NAEB/Baen sells Cybook OEM device for US$375

[astra]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

Look at posts 3 and 4. I think what and how the Cybook does is much better than the Sony Reader.

Sorry but I am not convinced. The same sh£t. Pardon my French.
The only reader that can boast a better pdf viewer is iRex which has a real zoom capability and 8.1" screen.
Anyway, just my IMHO.

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by astra_lestat

Sorry but I am not convinced. The same sh£t. Pardon my French.
The only reader that can boast a better pdf viewer is iRex which has a real zoom capability and 8.1" screen.
Anyway, just my IMHO.

I agree that it's not very good yet. But it is Bookeen's first try, and already at least slightly better than Sony. I would bet money that it will improve with the next firmware.

[delphidb96]

Originally Posted by astra_lestat

Sorry but I am not convinced. The same sh£t. Pardon my French.
The only reader that can boast a better pdf viewer is iRex which has a real zoom capability and 8.1" screen.
Anyway, just my IMHO.

Well, pan and zoom for PDFs is on the way for the Cybook, so that problem will go away soon. That leaves screen size-and I agree that a larger screen, such as the one in the iLiad, is better for A4 and larger PDF files. See? Here I am, a happy Cybook and PRS500 owner saying that.

(Of course, every chance I get, I take PDF ebooks apart and convert them into Mobi ebooks. )

Derek

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by delphidb96

Well, pan and zoom for PDFs is on the way for the Cybook, so that problem will go away soon. That leaves screen size-and I agree that a larger screen, such as the one in the iLiad, is better for A4 and larger PDF files. See? Here I am, a happy Cybook and PRS500 owner saying that.

(Of course, every chance I get, I take PDF ebooks apart and convert them into Mobi ebooks. )

Derek

I've been boosting NAEB and the Cybook based on that eventual pan and zoom. I know that I have talked at least 3 people out of a Sony Reader.

[astra]

Originally Posted by delphidb96

Well, pan and zoom for PDFs is on the way for the Cybook, so that problem will go away soon. That leaves screen size-and I agree that a larger screen, such as the one in the iLiad, is better for A4 and larger PDF files. See? Here I am, a happy Cybook and PRS500 owner saying that.

(Of course, every chance I get, I take PDF ebooks apart and convert them into Mobi ebooks. )

Derek

Look, I am not trying to say Gen3 is worse.
Honestly.

There is one thing I really like about it - HTML support. I wish Sony did it..

However, PDF....no zoom is going to make it nice on 6". It has nothing to do with any brand or make or whatever.

[astra]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

I've been boosting NAEB and the Cybook based on that eventual pan and zoom. I know that I have talked at least 3 people out of a Sony Reader.

I think I managed to convince 1 person for Sony


Well, I gave him as much info as I could and sent him here and to e-book.org. Up to him to decide. He decided he wants Sony.

[IreneDelse]

Originally Posted by astra_lestat

Sorry but I am not convinced. The same sh£t. Pardon my French.

You know, that's pretty ironic, considering Bookeen's nationality.

[astra]

Originally Posted by IreneDelse

You know, that's pretty ironic, considering Bookeen's nationality.

Now I feel embaraced.
I hope.....it is not offensive for French? Otherwise I will edit it.

[porkupan]

Originally Posted by Nate the great

I've been boosting NAEB and the Cybook based on that eventual pan and zoom. I know that I have talked at least 3 people out of a Sony Reader.

Well, Nate, you've been around for a while, so it surprises me that you put so much weight into a manufacturer's announced willingness to extend the capabilities of a product. It's quite possible that Bookeen will follow up on their intent and fix up all the stuff they say they will fix up. But making this stated intent a basis for purchasing decisions... isn't it a bit naive?

The way the consumer electronic manufacturing world works seems to point in the opposite direction. Once the product has been released, 90% of the resources are immediately pulled out, the ones left directed to concentrate on small bug fixes and DRM improvements. The major resources are thrown into the next generation, whenever that may come out.

In theory Sony could add all the same features and more to their devices. The could add text search, better PDF support, ability to delete books, pan and zoom in PDF, etc. etc. But they haven't, because they figured the device was good enough as it was. The only reason Bookeen may be any better is that they seem to be a much smaller company, ebook readers being their major business.

Now, ergonomically Sony Reader 505 seems to be much better than Cybook. That was the agreement of the two Russian guys who had a chance compare the two. They also agreed that the manufacturing quality of the Sony Reader was obviously significantly better. Software wise, the 30+ second Cybook startup doesn't compare well with instant-on, offered by the Sony Reader (even if not from complete shutdown, but from "sleep" low power mode). The PDF reader in Cybook is not better now (it may be better in the future, but this is just speculation). But for reading non-technical, non-PDF literature (fiction, etc.) the Reader is already equipped just as well of better than Cybook, and will probably stay so.

[Nate the great]

Originally Posted by porkupan

Well, Nate, you've been around for a while, so it surprises me that you put so much weight into a manufacturer's announced willingness to extend the capabilities of a product. It's quite possible that Bookeen will follow up on their intent and fix up all the stuff they say they will fix up. But making this stated intent a basis for purchasing decisions... isn't it a bit naive?

The way the consumer electronic manufacturing world works seems to point in the opposite direction. Once the product has been released, 90% of the resources are immediately pulled out, the ones left directed to concentrate on small bug fixes and DRM improvements. The major resources are thrown into the next generation, whenever that may come out.

In theory Sony could add all the same features and more to their devices. The could add text search, better PDF support, ability to delete books, pan and zoom in PDF, etc. etc. But they haven't, because they figured the device was good enough as it was. The only reason Bookeen may be any better is that they seem to be a much smaller company, ebook readers being their major business.

Now, ergonomically Sony Reader 505 seems to be much better than Cybook. That was the agreement of the two Russian guys who had a chance compare the two. They also agreed that the manufacturing quality of the Sony Reader was obviously significantly better. Software wise, the 30+ second Cybook startup doesn't compare well with instant-on, offered by the Sony Reader (even if not from complete shutdown, but from "sleep" low power mode). The PDF reader in Cybook is not better now (it may be better in the future, but this is just speculation). But for reading non-technical, non-PDF literature (fiction, etc.) the Reader is already equipped just as well of better than Cybook, and will probably stay so.

Perhaps it is. But my gut instinct says that the Cybook will get better than the Sony Reader. I also believe, based on the reviews here, that it is the equal of the 505 now.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by porkupan

Now, ergonomically Sony Reader 505 seems to be much better than Cybook. That was the agreement of the two Russian guys who had a chance compare the two. They also agreed that the manufacturing quality of the Sony Reader was obviously significantly better. Software wise, the 30+ second Cybook startup doesn't compare well with instant-on, offered by the Sony Reader (even if not from complete shutdown, but from "sleep" low power mode). The PDF reader in Cybook is not better now (it may be better in the future, but this is just speculation). But for reading non-technical, non-PDF literature (fiction, etc.) the Reader is already equipped just as well of better than Cybook, and will probably stay so.

Why was 505 ergonomically better? And how do you tell that the manufacturing quality is better? I do not turn my Cybook off so there is no delay in starting reading.

For reading fiction the Cybook is for me much better since it supports dictionary lookup and it will probably stay better in the future also. It is also lighter so ergonomically it is better.

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by porkupan

The way the consumer electronic manufacturing world works seems to point in the opposite direction. Once the product has been released, 90% of the resources are immediately pulled out, the ones left directed to concentrate on small bug fixes and DRM improvements. The major resources are thrown into the next generation, whenever that may come out.

This certainly describes Sony's approach to e-book readers. Bookeen might be different because (a) their only business is e-books and (b) their next generation device is likely to be Vizplex with a larger screen (so most of the software may apply to both devices).

[JSWolf]

Of course, the 505 is supposed to have Adobe Digital Editions sometime in 2008. And for all we know, the PDF reading may end up being improved as well. I think it's a wait and see. You don't know what's what for either device based on speculation and that's all it so right now for both the Gen3 and the 505. Plus, you cannot be sure of what Bookeen or Sony will do in the future when newer screens are released. All I know is you have the 505 as it is now and you have the Gen3 as it is now. What I say is the 505 has some of the better tools for content creations/conversion.

[Alisa]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Of course, the 505 is supposed to have Adobe Digital Editions sometime in 2008. And for all we know, the PDF reading may end up being improved as well. I think it's a wait and see. You don't know what's what for either device based on speculation and that's all it so right now for both the Gen3 and the 505. Plus, you cannot be sure of what Bookeen or Sony will do in the future when newer screens are released. All I know is you have the 505 as it is now and you have the Gen3 as it is now. What I say is the 505 has some of the better tools for content creations/conversion.

Well you just had to go and make my life harder, didn't you? The main draw of the Cybook for me is Mobipocket but I would also love to have something that can read the ADE books from Overdrive. They have more ADE than Mobi, actually. Not to mention the 505 is really gorgeous. I popped into a SonyStyle store this weekend just to take a peek at it and it has a fantastic look and feel. I wish Amazon would throw us a bone and let us know if their books are going to be locked down to the Kindle or not.

[porkupan]

Originally Posted by tompe

Why was 505 ergonomically better? And how do you tell that the manufacturing quality is better? I do not turn my Cybook off so there is no delay in starting reading.

For reading fiction the Cybook is for me much better since it supports dictionary lookup and it will probably stay better in the future also. It is also lighter so ergonomically it is better.

Well, I am not going to argue that for you Cybook may be better. I know quite a few people who swear the Hanlin Jinke ebook is the best, while others keep complaining about the poor quality of manufacturing. So, the better-worse comparisons are very subjective, often what one thinks is better has to do with the money already spent on a certain device. I can only relate what I read.

The look-and-feel. Supposedly, the exterior of the Cybook reader just feels cheaper (black plastic vs metal in case of Sony), the controls are more ergonomically located in the Sony Reader (paging on both the right-hand side and the left-hand side), the connector plugs located inconveniently, only charges via USB - that sort of thing. Being lighter is better? How much lighter - would you be able to feel the difference? But if you like your Cybook as is, it's great, I am glad you do.

Lots of software already out there for Sony - to convert from every possible format.

And the fact that you don't turn it off shows that you don't travel much with your new ebook reader. Or you would be surprised to find your Cybook always on a new unexpected page when you take it out of your bag or your pocket. So, you will probably end up turning it off anyway, and then waiting for it to start up when you want to read it.

But the dictionary lookup feature is a clear advantage, I agree. Not very important for many of us, but very important for the others. Just like text search - I would love to have it, but the others don't care.