How Long Should Copyright Last? - Page 7

pietrocrazy · 03-09-2011, 06:24 PM

I wonder, does anyone agree with the current law regarding copyright term - author's life + 70 years?

I voted 10-20 years with renewal, but I can see the other options being valid, up to and including the author's life or the author's life and surviving spouse's life. But life + 70 is outrageous in my opinion.

Hamlet53 · 03-09-2011, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pietrocrazy

I wonder, does anyone agree with the current law regarding copyright term - author's life + 70 years?

I voted 10-20 years with renewal, but I can see the other options being valid, up to and including the author's life or the author's life and surviving spouse's life. But life + 70 is outrageous in my opinion.

I agree that the author's lifetime + 70 years is very excessive. When I first saw this poll I was thinking author's lifetime, but the more thought I have given the better I like the idea of 10-20 years with renewal for a similar term each time the original author requests it. This still gives the author the option of lifetime + up to 10-20 years, but not beyond that. And it prevents titles being in apparent abandoned status for excessive lengths of time.

My primary objection to the current copyright is consideration of all the titles in America that will likely never make it into [legal] ebook form.

pietrocrazy · 03-09-2011, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hamlet53

My primary objection to the current copyright is consideration of all the titles in America that will likely never make it into [legal] ebook form.

This is probably the single biggest problem with copyright as it stands. Something like 95% of all books are out-of-print. Only the most popular or most recent books are available to buy print editions of (not including used books, of course). In the future, with most books being released in ebook format as well as print, this will change. But what about the gigantic back catalog of books that are out of print but won't be in the public domain for another 50-100 years? Society is really losing out by not having access to these books!

Giggleton · 03-09-2011, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pietrocrazy

This is probably the single biggest problem with copyright as it stands. Something like 95% of all books are out-of-print. Only the most popular or most recent books are available to buy print editions of (not including used books, of course). In the future, with most books being released in ebook format as well as print, this will change. But what about the gigantic back catalog of books that are out of print but won't be in the public domain for another 50-100 years? Society is really losing out by not having access to these books!

Once Google gets all the books scanned, I expect they will then be hacked into and all the books will then be uploaded as torrent files to the lightnet.

Hellmark · 03-09-2011, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giggleton

Once Google gets all the books scanned, I expect they will then be hacked into and all the books will then be uploaded as torrent files to the lightnet.

Heh, wouldn't it be funny if they were put on a random server at google that held only copies of the orphaned works, and the id was something like admin and password for the password. Basically, begging for people to log in, and copy the stuff?

pietrocrazy · 03-09-2011, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giggleton

Once Google gets all the books scanned, I expect they will then be hacked into and all the books will then be uploaded as torrent files to the lightnet.

Is Google scanning all books? I thought it was just older, lesser-used public domain stuff, but then again I haven't been paying much attention. I'm glad to hear that.

tompe · 03-09-2011, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sircastor

In modern western society, we define property as being a natural right.

No we do not.

The laws define what is property.

Giggleton · 03-09-2011, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pietrocrazy

Is Google scanning all books? I thought it was just older, lesser-used public domain stuff, but then again I haven't been paying much attention. I'm glad to hear that.

They're trying, got about 10% so far, the next 95% will probably take about ten years, then like ten years to track down the last 5%.

Hopefully by that time strong AI will have been developed and it will be robust enough to understand all the books.

Wuyouyuan · 03-10-2011, 01:41 AM

The Founding Fathers defined a 15 years copyright, with an additional 15 years if the publisher ask for it and the book is still in print. It seems to me a fair compromise. And if the author or publisher want a longer protection, they must make a new or improved book from the first text. Think of the actual law in France 70 years after author death: Levi Strauss famous book "Tristes tropiques" written 1955, the author died 2010, 100 years old; copyright to 2080, 125 years !

tubemonkey · 03-10-2011, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pietrocrazy

But life + 70 is outrageous in my opinion.

I agree; it should be life + infinity.

pdurrant · 03-10-2011, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

I agree; it should be life + infinity.

I thought your position was for a fixed length but an unlimited number of renewals?

BuddyBoy · 03-10-2011, 07:13 AM

I select 20-30, but for some reason I've often felt 40 years was a sweet spot. Like the old 20+20, but without the need to register. Copyright date + 40 years. New editions treated as new titles.

40 years seems like a fair period to earn royalties off your work - more than twice the time given to patents. A 25 year old author will still be raking it in at 65, and has had 40 years to do as the rest of us workers do (or do not) and put something aside for retirement.

The life+70 nonsense is all about corporate copyrights, which, in my opinion, do the exact opposite of the copyright's intention: to encourage creativity by giving the author an exclusive license to their works for a period of time. The current model discourages creativity since corporations will just keep creating "me too" spinoffs and derivatives of existing work. I mean, really, how many great Disney creations have we seen in the last 20 years that weren't originated by Pixar, a company without an 80 year "vault"?

Not only is Disney sure to try for life+80 in another 10 years, but they've already tried to get perpetual copyright on Mickey Mouse and friends because they are "American Icons."

tubemonkey · 03-10-2011, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

I thought your position was for a fixed length but an unlimited number of renewals?

They're essentially the same. I've always favored a renewal system to prevent orphaned works from falling by the wayside.

pdurrant · 03-10-2011, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubemonkey

They're essentially the same. I've always favored a renewal system to prevent orphaned works from falling by the wayside.

I feel there's an enormous difference between automatic perpetual copyright, and a limited fixed copyright only extended by registration and renewals.

Hellmark · 03-10-2011, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuddyBoy

I mean, really, how many great Disney creations have we seen in the last 20 years that weren't originated by Pixar, a company without an 80 year "vault"?

You mean works that weren't based on something else? Uhm... Darkwing Duck? Even still, that had Launchpad McQuack from Duck Tales, which that was based on the characters of Scrooge McDuck and Huey, Louie, and Dewey.

View Poll Results: How Long Should Copyright Last?
In Perpetuity	7	3.66%
50+ Years	32	16.75%
20-30 Years	50	26.18%
10-20 Years	33	17.28%
10-20 Years with renewal option for 10-20 more	45	23.56%
25 Years with option for public referendum to nullify	4	2.09%
10 Years with option for public referendum to nullify	15	7.85%
What's Copyright?	5	2.62%
Voters: 191. You may not vote on this poll

03-10-2011, 01:41 AM	#99
Wuyouyuan Junior Member Posts: 9 Karma: 10 Join Date: Mar 2011 Device: Sony Reader PRS650	Return to ancien law The Founding Fathers defined a 15 years copyright, with an additional 15 years if the publisher ask for it and the book is still in print. It seems to me a fair compromise. And if the author or publisher want a longer protection, they must make a new or improved book from the first text. Think of the actual law in France 70 years after author death: Levi Strauss famous book "Tristes tropiques" written 1955, the author died 2010, 100 years old; copyright to 2080, 125 years !

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03-09-2011, 06:24 PM	#91
pietrocrazy Connoisseur Posts: 74 Karma: 706 Join Date: Feb 2011 Device: Kindle	I wonder, does anyone agree with the current law regarding copyright term - author's life + 70 years? I voted 10-20 years with renewal, but I can see the other options being valid, up to and including the author's life or the author's life and surviving spouse's life. But life + 70 is outrageous in my opinion.

03-10-2011, 07:13 AM	#102
BuddyBoy eBookin' Fool Posts: 310 Karma: 1008360 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Vancouver, BC Device: Kindle Paperwhite, KK, iPad (Ex Prs 505, 500, Reb1100-2150, Rocket)	I select 20-30, but for some reason I've often felt 40 years was a sweet spot. Like the old 20+20, but without the need to register. Copyright date + 40 years. New editions treated as new titles. 40 years seems like a fair period to earn royalties off your work - more than twice the time given to patents. A 25 year old author will still be raking it in at 65, and has had 40 years to do as the rest of us workers do (or do not) and put something aside for retirement. The life+70 nonsense is all about corporate copyrights, which, in my opinion, do the exact opposite of the copyright's intention: to encourage creativity by giving the author an exclusive license to their works for a period of time. The current model discourages creativity since corporations will just keep creating "me too" spinoffs and derivatives of existing work. I mean, really, how many great Disney creations have we seen in the last 20 years that weren't originated by Pixar, a company without an 80 year "vault"? Not only is Disney sure to try for life+80 in another 10 years, but they've already tried to get perpetual copyright on Mickey Mouse and friends because they are "American Icons."

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