Silliness So what are you doing RIGHT NOW? - Page 555

Patricia · 09-30-2009, 03:29 PM

And here's a link from a UK government website explaining the distinction:
http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg...mId=1073792180

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patricia

And here's a link from a UK government website explaining the distinction:
http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg...mId=1073792180

that's very helpful. i wish i could give "estimates" but all my devis are considered "quotations", which sometimes works against me when a client turns out to be more difficult than expected...

Patricia · 09-30-2009, 03:32 PM

The link I cited has some advice:

Quote:

You can also specify in the quotation precisely what it covers, and that variations outside of this will be subject to additional charges.

(Oh dear. This thread is labelled as silly. Someone is going to complain about our seriousness before too long.)

ShortNCuddlyAm · 09-30-2009, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

that's very helpful. i wish i could give "estimates" but all my devis are considered "quotations", which sometimes works against me when a client turns out to be more difficult than expected...

Could you give a quote for the work, with the proviso that it doesn't go over n hours, then an hourly rate if it does?

Sparrow · 09-30-2009, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patricia

(Oh dear. This thread is labelled as silly. Someone is going to complain about our seriousness before too long.)

And you're both mods!!

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patricia

The link I cited has some advice:

Quote:

You can also specify in the quotation precisely what it covers, and that variations outside of this will be subject to additional charges.

yep, that's what i usually try to do. but sometimes you end up spending days and days and days (and weeks and months...) on just a few details.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShortNCuddlyAm

Could you give a quote for the work, with the proviso that it doesn't go over n hours, then an hourly rate if it does?

i had one client who used to hire me regularly and i knew in advance every project with them would be like that, they were infernal. i tried giving them higher quotes to start with (i considered it an "aggravation tax"

) but of course they always tried to negotiate the price down anyway (i think what they really would have liked is if i paid them, for the privilege of doing the work.

). finally one day i put a clause in that the quote covered only 3 versions, and any further modifications would be billed on an hourly basis. that really didn't go over well.

Quote:

(Oh dear. This thread is labelled as silly. Someone is going to complain about our seriousness before too long.)

we need a few lolpandas.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparrow

And you're both mods!!

i know.

i'm so ashamed. we're a bad influence aren't we ?

ShortNCuddlyAm · 09-30-2009, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

i know.

i'm so ashamed. we're a bad influence aren't we ?

Carry on like this and the whole place will go serious, and then where will we be???

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShortNCuddlyAm

Carry on like this and the whole place will go serious, and then where will we be???

oh my god i think that would be the END OF THE WORLD !!! don't even joke about that !!!

vivaldirules · 09-30-2009, 04:16 PM

I write quotations

(or quotes) for proposed work

which become agreements upon signing.

I always quote that if the work will take less, then the

blinkin' customer

will only be charged for what was needed. If it takes more, then the

rat

will be charged more but only up to 10% over the quoted price. It might sound that all customers get charged the extra 10% but to keep my reputation, I actually try to come in slightly under my quoted price.

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 04:17 PM

thanks

vr

!!

pilotbob · 09-30-2009, 04:31 PM

Zelda... quote / estimate is pretty much the same, at least here to me.

Usually the document will state something like:

This is a flat rate quote to complete the work specified no matter how long the work takes. Any changes to the specifications or requirements will require this quote to be adjusted.

or

This quote is an estimate based on the current understanding of the provided specifications. However, work will be billed for actually time worked based on an hourly rate of $xxx.xx.

To confuse things even more, many times a quote contains an estimated time to complete.

BTW: I see very little work done in the computer industry on a flat rate project price these days. Which is why I think the word "Estimate" is used to make it very clear.

BOb

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 04:43 PM

thanks bob. this is actually a question for a developper, he's making a quote / estimate for a job with specific parameters and he knows how much time he'll need to code each module, so the work won't take longer unless there are additional modules which aren't planned yet, in which case they will be billed as a supplement.

here when i do a project, i don't think i could get away with saying "here's a reasonable estimate, but i'll charge you by the day for *every* day i work, so every additional version will cost you more money" just because even good clients want to plan the cost down to the penny and telling them "it might cost a lot more" would really not go over well. instead i try to plan slightly over the time i think i'll need for each step because i know there will always be a bit of back and forth (usually. i do have the occasional wonderful client who sees the first proposal and says "perfect ! yes ! do it just like that, don't change a thing"). and then there is the case of a client who gives you a very specific brief, and you do exactly what they asked, and it turns out they didn't actually want what they *said* they wanted, but something completely different.

i love those ones.

pshrynk · 09-30-2009, 04:54 PM

Sitting here wondering what I'll find upon going home.

zelda_pinwheel · 09-30-2009, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pshrynk

Sitting here wondering what I'll fund upon going home.

thanks pshrynk for rescuing us from an overload of seriousness !!!

vivaldirules · 09-30-2009, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelda_pinwheel

i love w***.

Jocularity!

(If we don't start cleaning up this thread, they're gonna send in the guys with firehoses soon and clean it up for us.)

09-30-2009, 03:29 PM	#8311
Patricia Reader Posts: 11,504 Karma: 8720163 Join Date: May 2007 Location: South Wales, UK Device: Sony PRS-500, PRS-505, Asus EEEpc 4G	And here's a link from a UK government website explaining the distinction: http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg...mId=1073792180

09-30-2009, 04:16 PM	#8319
vivaldirules When's Doughnut Day? Posts: 10,059 Karma: 13675475 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Houston, TX, US Device: Sony PRS-505, iPad	I write quotations (or quotes) for proposed work which become agreements upon signing. I always quote that if the work will take less, then the blinkin' customer will only be charged for what was needed. If it takes more, then the rat will be charged more but only up to 10% over the quoted price. It might sound that all customers get charged the extra 10% but to keep my reputation, I actually try to come in slightly under my quoted price.

09-30-2009, 04:17 PM	#8320
zelda_pinwheel zeldinha zippy zeldissima Posts: 27,827 Karma: 921169 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Paris, France Device: eb1150 & is that a nook in her pocket, or she just happy to see you?	thanks vr !!

09-30-2009, 04:31 PM	#8321
pilotbob Grand Sorcerer Posts: 19,832 Karma: 11844413 Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Tampa, FL USA Device: Kindle Touch	Zelda... quote / estimate is pretty much the same, at least here to me. Usually the document will state something like: This is a flat rate quote to complete the work specified no matter how long the work takes. Any changes to the specifications or requirements will require this quote to be adjusted. or This quote is an estimate based on the current understanding of the provided specifications. However, work will be billed for actually time worked based on an hourly rate of $xxx.xx. To confuse things even more, many times a quote contains an estimated time to complete. BTW: I see very little work done in the computer industry on a flat rate project price these days. Which is why I think the word "Estimate" is used to make it very clear. BOb

09-30-2009, 04:43 PM	#8322
zelda_pinwheel zeldinha zippy zeldissima Posts: 27,827 Karma: 921169 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Paris, France Device: eb1150 & is that a nook in her pocket, or she just happy to see you?	thanks bob. this is actually a question for a developper, he's making a quote / estimate for a job with specific parameters and he knows how much time he'll need to code each module, so the work won't take longer unless there are additional modules which aren't planned yet, in which case they will be billed as a supplement. here when i do a project, i don't think i could get away with saying "here's a reasonable estimate, but i'll charge you by the day for every day i work, so every additional version will cost you more money" just because even good clients want to plan the cost down to the penny and telling them "it might cost a lot more" would really not go over well. instead i try to plan slightly over the time i think i'll need for each step because i know there will always be a bit of back and forth (usually. i do have the occasional wonderful client who sees the first proposal and says "perfect ! yes ! do it just like that, don't change a thing"). and then there is the case of a client who gives you a very specific brief, and you do exactly what they asked, and it turns out they didn't actually want what they said they wanted, but something completely different. i love those ones.

09-30-2009, 04:54 PM	#8323
pshrynk Beepbeep n beebeep, yeah! Posts: 11,726 Karma: 8255450 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: La Crosse, Wisconsin, aka America's IceBox Device: iThingie, KmkII, I miss Zelda!	Sitting here wondering what I'll find upon going home.