2017), Likebook P78	I wouldn't recommend syncing the entire home folder, because of differences in the three operating systems and such. I'd back up each home folder, but only synchronize the /home/<user>/Documents folder and other data repositories you use.

04-21-2014, 11:57 PM	#113
PeterT Grand Sorcerer Posts: 13,536 Karma: 78910202 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Toronto Device: Libra H2O, Libra Colour	I will admit I feel a tad nervous about automated n-way synchronizing the contents of multiple systems. I can just see some error occurring resulting in the overwriting of the current version of a masterpiece.

04-23-2014, 10:08 AM	#118
Dngrsone Almost legible Posts: 1,457 Karma: 4611110 Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: In a high desert, CA Device: Galaxy Note 9, Galaxy Tab A (2017), Likebook P78	Keep in mind that Flash drives have a limited number of writes in them-- they will wear out.

04-24-2014, 12:10 AM	#120
Dngrsone Almost legible Posts: 1,457 Karma: 4611110 Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: In a high desert, CA Device: Galaxy Note 9, Galaxy Tab A (2017), Likebook P78	Meaning you can write to a location only so many times. Granted, that number is probably up in the five or six figures, now, but still... I killed my first thumb drive by running Firefox portable on it with caching enabled-- lasted all of three months, I think. Lucky for me, those things still had lifetime warranties on 'em.

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